The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ss...iocra.html

(06-07-2016 04:09 PM)Hiller4Hyz09 Wrote:  http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ss...iocra.html

Crews will quickly learn what actors like Clooney and Schwartzenager learned. When you involve yourself in politics you risk losing 1/2 your fan base. Crews would be best to stay out of politics.

Letterman and Colber tanked because they were too political. Leno, Kimmel, and Fallon are equal opportunity and their ratings show.

(06-07-2016 08:45 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(06-07-2016 04:09 PM)Hiller4Hyz09 Wrote:  http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ss...iocra.html

Crews will quickly learn what actors like Clooney and Schwartzenager learned. When you involve yourself in politics you risk losing 1/2 your fan base. Crews would be best to stay out of politics.

Letterman and Colber tanked because they were too political. Leno, Kimmel, and Fallon are equal opportunity and their ratings show.

The Michael Jordan approach to staying popular .

(05-09-2016 08:18 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(05-09-2016 06:34 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(05-08-2016 07:59 PM)Dirty Ernie Wrote:  Heard some interesting commentary yesterday as to what forms the basis of a political party. As recently, republican conservatives sort of based on a vision of moral standards much like a church. Similar, democrats claiming to represent the downtrodden and take care of them, sort of like a daddy or a union.

This new proposed viewpoint speculates other bases could be possible. For example you could say our new president could have skills with innovation, say like a Mark Zuckerburg. Other points of focus would be easy to find. Maybe our government should be trending to a brave new world, not backward looking to strict constructionism. Might be time to move on to fresher methods and outlooks.

The existing cadre of republican conservative may be outdated, yesterday's news. The old schtick about abortion, gay marriage, drug testing, taxes, etc. may not cut it anymore. The political scene is undergoing a massive upheaval.

I could not disagree with you more. To the contrary, it is the "progressive " movement away from limited government, constitutionalism, and fewer enterprise, and toward political correctness which has destroyed our economy and way of life. America used to be the envy of the world, but somehow liberals turned that into a bad thing, and insisted that we instead follow what they do in other "progressive" countries. Moreover, our government now needs to become a morality enforcement organization, and take over the functions of charities, apparently because we think our government is so good at these types of things.

I don't care about "social" issues much. They are a red herring as far as I am concerned. Individual rights should apply, and be applied to all. Republicans contradict themselves as a party when they fight against gay rights, for example.

The Constitution is the great book of wisdom, if you will, and if it is followed, without bastardization, and in a way which is consistent with the intention of its drafters, we will survive, and indeed flourish.

The controlling wings of both the Democrat and Republican Parties favor forceful, authoritative, big government control.

Between the left's ridiculous and arbitrary insistence on speech codes and "safe places" and the right's attempts to mandate religion (religion is wonderful, but government shouldn't choose between Catholics, Jews, Methodists, Baptists, Christian Reformed, Lutherans, etc, etc. and some of these people just do not get that) and the general population is turned off.

I agree with Chipdip to some extent. Folks are voting for Trump as a way of giving the proverbial finger to the SOB's that control the GOP. Likewise, that is why Sanders is so popular with Democrats.

Neither party is remotely trusted anymore and that has led to two of the most reviled, and rightfully disrespected, presidential candidates in our nation's history.

(06-08-2016 10:09 AM)CMichFan Wrote:  

(05-09-2016 08:18 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(05-09-2016 06:34 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(05-08-2016 07:59 PM)Dirty Ernie Wrote:  Heard some interesting commentary yesterday as to what forms the basis of a political party. As recently, republican conservatives sort of based on a vision of moral standards much like a church. Similar, democrats claiming to represent the downtrodden and take care of them, sort of like a daddy or a union.

This new proposed viewpoint speculates other bases could be possible. For example you could say our new president could have skills with innovation, say like a Mark Zuckerburg. Other points of focus would be easy to find. Maybe our government should be trending to a brave new world, not backward looking to strict constructionism. Might be time to move on to fresher methods and outlooks.

The existing cadre of republican conservative may be outdated, yesterday's news. The old schtick about abortion, gay marriage, drug testing, taxes, etc. may not cut it anymore. The political scene is undergoing a massive upheaval.

I could not disagree with you more. To the contrary, it is the "progressive " movement away from limited government, constitutionalism, and fewer enterprise, and toward political correctness which has destroyed our economy and way of life. America used to be the envy of the world, but somehow liberals turned that into a bad thing, and insisted that we instead follow what they do in other "progressive" countries. Moreover, our government now needs to become a morality enforcement organization, and take over the functions of charities, apparently because we think our government is so good at these types of things.

I don't care about "social" issues much. They are a red herring as far as I am concerned. Individual rights should apply, and be applied to all. Republicans contradict themselves as a party when they fight against gay rights, for example.

The Constitution is the great book of wisdom, if you will, and if it is followed, without bastardization, and in a way which is consistent with the intention of its drafters, we will survive, and indeed flourish.

The controlling wings of both the Democrat and Republican Parties favor forceful, authoritative, big government control.

