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Aren't five paid official visits enough?
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CatMom Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-19-2016 10:52 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-19-2016 08:05 AM)JCGSU Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 11:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 10:10 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  These kids may come from a harsh environment, but also remember that college is a privilege not a right. I'm all for helping those that work hard and want to better themselves get opportunity. But also, these kids are getting a paid for, now more so, education for playing a sport. So whether they go to a local school or one across the country they should be happy about the opportunity and remember to focus just as much on the academic side. A lot of under privileged kids don't have any offers or help getting into any college.
Let's not start shedding tears because a 2 or 3 star recruit is only being offered at regional schools and never had a chance to visit a schools 3 or more states away.

That's the thing though. What if those regional schools don't want that 3 star player? Normally, he just leaves the state for another offer, but now those schools don't get to see him because the kid can't afford to travel for camps.

It's never as simple as you guys are trying to make this out to be. It's not as if all the 2 and 3 star kids will magically be offered by regional schools now. Kids are going to fall through the cracks.

There is no such thing as a three star missing out on offers unless they have academic issues. If they are rated three star they have been evaluated and have tape out. There is nothing limiting coaches from making visits to a high school either. They can watch a kid all they want as long as there is no contact, I believe. The kids that MIGHT fall through the cracks are the diamond in the rough types that for some reason did not push to have their stuff on any of the four major recruiting sites and HUDL, their coaches have little connections and just do not push their kids to programs. Folks are really making a mountain out of a molehill, it will take more effort on the part of coaching staffs but finding 15-25 players a year is not some monumental task as compared to just 10 years ago. They went to far but the schools that were abusing this and wanted to poke the hornet's nest are the ones to blame. These things have been going on for years and a lot of the SEC teams had out of state camps. I doubt UT, Miss St, AU, Vandy, KY, Ole Miss were in favor and will be affected as well.

I am neutral on this stuff I would rather lean towards giving kids more opportunity. But I don't like big money schools being able to have unlimited camps all over the country and getting yet another advantage just because of the conference they are in. Wake and Vandy coming down to GA on that P5 money they do not deserve is not right either.

It happens every single season to multiple prospects, and that's with satellite camps. There was a QB in New Mexico a year or two ago that set all sorts of QB records in High School, was given a 3 star rating, and traveled across the country for camps. He never got a single FBS offer. Had nearly a 4.0 GPA

3 star is a rating by a group of recruiting people who are not college football coaches. Coaches prefer the eye test, and others will only sign a kid that fits. For instance, Georgia Southern isn't likely to offer a 3 star QB who is 245 pounds and runs a 4-9 40. He might be the best passer the world has ever seen, but it doesn't fit your system. Normally, that kid could rely on schools all over the country to come in and show interest, because someone needs him. Without a Satellite camp, those offers don't come, and a kid might be stuck heading to D2 or FCS.
We had a QB like that who was drafted and played minor league ball (pitcher) for several years before returning to college and playing football. I doubt very much that GS would have blinked twice in taking him but he played 4 years and set a bunch of school records at TXST. He was 6'6" and 220. Couldn't run very well but got us to the playoffs in 2008. Under a better coach he would have done better, I believe.
A guy like that would not have gotten many looks coming out of HS.
04-19-2016 11:25 AM
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trueeagle98 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-19-2016 11:25 AM)CatMom Wrote:  
(04-19-2016 10:52 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-19-2016 08:05 AM)JCGSU Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 11:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 10:10 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  These kids may come from a harsh environment, but also remember that college is a privilege not a right. I'm all for helping those that work hard and want to better themselves get opportunity. But also, these kids are getting a paid for, now more so, education for playing a sport. So whether they go to a local school or one across the country they should be happy about the opportunity and remember to focus just as much on the academic side. A lot of under privileged kids don't have any offers or help getting into any college.
Let's not start shedding tears because a 2 or 3 star recruit is only being offered at regional schools and never had a chance to visit a schools 3 or more states away.

That's the thing though. What if those regional schools don't want that 3 star player? Normally, he just leaves the state for another offer, but now those schools don't get to see him because the kid can't afford to travel for camps.

It's never as simple as you guys are trying to make this out to be. It's not as if all the 2 and 3 star kids will magically be offered by regional schools now. Kids are going to fall through the cracks.

