(04-10-2016 10:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 10:02 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 09:49 AM)bullet Wrote:  Kentucky has really been propelled by the one and dones. 29 of their 82 are currently playing. Traditionally, before Pitino, UK had more in the way of team than stars relative to UCLA and UNC.

Watching what Devin Booker and Karl Anthony Towns this year...how in the world didn't the Wildcats NOT win the Title last year...say the same in 2010 when they had DeMarcus Cousins, John Wall and Eric Bledsoe...John Calipari...does less with more...

Because it takes time and practice to gel into a team.

Calipari's focus is on recruiting one-and-dones, and part of that is preparing them for the pros. Winning games at UK is secondary to player development, because what his players do in their first few years in the NBA and where they get drafted is how he recruits his next batch of one-and-dones.

As long as Coach CAl can run Big Blue Nation NBA Prep Academy, he doesn't need to worry about maximizing his hardware count. With his talent level, the NCs and Final Fours take care of themselves.

Yes, if you look at his talent level and plot a graph, you might say that 4 Final Fours in 6 years and only one Final Four is underperforming, but that's probably a necessity in *getting* those talents. They're not going to stick around long enough to learn a role in a system and develop into a cohesive unit. That's not the program.

What he did last year was pretty remarkable getting that talent to play together as they did as quickly as they did. They played a very good, more experienced team with a beefy middle in the semis and just didn't have a good game.

As for 2010, that was no surprise at all. They were really talented, but weren't a good FT shooting team and dependent on 3s. They were very young. I didn't expect them to win.

2013 was the year he did poorly with the talent he had.

2014 he got to the championship game with a team clearly inferior to Florida who didn't make it.

(04-10-2016 01:53 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 10:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 10:02 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 09:49 AM)bullet Wrote:  Kentucky has really been propelled by the one and dones. 29 of their 82 are currently playing. Traditionally, before Pitino, UK had more in the way of team than stars relative to UCLA and UNC.

Watching what Devin Booker and Karl Anthony Towns this year...how in the world didn't the Wildcats NOT win the Title last year...say the same in 2010 when they had DeMarcus Cousins, John Wall and Eric Bledsoe...John Calipari...does less with more...

Because it takes time and practice to gel into a team.

Calipari's focus is on recruiting one-and-dones, and part of that is preparing them for the pros. Winning games at UK is secondary to player development, because what his players do in their first few years in the NBA and where they get drafted is how he recruits his next batch of one-and-dones.

As long as Coach CAl can run Big Blue Nation NBA Prep Academy, he doesn't need to worry about maximizing his hardware count. With his talent level, the NCs and Final Fours take care of themselves.

Yes, if you look at his talent level and plot a graph, you might say that 4 Final Fours in 6 years and only one Final Four is underperforming, but that's probably a necessity in *getting* those talents. They're not going to stick around long enough to learn a role in a system and develop into a cohesive unit. That's not the program.

What he did last year was pretty remarkable getting that talent to play together as they did as quickly as they did. They played a very good, more experienced team with a beefy middle in the semis and just didn't have a good game.

As for 2010, that was no surprise at all. They were really talented, but weren't a good FT shooting team and dependent on 3s. They were very young. I didn't expect them to win.

2013 was the year he did poorly with the talent he had.

2014 he got to the championship game with a team clearly inferior to Florida who didn't make it.

In 2014....talent wise they were 2nd to none but I will give him credit on this...their road to the title game was extremely difficult...a Undefeated and 2013 Final Four Wichita State in Round 2...Defending Champion Louisville in the Sweet Sixteen, National Runner Up Michigan in the Elite Eight and Wisconsin in the Final Four.

When looking back 25 years, ESPN did a ranking back in 2013.

They had UNC #1, then Georgetown, the UConn.

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketbal...georgetown

(04-10-2016 02:56 PM)upstater1 Wrote:  When looking back 25 years, ESPN did a ranking back in 2013.