Between the left's ridiculous and arbitrary insistence on speech codes and "safe places" and the right's attempts to mandate religion (religion is wonderful, but government shouldn't choose between Catholics, Jews, Methodists, Baptists, Christian Reformed, Lutherans, etc, etc. and some of these people just do not get that) and the general population is turned off.

I agree with Chipdip to some extent. Folks are voting for Trump as a way of giving the proverbial finger to the SOB's that control the GOP. Likewise, that is why Sanders is so popular with Democrats.

Neither party is remotely trusted anymore and that has led to two of the most reviled, and rightfully disrespected, presidential candidates in our nation's history.

Preach it, brother!

Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

He owns the pothead vote

(06-14-2016 11:36 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

He owns the pothead vote

Tried it but didn't like it, LOL.

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

(06-15-2016 09:34 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

I view Biden as kind of the Democrat version of Dan Quayle. OK as VP, but in office?

My ideal race would have been Kasich v. Sanders. I could have lived with either in office. Instead, we have two that make me want to

(06-15-2016 02:43 PM)CMichFan Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 09:34 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

I view Biden as kind of the Democrat version of Dan Quayle. OK as VP, but in office?

My ideal race would have been Kasich v. Sanders. I could have lived with either in office. Instead, we have two that make me want to

William F. Buckley, Jr. once said in a primary he votes for "...the most Conservative candidate who can win in the general election."

That's why I voted for Kasich in the primary. He would smoke Clinton (or Sanders) and help Republicans running for House, Senate and Governor.

I agree with your thoughts about Biden. He's a tool. However, he's not a crazy man or a criminal like Trump and Clinton.

Biden is another sickle and hammer socialist. As is Clinton. As is Trump (don't let him fool you). As is kasich (to a lesser extent, but he still is one who thinks that government fixes all problems, creates jobs, and should provide social health care).

We need someone who gets it. But we won't have that untill the citizens of our once proud and prosperous country get it.

Who is John Galt?

Would not be shocked to see Mitt get into the race as a 3rd party candidate. Far better than the Don or Billary.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.breitbart...-run/amp/#

I suspect that if the rate of international terrorism and national violence continues, that the Don will be elected prez. His message of being the "law and order" candidate will resonate with a scared population regardless of how shallow that massage might be. And let me confirm that the population should be scared.

His blaming of leadership (read Obama) for violence may come back to bite him if he becomes prez, because when it happens under his watch, and it will, who do you blame then?

I see in Cleveland that the prez of the police officers union is asking John Kasich to suspend Ohio's open carry law during the RNC convention. Kasich replied that is outside of his legal power to do so, and would likely be unconstitutional. Union's reply: do it anyhow. That's the thing about the constitution, you can't just apply it when it's convenient.

Quote:Kasich responded Sunday to a request by the Cleveland police union president for the suspension of the law during the Republican National Convention, which begins Monday.
The request by union president Steve Loomis followed Sunday morning's fatal shooting of three police officers in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.
Kasich says Ohio governors don't have the power to arbitrarily suspend federal and state constitutional rights or laws.

http://www.fredericksburg.com/news/news-...f5316.html

The Donald is getting my vote. Crooked Hillary would mean four more years of Obama. I hope Pence can teach Trump a thing or two about politics. That 60 minutes interview last night was terrible. I want to hear some solutions. Sick of the name calling.

(06-15-2016 03:08 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 02:43 PM)CMichFan Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 09:34 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

I view Biden as kind of the Democrat version of Dan Quayle. OK as VP, but in office?

My ideal race would have been Kasich v. Sanders. I could have lived with either in office. Instead, we have two that make me want to

William F. Buckley, Jr. once said in a primary he votes for "...the most Conservative candidate who can win in the general election."

That's why I voted for Kasich in the primary. He would smoke Clinton (or Sanders) and help Republicans running for House, Senate and Governor.

I agree with your thoughts about Biden. He's a tool. However, he's not a crazy man or a criminal like Trump and Clinton.

Why do you think Kasich could win a general election against Hillary when he couldn't win his own parities nomination? Because of some random polls? If so, where were those people come the primary elections?

I understand the sentiment that Kasich may have a better temperament (one opinion), has experience on how to handle the Hill (Congress not old piano legs) and as an executive (Ohio) has a track record. But he was crushed in primaries when everyone who voted knew those facts. So why would it be any different against Hill (Ole Piano legs!)?

(07-18-2016 12:42 PM)gobaseline Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 03:08 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 02:43 PM)CMichFan Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 09:34 AM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

I view Biden as kind of the Democrat version of Dan Quayle. OK as VP, but in office?

My ideal race would have been Kasich v. Sanders. I could have lived with either in office. Instead, we have two that make me want to

William F. Buckley, Jr. once said in a primary he votes for "...the most Conservative candidate who can win in the general election."

That's why I voted for Kasich in the primary. He would smoke Clinton (or Sanders) and help Republicans running for House, Senate and Governor.

I agree with your thoughts about Biden. He's a tool. However, he's not a crazy man or a criminal like Trump and Clinton.

Why do you think Kasich could win a general election against Hillary when he couldn't win his own parities nomination? Because of some random polls? If so, where were those people come the primary elections?