There is no such thing as a three star missing out on offers unless they have academic issues. If they are rated three star they have been evaluated and have tape out. There is nothing limiting coaches from making visits to a high school either. They can watch a kid all they want as long as there is no contact, I believe. The kids that MIGHT fall through the cracks are the diamond in the rough types that for some reason did not push to have their stuff on any of the four major recruiting sites and HUDL, their coaches have little connections and just do not push their kids to programs. Folks are really making a mountain out of a molehill, it will take more effort on the part of coaching staffs but finding 15-25 players a year is not some monumental task as compared to just 10 years ago. They went to far but the schools that were abusing this and wanted to poke the hornet's nest are the ones to blame. These things have been going on for years and a lot of the SEC teams had out of state camps. I doubt UT, Miss St, AU, Vandy, KY, Ole Miss were in favor and will be affected as well.

I am neutral on this stuff I would rather lean towards giving kids more opportunity. But I don't like big money schools being able to have unlimited camps all over the country and getting yet another advantage just because of the conference they are in. Wake and Vandy coming down to GA on that P5 money they do not deserve is not right either.

It happens every single season to multiple prospects, and that's with satellite camps. There was a QB in New Mexico a year or two ago that set all sorts of QB records in High School, was given a 3 star rating, and traveled across the country for camps. He never got a single FBS offer. Had nearly a 4.0 GPA

3 star is a rating by a group of recruiting people who are not college football coaches. Coaches prefer the eye test, and others will only sign a kid that fits. For instance, Georgia Southern isn't likely to offer a 3 star QB who is 245 pounds and runs a 4-9 40. He might be the best passer the world has ever seen, but it doesn't fit your system. Normally, that kid could rely on schools all over the country to come in and show interest, because someone needs him. Without a Satellite camp, those offers don't come, and a kid might be stuck heading to D2 or FCS.
We had a QB like that who was drafted and played minor league ball (pitcher) for several years before returning to college and playing football. I doubt very much that GS would have blinked twice in taking him but he played 4 years and set a bunch of school records at TXST. He was 6'6" and 220. Couldn't run very well but got us to the playoffs in 2008. Under a better coach he would have done better, I believe.
A guy like that would not have gotten many looks coming out of HS.


Again not shedding any tears about a player not getting an offer from an FBS program. So what if he goes to a FCS or D2 or (OMG) D3 school. There are some very good (cough Ivy League cough) schools that don't play in the FBS. You admit that even with camps players fall thru the cracks, so what. The kid can do what millions of others do and study to make the grades and get finicial aid (if they are so poor then the more assistance they can apply for, especially if they are a minority). Still sounds like the schools in talent poor states/regions are the ones crying the most. Just seems a little hypocritical. 07-coffee3

Again, I'm not against camps and believe the ruling went to an extreme (like I said before it like a parent that has had enough of a whining child and just takes everyone toys away). I'm just not buying its all about the kids line. I'm sure a lot of great players don't get into the NFL either.

And I don't get the TXST story. a 6'6 QB will get some looks unless every school in the region is running the option. He chose to play baseball didn't work out and went back to college and played some football. Was he hoping to play in the NFL too? Don't see where camps would've helped him.
04-19-2016 12:53 PM
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WhitetailWizard Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-18-2016 11:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 10:10 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  These kids may come from a harsh environment, but also remember that college is a privilege not a right. I'm all for helping those that work hard and want to better themselves get opportunity. But also, these kids are getting a paid for, now more so, education for playing a sport. So whether they go to a local school or one across the country they should be happy about the opportunity and remember to focus just as much on the academic side. A lot of under privileged kids don't have any offers or help getting into any college.
Let's not start shedding tears because a 2 or 3 star recruit is only being offered at regional schools and never had a chance to visit a schools 3 or more states away.

That's the thing though. What if those regional schools don't want that 3 star player? Normally, he just leaves the state for another offer, but now those schools don't get to see him because the kid can't afford to travel for camps.

It's never as simple as you guys are trying to make this out to be. It's not as if all the 2 and 3 star kids will magically be offered by regional schools now. Kids are going to fall through the cracks.

2-3 stars will always slip through the cracks,satellite camps will not stop that.Most of that has to do with size of their high school,their high school coach's relationship or the lack of "pipeline" nature of the program they are a part of.