They had UNC #1, then Georgetown, the UConn.

Wow, I've been a Hoyas fan for almost 40 years, and I have no idea how we could possibly be ranked that higher over that time frame. Top 20 maybe.

Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21
2 Kansas 19
3 Duke 18
4 North Carolina 16
5 UCLA 14
6 Arizona 13
7 Florida 10
8 Syracuse 8
8 Texas 8
8 Washington 8
11 Connecticut 7
12 Georgia Tech 6
12 LSU 6
12 Michigan 6
12 Michigan St. 6
12 Southern Cal 6
12 Wake Forest 6
18 Georgetown 5
18 Marquette 5
18 Ohio St. 5
18 Stanford 5
18 UNLV 5
18 Wisconsin 5
24 Arkansas 4
24 Colorado 4
24 Indiana 4
24 Louisville 4
24 Oklahoma St. 4
24 Tennessee 4
24 Villanova 4

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21
2 Kansas 19
3 Duke 18
4 North Carolina 16
5 UCLA 14
6 Arizona 13
7 Florida 10
8 Syracuse 8
8 Texas 8
8 Washington 8
11 Connecticut 7
12 Georgia Tech 6
12 LSU 6
12 Michigan 6
12 Michigan St. 6
12 Southern Cal 6
12 Wake Forest 6
18 Georgetown 5
18 Marquette 5
18 Ohio St. 5
18 Stanford 5
18 UNLV 5
18 Wisconsin 5
24 Arkansas 4
24 Colorado 4
24 Indiana 4
24 Louisville 4
24 Oklahoma St. 4
24 Tennessee 4
24 Villanova 4

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Saw an article not too long back. I don't remember the exact %, but it was very high, perhaps 80%, of the McDonald's All-Americans over the last 5 years had gone to UK, KU, Duke or UNC, the first 4 on that list.

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21
2 Kansas 19
3 Duke 18
4 North Carolina 16
5 UCLA 14
6 Arizona 13
7 Florida 10
8 Syracuse 8
8 Texas 8
8 Washington 8
11 Connecticut 7
12 Georgia Tech 6
12 LSU 6
12 Michigan 6
12 Michigan St. 6
12 Southern Cal 6
12 Wake Forest 6
18 Georgetown 5
18 Marquette 5
18 Ohio St. 5
18 Stanford 5
18 UNLV 5
18 Wisconsin 5
24 Arkansas 4
24 Colorado 4
24 Indiana 4
24 Louisville 4
24 Oklahoma St. 4
24 Tennessee 4
24 Villanova 4

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Someone correlate this list with Champs won and Final Four's over the past 15 years or so.

(04-11-2016 09:32 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21
2 Kansas 19
3 Duke 18
4 North Carolina 16
5 UCLA 14
6 Arizona 13
7 Florida 10
8 Syracuse 8
8 Texas 8
8 Washington 8
11 Connecticut 7
12 Georgia Tech 6
12 LSU 6
12 Michigan 6
12 Michigan St. 6
12 Southern Cal 6
12 Wake Forest 6
18 Georgetown 5
18 Marquette 5
18 Ohio St. 5
18 Stanford 5
18 UNLV 5
18 Wisconsin 5
24 Arkansas 4
24 Colorado 4
24 Indiana 4
24 Louisville 4
24 Oklahoma St. 4
24 Tennessee 4
24 Villanova 4

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Someone correlate this list with Champs won and Final Four's over the past 15 years or so.

You have to go back 15 seasons, to Maryland in 2002, to find a team that won the title that isn't on this list. And there isn't much connection between NBA players today and a title won 15 seasons ago.

(04-10-2016 01:51 PM)Maize Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 01:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 10:02 AM)Maize Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 09:49 AM)bullet Wrote:  Kentucky has really been propelled by the one and dones. 29 of their 82 are currently playing. Traditionally, before Pitino, UK had more in the way of team than stars relative to UCLA and UNC.