I understand the sentiment that Kasich may have a better temperament (one opinion), has experience on how to handle the Hill (Congress not old piano legs) and as an executive (Ohio) has a track record. But he was crushed in primaries when everyone who voted knew those facts. So why would it be any different against Hill (Ole Piano legs!)?

You raise some good points. However, a party primary is a v-e-r-y small selection of voters and pretty much leaves out Independents and potential, if not likely, cross-over Democrats/Republicans.

There are more Independents then either R's or D's (http://www.gallup.com/poll/188096/democr...-lows.aspx) and history shows the party that can claim the majority of them, while maintaining its base, wins the election.

Just do the math as to how you get to 50 percent +1 for the electoral college. It can't be done without Independent voters.

Kasich was the Republican's best option to secure Independents, plus he definitely would have had significant Democrat cross-over (most Dem's opinion of Hillary mirror's Republicans, just like most Republicans despise Trump - I know a former Ohio GOP State Rep and current GOP official who is reluctantly voting for Clinton).

As Buckley said: vote for the most conservative candidate in the primary WHO CAN WIN the general election.

If you can't win, you become irrelevant, regardless of the merits of your positions. Ask Mitt Romey or Al Gore.

(06-15-2016 08:47 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(06-14-2016 09:20 PM)BCBronco Wrote:  Was rather surprised to see that Libertarian presidential candidate Gary Johnson has 9 percent in the most recent national poll. I'm not a presidential poll historian, but that seems higher than a typical 3rd party candidate (except for Ross Perot). I may have to look at his platform.

This would be a good year to vote libertarian, but unfortunately Gary Johnson is a very lousy candidate, and not realy libertarian at all. This is destined to be the absolute worst election ever; unless third party candidates come along to save the day. I would love if both a genuine constitutional conservative, without religious right social agendas, ran, and Bernie also ran as a third party, thus making the race wide open. I just would kick myself if Bernie won. Lol.

Johnson is not a hard line libertarian but he's a LOT closer to what you describe than anyone else running.

(07-18-2016 02:15 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 12:42 PM)gobaseline Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 03:08 PM)GullLake Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 02:43 PM)CMichFan Wrote:  

(06-15-2016 09:34 AM)GullLake Wrote:  If Clinton is indited prior to the Democrat convention (very possible), the rules would allow for another Democrat nominee. It would likely be Biden. If it is, Trump is done, particularly if Biden takes a moderate Republican as his VP nominee (unlikely, but possible).

The only thing making Trump a viable candidate is Clinton.

I'm no fan of Biden (far too liberal for me), but he is not a sleeze-ball ethically like Clinton and Trump, or a nut-job extremist like Sanders.

I view Biden as kind of the Democrat version of Dan Quayle. OK as VP, but in office?

My ideal race would have been Kasich v. Sanders. I could have lived with either in office. Instead, we have two that make me want to

William F. Buckley, Jr. once said in a primary he votes for "...the most Conservative candidate who can win in the general election."

That's why I voted for Kasich in the primary. He would smoke Clinton (or Sanders) and help Republicans running for House, Senate and Governor.

I agree with your thoughts about Biden. He's a tool. However, he's not a crazy man or a criminal like Trump and Clinton.

Why do you think Kasich could win a general election against Hillary when he couldn't win his own parities nomination? Because of some random polls? If so, where were those people come the primary elections?

I understand the sentiment that Kasich may have a better temperament (one opinion), has experience on how to handle the Hill (Congress not old piano legs) and as an executive (Ohio) has a track record. But he was crushed in primaries when everyone who voted knew those facts. So why would it be any different against Hill (Ole Piano legs!)?

You raise some good points. However, a party primary is a v-e-r-y small selection of voters and pretty much leaves out Independents and potential, if not likely, cross-over Democrats/Republicans.

There are more Independents then either R's or D's (http://www.gallup.com/poll/188096/democr...-lows.aspx) and history shows the party that can claim the majority of them, while maintaining its base, wins the election.

Just do the math as to how you get to 50 percent +1 for the electoral college. It can't be done without Independent voters.

Kasich was the Republican's best option to secure Independents, plus he definitely would have had significant Democrat cross-over (most Dem's opinion of Hillary mirror's Republicans, just like most Republicans despise Trump - I know a former Ohio GOP State Rep and current GOP official who is reluctantly voting for Clinton).

As Buckley said: vote for the most conservative candidate in the primary WHO CAN WIN the general election.

If you can't win, you become irrelevant, regardless of the merits of your positions. Ask Mitt Romey or Al Gore.

Not to quibble but I must. I know some primaries are closed while others aren't. I also know for those that are closed there is a window to transition from an I to a D or R if you are so inclined. If Kasich was such a sure fire winner why didn't the I's come out or even the inclined D's in numbers that would have made Kasich competitive. Because as I read it he was crushed.

Personally, I agree with and admire some of his positions but that point aside the evidence appears to point to the fact Kasich had a fair chance to do as you suggest but zip, nada, nuthin.

I don't see any evidence of fact that supports your contention. In theory? Could've! But in reality ... not.