Satellite camps are for the solid 3 star guys who will stand out at a camp and who missed a local P5 offer.This picture of servitude to the under priviledged just ain't exactly whats going on as most of those kids will have G5 offers
04-20-2016 07:04 AM
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JCGSU Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-19-2016 10:52 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-19-2016 08:05 AM)JCGSU Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 11:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 10:10 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  These kids may come from a harsh environment, but also remember that college is a privilege not a right. I'm all for helping those that work hard and want to better themselves get opportunity. But also, these kids are getting a paid for, now more so, education for playing a sport. So whether they go to a local school or one across the country they should be happy about the opportunity and remember to focus just as much on the academic side. A lot of under privileged kids don't have any offers or help getting into any college.
Let's not start shedding tears because a 2 or 3 star recruit is only being offered at regional schools and never had a chance to visit a schools 3 or more states away.

That's the thing though. What if those regional schools don't want that 3 star player? Normally, he just leaves the state for another offer, but now those schools don't get to see him because the kid can't afford to travel for camps.

It's never as simple as you guys are trying to make this out to be. It's not as if all the 2 and 3 star kids will magically be offered by regional schools now. Kids are going to fall through the cracks.

There is no such thing as a three star missing out on offers unless they have academic issues. If they are rated three star they have been evaluated and have tape out. There is nothing limiting coaches from making visits to a high school either. They can watch a kid all they want as long as there is no contact, I believe. The kids that MIGHT fall through the cracks are the diamond in the rough types that for some reason did not push to have their stuff on any of the four major recruiting sites and HUDL, their coaches have little connections and just do not push their kids to programs. Folks are really making a mountain out of a molehill, it will take more effort on the part of coaching staffs but finding 15-25 players a year is not some monumental task as compared to just 10 years ago. They went to far but the schools that were abusing this and wanted to poke the hornet's nest are the ones to blame. These things have been going on for years and a lot of the SEC teams had out of state camps. I doubt UT, Miss St, AU, Vandy, KY, Ole Miss were in favor and will be affected as well.

I am neutral on this stuff I would rather lean towards giving kids more opportunity. But I don't like big money schools being able to have unlimited camps all over the country and getting yet another advantage just because of the conference they are in. Wake and Vandy coming down to GA on that P5 money they do not deserve is not right either.

It happens every single season to multiple prospects, and that's with satellite camps. There was a QB in New Mexico a year or two ago that set all sorts of QB records in High School, was given a 3 star rating, and traveled across the country for camps. He never got a single FBS offer. Had nearly a 4.0 GPA

3 star is a rating by a group of recruiting people who are not college football coaches. Coaches prefer the eye test, and others will only sign a kid that fits. For instance, Georgia Southern isn't likely to offer a 3 star QB who is 245 pounds and runs a 4-9 40. He might be the best passer the world has ever seen, but it doesn't fit your system. Normally, that kid could rely on schools all over the country to come in and show interest, because someone needs him. Without a Satellite camp, those offers don't come, and a kid might be stuck heading to D2 or FCS.


If a kid is rated a legit three star it is not because people have not seen him, or does not have offers. Show me a three star without offers and I will likely show you a kid that is barely passing and cant get his SAT score. You also don't know about character issues they may have either or if he has a d bag parents demanding playing time. A phone call to a coach or a teacher can get offers pulled as well. Some FBS teams have rosters filled with unrated and two star kids. If there is a legit three star out there they are going to see him no camp needed. No legit academically sound decent character three star kid is being forced down to the FCS or DIV II. Most P5 rosters are majority three star give me a break.

Also getting forced down to horrible FCS schools like, Furman, Mercer, Samford, any patriot league school long term will be the best thing that ever happened to them in their life.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 08:10 AM by JCGSU.)
04-20-2016 08:07 AM
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Nugget49er Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
FBS Schools are going to give out 85 scholarships whether these camps exist or not. If kid A falls through the cracks because a school doesn't scout him and there was not a camp for coaches to stumble across him, then kid B is going to get a scholarship. Chances are pretty good that kid A was a marginal recruit (because he wasn't being followed), and kid B is too. They are probably interchangeable on any given day.

My question today is, why did the Sun Belt vote against allowing kids on official visits to bring two parents/guardians? You were the only dissenters. This would probably stop a lot of the nonsense that occurs and focus the process on what is important.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 08:39 AM by Nugget49er.)
04-20-2016 08:38 AM
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Post: #26
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 08:38 AM)Nugget49er Wrote:  FBS Schools are going to give out 85 scholarships whether these camps exist or not. If kid A falls through the cracks because a school doesn't scout him and there was not a camp for coaches to stumble across him, then kid B is going to get a scholarship. Chances are pretty good that kid A was a marginal recruit (because he wasn't being followed), and kid B is too. They are probably interchangeable on any given day.