Watching what Devin Booker and Karl Anthony Towns this year...how in the world didn't the Wildcats NOT win the Title last year...say the same in 2010 when they had DeMarcus Cousins, John Wall and Eric Bledsoe...John Calipari...does less with more...

WVU over Kentucky in the 2010 Regional Final has to be one of the great upsets ever. That 2010 Kentucky team should have been the champs. A failure of Guy Lewis 1983 proportions.

That team had 5 NBA 1st Round draft picks in the 2010 NBA Draft...that was including 2012 Anthony Davis his most talented team.

Not only that, but collectively, those UK players taken in the 2010 draft have been GOOD in the NBA. Sometimes a team gets a bunch of draft picks and they fail in the NBA, which means that they really were overrated. But if you look at the NBA careers of those UK 2010 players, it's the opposite.

If Cal were a better floor coach, he would have national titles in 2010 and 2015 at UK to go along with 2012. At the least. 2014 as well.

(04-11-2016 07:17 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21
2 Kansas 19
3 Duke 18
4 North Carolina 16
5 UCLA 14
6 Arizona 13
7 Florida 10
8 Syracuse 8
8 Texas 8
8 Washington 8
11 Connecticut 7
12 Georgia Tech 6
12 LSU 6
12 Michigan 6
12 Michigan St. 6
12 Southern Cal 6
12 Wake Forest 6
18 Georgetown 5
18 Marquette 5
18 Ohio St. 5
18 Stanford 5
18 UNLV 5
18 Wisconsin 5
24 Arkansas 4
24 Colorado 4
24 Indiana 4
24 Louisville 4
24 Oklahoma St. 4
24 Tennessee 4
24 Villanova 4

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Saw an article not too long back. I don't remember the exact %, but it was very high, perhaps 80%, of the McDonald's All-Americans over the last 5 years had gone to UK, KU, Duke or UNC, the first 4 on that list.

Of this year's ESPN top 100 recruits, Duke has signed 3 of the top 11, and UK has signed 4 of the top 15. All obviously are rated 5-star.

(04-10-2016 08:27 AM)ken d Wrote:  Minnesota is credited with 41 players. Another web site lists the 41 Minnesota players who played in either the NBA or the ABA. So the list in the OP may also include both, even though some may only have played in the ABA.

It is both.

NBA & ABA Players Who Attended University of Minnesota

(04-12-2016 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-11-2016 09:32 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21 (2)
2 Kansas 19 (2)
3 Duke 18 (2)
4 North Carolina 16 (1)
5 UCLA 14 (1)
6 Arizona 13 (0)
7 Florida 10 (2)
8 Syracuse 8 (0)
8 Texas 8 (0)
8 Washington 8 (0)
11 Connecticut 7 (2)
12 Georgia Tech 6 (0)
12 LSU 6 (0)
12 Michigan 6 (1)
12 Michigan St. 6 (1)
12 Southern Cal 6 (0)
12 Wake Forest 6 (0)
18 Georgetown 5 (0)
18 Marquette 5 (0)
18 Ohio St. 5 (1)
18 Stanford 5 (0)
18 UNLV 5 (0)
18 Wisconsin 5 (1)
24 Arkansas 4 (0)
24 Colorado 4 (0)
24 Indiana 4 (0)
24 Louisville 4 (1)
24 Oklahoma St. 4 (0)
24 Tennessee 4 (0)
24 Villanova 4

(0)

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Someone correlate this list with Champs won and Final Four's over the past 15 years or so.

You have to go back 15 seasons, to Maryland in 2002, to find a team that won the title that isn't on this list. And there isn't much connection between NBA players today and a title won 15 seasons ago.

Listed next to the original number above in parenthesis is the number of champ game appearances in the last 10 years (not 2016). Two programs had appearances and are not on the list as having at least 4 NBA players currently...

Butler 2
Memphis 1

Looks like besides these two that UConn and Louisville have done the most with the least. Arizona seems to be the clear underachiever over a 10 year period followed by UNC, Syracuse, Texas and Washington.

(04-12-2016 09:08 AM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:27 AM)ken d Wrote:  Minnesota is credited with 41 players. Another web site lists the 41 Minnesota players who played in either the NBA or the ABA. So the list in the OP may also include both, even though some may only have played in the ABA.

It is both.

NBA & ABA Players Who Attended University of Minnesota

Code:

Rk    Player    From ▴    To    G
1    Tony Jaros    1947    1951    242
2    Kleggie Hermsen    1947    1953    288
3    Don Carlson    1947    1951    180
4    Don Smith    1949    1949    8
5    Bud Grant    1950    1951    96
6    Whitey Skoog    1952    1957    341
7    Ed Kalafat    1955    1957    209
8    Chuck Mencel    1956    1957    141
9    Dick Garmaker    1956    1961    421
10    Doug Bolstorff    1958    1958    3
11    Ron Johnson    1961    1961    14
12    Lou Hudson    1967    1979    890
13    Archie Clark    1967    1976    725
14    Terry Kunze    1968    1968    46
15    Tom Kondla    1969    1969    42
16    Larry Mikan    1971    1971    53
17    Jim Brewer    1974    1982    703
18    Ron Behagen    1974    1980    388
19    Mark Olberding    1976    1987    946
20    Ray Williams    1978    1987    655
21    Mychal Thompson    1979    1991    935
22    Kevin McHale*    1981    1993    971
23    Trent Tucker    1983    1993    756
24    Randy Breuer    1984    1994    681
25    Jim Petersen    1985    1992    491
26    John Shasky    1989    1991    136
27    Richard Coffey    1991    1991    52
28    Willie Burton    1991    1999    316
29    Kevin Lynch    1992    1993    95
30    Melvin Newbern    1993    1993    33
31    Walter Bond    1993    1995    153
32    Bob Martin    1994    1995    54
33    Voshon Lenard    1996    2006    565
34    John Thomas    1998    2006    208
35    Bobby Jackson    1998    2009    755
36    Trevor Winter    1999    1999    1
37    Sam Jacobson    1999    2001    68
38    Quincy Lewis    2000    2004    159
39    Joel Przybilla    2001    2013    592
40    Kris Humphries    2005    2016    743
41    Kevin Burleson    2006    2006    39

That Bud Grant (#5) is the same guy who played for the Philadelphia Eagles and coached the Minnesota Vikings.

(04-10-2016 08:27 AM)ken d Wrote:  Minnesota is credited with 41 players. Another web site lists the 41 Minnesota players who played in either the NBA or the ABA. So the list in the OP may also include both, even though some may only have played in the ABA.

According to basketball-reference, two of the 41 Minnesota players listed played only in the ABA, the other 39 played at least some games in the NBA.

(04-12-2016 09:36 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-11-2016 09:32 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

Quote:1 Kentucky 21 (2)
2 Kansas 19 (2)
3 Duke 18 (2)
4 North Carolina 16 (1)
5 UCLA 14 (1)
6 Arizona 13 (0)
7 Florida 10 (2)
8 Syracuse 8 (0)
8 Texas 8 (0)
8 Washington 8 (0)
11 Connecticut 7 (2)
12 Georgia Tech 6 (0)
12 LSU 6 (0)
12 Michigan 6 (1)
12 Michigan St. 6 (1)
12 Southern Cal 6 (0)
12 Wake Forest 6 (0)
18 Georgetown 5 (0)
18 Marquette 5 (0)
18 Ohio St. 5 (1)
18 Stanford 5 (0)
18 UNLV 5 (0)
18 Wisconsin 5 (1)
24 Arkansas 4 (0)
24 Colorado 4 (0)
24 Indiana 4 (0)
24 Louisville 4 (1)
24 Oklahoma St. 4 (0)
24 Tennessee 4 (0)
24 Villanova 4

(0)

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Someone correlate this list with Champs won and Final Four's over the past 15 years or so.