My question today is, why did the Sun Belt vote against allowing kids on official visits to bring two parents/guardians? You were the only dissenters. This would probably stop a lot of the nonsense that occurs and focus the process on what is important.

Most of us are baffled about the votes the conference has been taking at NCAA meetings.

Against satellite camps even though our coaches want them.

We have listened to a contingent of camp haters tout well pay their way and then we vote against making it possible for up to two family members to come on a visit with them.

Having the family there to ask questions and not be as giddy as a 17 year old is another good for players piece of legislation but the people granted responsibility for representing this conference have an FCS mindset and need to get the hell out of the way.
04-20-2016 09:33 AM
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Yosef84 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
I don't think we can paint this issue as a major social injustice to players. I do, however, think that it removed opportunities from the recruits in terms of reducing possible opportunities. The problem with completely eliminating satellite camps is that it is a decision geared to favor the major P5 programs who have deep pockets and who will be able to book their official visits, and rely on other recruiting techniques. G5 schools have much tighter budgets and have to rely on more efficient methods for contacting and evaluating players. We aren't generally getting the highly rated players who have been thoroughly vetted by every scout in the country. We are looking for those "other" players with potential.

I don't see this as the end of the world but it certainly impacts App and a lot of other G5 programs and the impact is felt much more than it will be at the P5 programs. GS might not have been relying on satellite camps in the past. I really don't know, but I've heard plenty of complaints about losing commitments to GT and UGA, so anything that widens that gap is going to be a problem for them too.
04-20-2016 09:38 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 07:04 AM)WhitetailWizard Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 11:05 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(04-18-2016 10:10 AM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  These kids may come from a harsh environment, but also remember that college is a privilege not a right. I'm all for helping those that work hard and want to better themselves get opportunity. But also, these kids are getting a paid for, now more so, education for playing a sport. So whether they go to a local school or one across the country they should be happy about the opportunity and remember to focus just as much on the academic side. A lot of under privileged kids don't have any offers or help getting into any college.
Let's not start shedding tears because a 2 or 3 star recruit is only being offered at regional schools and never had a chance to visit a schools 3 or more states away.

That's the thing though. What if those regional schools don't want that 3 star player? Normally, he just leaves the state for another offer, but now those schools don't get to see him because the kid can't afford to travel for camps.

It's never as simple as you guys are trying to make this out to be. It's not as if all the 2 and 3 star kids will magically be offered by regional schools now. Kids are going to fall through the cracks.

2-3 stars will always slip through the cracks,satellite camps will not stop that.Most of that has to do with size of their high school,their high school coach's relationship or the lack of "pipeline" nature of the program they are a part of.

Satellite camps are for the solid 3 star guys who will stand out at a camp and who missed a local P5 offer.This picture of servitude to the under priviledged just ain't exactly whats going on as most of those kids will have G5 offers

Maybe we're the only ones, but we always did our satellite camps with local D2 schools. It was truly about just getting closer to several of the prospects.

The issue with this is how it hurts the G5. Those 3 stars are still going to chase the P5 schools, and now there won't be G5 teams at those same camps ready to make a potential offer.
04-20-2016 10:28 AM
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GSU Eagles Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
Let me make sure I understand how this all works.

1) satellite camps get unnoticed players noticed so they can get better offers
2) therefore unnoticed G5 recruits become noticed and get P5 offers
3) the overrated P5 recruits then lose the P5 offer and are demoted to G5 schools
4) the G5 can make this up by getting unnoticed fcs offered kids.
5) the prevailing thought is that G5 schools are crazy to not support the above.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 12:48 PM by GSU Eagles.)
04-20-2016 12:46 PM
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CatMom Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-19-2016 12:53 PM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  And I don't get the TXST story. a 6'6 QB will get some looks unless every school in the region is running the option. He chose to play baseball didn't work out and went back to college and played some football. Was he hoping to play in the NFL too? Don't see where camps would've helped him.

I was just trying to make an analogy whereby tall, slow, white QBs do not fit into most systems these days. Guess that didn't pan out.03-banghead
04-20-2016 01:14 PM
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Post: #31
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 12:46 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  Let me make sure I understand how this all works.

1) satellite camps get unnoticed players noticed so they can get better offers
2) therefore unnoticed G5 recruits become noticed and get P5 offers
3) the overrated P5 recruits then lose the P5 offer and are demoted to G5 schools
4) the G5 can make this up by getting unnoticed fcs offered kids.
5) the prevailing thought is that G5 schools are crazy to not support the above.

No.

Players who might not have gotten a good offer (whether it be P5 vs. G5 or G5 vs. FCS) land at their appropriate level.

This is positive. An over-rated who lands at a P5 wastes his time and the schools, ditto the kid who lands at G5 who really doesn't belong there and ought to be in FCS or Division II.

More accurate values are assigned = greater efficiency for all involved.

Your position as set forth is based on a horrible assumption.

That talent is relatively evenly divided between each tier of recruit ability.

For every receiver who can change the fate of a team there are a hundred or more all close in quality and it takes deeper evaluation to sort them out. Camps are the sorting hat making sure they land where they have the best chance at success.
04-20-2016 01:30 PM
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Post: #32
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-12-2016 04:38 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  With all the bellyaching about the satellite camps ending you would think they also ended official and unofficial visits.

If kids can take five "all expenses paid" trips to schools on their official visit, is ending camps really hurting kids without resources to travel?

They could take five paid for visits and then hop in a car with friends to visit a couple more schools within a few hours on unnofficials at minimal expense. That gives them a total of seven visits at minimal expense. And on top of that they can still go to camps close by at minimal expense.

How many of you visited seven schools when making your college decision? The satellite camps are really overkill and would turn into expensive and wasteful shows to attract top athletes.

One big problem with your theory. If the kid is highly recruited, then yes, he can take 5 OV's. But if he isn't, guess what, he isn't getting 5 OV's to the bigger schools or even medium schools. So that shoots your theory right there. A lightly recruited kid but one with huge upside, or maybe a late bloomer is out of luck. The combined camps were THE way that he would even get noticed in the first place by the higher profile schools, and thus even be offered an OV. A normal kid can't afford to be flying or driving all over the country to make UOV's. The combined camps allowed that kid to stay local, go to local camps that also drew in bigger schools as guest coaches, and get seen by lots of coaches. All of that is gone now. The only people this hurts are the kids. Speaking from someone who has firsthand knowledge of the recruiting process. There are always diamonds in the rough. And guess what, even if he didn't get an offer from the big schools, a lot of these combined camps have 5 or more schools present, so he will catch someone's eye somewhere. All of that...gone now.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 01:48 PM by BullsFanInTX.)
04-20-2016 01:44 PM
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GSU Eagles Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 01:58 PM by GSU Eagles.)
04-20-2016 01:51 PM
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Post: #34
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 01:51 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
None of that works well. State political borders bear absolutely no relation to college football recruiting. Neither does mileage. Might as well just arbitrarily make it based on average rainfall.

Frankly, the NCAA should hold a specified number of regulated and supervised regional camps based on student and college interest for having them...and then have them.

Now that may freak out some. Too bad...the goal should be to match up potential FBS athletes with potential FBS slots. That probably means multiple camps in Texas and zero camps in Idaho.
04-20-2016 02:06 PM
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GSU Eagles Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 02:06 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 01:51 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
None of that works well. State political borders bear absolutely no relation to college football recruiting. Neither does mileage. Might as well just arbitrarily make it based on average rainfall.

Frankly, the NCAA should hold a specified number of regulated and supervised regional camps based on student and college interest for having them...and then have them.

Now that may freak out some. Too bad...the goal should be to match up potential FBS athletes with potential FBS slots. That probably means multiple camps in Texas and zero camps in Idaho.

In the end it is what the 129 FBS schools will agree to. The above makes sense in theory but is too complicated. The state line is probably the default or at least the first step.
(This post was last modified: 04-20-2016 02:20 PM by GSU Eagles.)
04-20-2016 02:16 PM
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Post: #36
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 02:16 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:06 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 01:51 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
None of that works well. State political borders bear absolutely no relation to college football recruiting. Neither does mileage. Might as well just arbitrarily make it based on average rainfall.

Frankly, the NCAA should hold a specified number of regulated and supervised regional camps based on student and college interest for having them...and then have them.

Now that may freak out some. Too bad...the goal should be to match up potential FBS athletes with potential FBS slots. That probably means multiple camps in Texas and zero camps in Idaho.

In the end it is what you he 129 FBS schools will agree to. The above makes sense in theory but is too complicated. The state line is probably the default.
If eveyone were focused on the athlete, they'd come up with a system that works. There are probably a hundred different ways to go about it. But nobody is.

I've thought about unlimited camps but only for athletes with no FBS offers. That would probably give a whole lot of athletes FBS looks from G5 schools but Harbaugh probably wouldn't want to waste his time.

Problem with that is that you'd probably have to have new rules on offers and commitments and have a centralized clearing house to manage it. But maybe that wouldn't be a bad thing either.

In any event, nobody who can do stuff actually cares enough to lead so its all fantasy anyway.
04-20-2016 02:23 PM
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trueeagle98 Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 02:23 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:16 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:06 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 01:51 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
None of that works well. State political borders bear absolutely no relation to college football recruiting. Neither does mileage. Might as well just arbitrarily make it based on average rainfall.

Frankly, the NCAA should hold a specified number of regulated and supervised regional camps based on student and college interest for having them...and then have them.

Now that may freak out some. Too bad...the goal should be to match up potential FBS athletes with potential FBS slots. That probably means multiple camps in Texas and zero camps in Idaho.

In the end it is what you he 129 FBS schools will agree to. The above makes sense in theory but is too complicated. The state line is probably the default.
If eveyone were focused on the athlete, they'd come up with a system that works. There are probably a hundred different ways to go about it. But nobody is.

I've thought about unlimited camps but only for athletes with no FBS offers. That would probably give a whole lot of athletes FBS looks from G5 schools but Harbaugh probably wouldn't want to waste his time.

Problem with that is that you'd probably have to have new rules on offers and commitments and have a centralized clearing house to manage it. But maybe that wouldn't be a bad thing either.

In any event, nobody who can do stuff actually cares enough to lead so its all fantasy anyway.


Since when do college athletics have anything to do with the recruits wellfare? They basically use each other. The kid gets a mostly paid for (if not entirely free) higher education and the school kids an athlete that will hopefully help the team win games and championships.
04-20-2016 02:27 PM
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GSU Eagles Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
The answer is that there are plenty of private camps (Nike Sparq) that coaches can attend. There will certainly be more as a result of the rule change.
04-20-2016 02:29 PM
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ark30inf Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 02:27 PM)trueeagle98 Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:23 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:16 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 02:06 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  
(04-20-2016 01:51 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  I think we can all agree that no camps is bad. And equally bad on the other end of the spectrum was the Harbaugh nuclear war approach.

The reasonable middle ground is in state camps. Hold camps in your home state. If you want to reach other states then have it near the state border.

A mileage system doesn't work because distances out west are vast so that likely does them no good. Plus the in state rule in most cases would provide the same reach as a 300 mile radius.

A limit on the total number but no distance limit doesn't work because certain states and regions get bombarded.
None of that works well. State political borders bear absolutely no relation to college football recruiting. Neither does mileage. Might as well just arbitrarily make it based on average rainfall.

Frankly, the NCAA should hold a specified number of regulated and supervised regional camps based on student and college interest for having them...and then have them.

Now that may freak out some. Too bad...the goal should be to match up potential FBS athletes with potential FBS slots. That probably means multiple camps in Texas and zero camps in Idaho.

In the end it is what you he 129 FBS schools will agree to. The above makes sense in theory but is too complicated. The state line is probably the default.
If eveyone were focused on the athlete, they'd come up with a system that works. There are probably a hundred different ways to go about it. But nobody is.

I've thought about unlimited camps but only for athletes with no FBS offers. That would probably give a whole lot of athletes FBS looks from G5 schools but Harbaugh probably wouldn't want to waste his time.

Problem with that is that you'd probably have to have new rules on offers and commitments and have a centralized clearing house to manage it. But maybe that wouldn't be a bad thing either.

In any event, nobody who can do stuff actually cares enough to lead so its all fantasy anyway.


Since when do college athletics have anything to do with the recruits wellfare? They basically use each other. The kid gets a mostly paid for (if not entirely free) higher education and the school kids an athlete that will hopefully help the team win games and championships.

Just because it doesn't doesn't mean it shouldn't.

And as a practical matter...the status quo cannot stand forever. Athletes are getting fed up and public opinion is headed that way too. And there is a fair chance that, sooner or later, the courts will pop the bubble suddenly and sharply.

Self-regulate, or have regulation imposed from outside. Abuse brings control.
04-20-2016 02:34 PM
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Post: #40
RE: Aren't five paid official visits enough?
(04-20-2016 02:29 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  The answer is that there are plenty of private camps (Nike Sparq) that coaches can attend. There will certainly be more as a result of the rule change.

You just make stuff up for the fun of it?
The rule says no one on staff at a school can participate in any camp other than the ones held on campus.
04-20-2016 02:35 PM
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