You have to go back 15 seasons, to Maryland in 2002, to find a team that won the title that isn't on this list. And there isn't much connection between NBA players today and a title won 15 seasons ago.

Listed next to the original number above in parenthesis is the number of champ game appearances in the last 10 years (not 2016). Two programs had appearances and are not on the list as having at least 4 NBA players currently...

Butler 2
Memphis 1

Looks like besides these two that UConn and Louisville have done the most with the least. Arizona seems to be the clear underachiever over a 10 year period.

It has seemed to me that UConn's tournament successes were often driven by outstanding senior guard play, and rarely by one and done players. The NBA draft, on the other hand, is usually dominated by underclassmen based on "potential".

(04-12-2016 09:48 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 09:36 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 08:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-11-2016 09:32 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  

(04-10-2016 08:15 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Colleges of players on opening day NBA rosters this season:

(0)

Complete list at http://rpiratings.com/NBA.php

And this page claims to be more current, but no idea how often it's updated: http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ni-tracker

Someone correlate this list with Champs won and Final Four's over the past 15 years or so.

You have to go back 15 seasons, to Maryland in 2002, to find a team that won the title that isn't on this list. And there isn't much connection between NBA players today and a title won 15 seasons ago.

Listed next to the original number above in parenthesis is the number of champ game appearances in the last 10 years (not 2016). Two programs had appearances and are not on the list as having at least 4 NBA players currently...

Butler 2
Memphis 1

Looks like besides these two that UConn and Louisville have done the most with the least. Arizona seems to be the clear underachiever over a 10 year period.

It has seemed to me that UConn's tournament successes were often driven by outstanding senior guard play, and rarely by one and done players. The NBA draft, on the other hand, is usually dominated by underclassmen based on "potential".

The 2011 team had Kemba, Napier, Jeremy Lamb and Deandre Daniels. It was a very young team, lead by Kemba and a bunch of freshman (Lamb, Giffey, Napier, Olander, Roscoe Smith). Kemba was the upperclassman, a junior.

All were drafted within the first 31 picks in the NBA draft.

Kemba was a junior the year they won it. Andre Drummond was their only one and done in recent years.

http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confer...ba-players

Found this link with Kentucky players and their NBA stats, but no ABA stats (probably other schools here as well). How well the 2010-2015 drafted UK players are doing is phenomenal. 11 of the 18 are averaging double figures and 4 others clearly have major roles.

There's a chart with the 22 current players and then a 2nd chart with all players going back to the 40s.

(04-12-2016 10:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confer...ba-players

Found this link with Kentucky players and their NBA stats, but no ABA stats (probably other schools here as well). How well the 2010-2015 drafted UK players are doing is phenomenal. 11 of the 18 are averaging double figures and 4 others clearly have major roles.

There's a chart with the 22 current players and then a 2nd chart with all players going back to the 40s.

Calipari is challenging Dean Smith for title of "most NBA talent with fewest NCAA championships to show for it".

(04-13-2016 06:43 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 10:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confer...ba-players

Found this link with Kentucky players and their NBA stats, but no ABA stats (probably other schools here as well). How well the 2010-2015 drafted UK players are doing is phenomenal. 11 of the 18 are averaging double figures and 4 others clearly have major roles.

There's a chart with the 22 current players and then a 2nd chart with all players going back to the 40s.

Calipari is challenging Dean Smith for title of "most NBA talent with fewest NCAA championships to show for it".

Calipari isn't keeping them long enough.

(04-13-2016 08:09 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(04-13-2016 06:43 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 10:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confer...ba-players

Found this link with Kentucky players and their NBA stats, but no ABA stats (probably other schools here as well). How well the 2010-2015 drafted UK players are doing is phenomenal. 11 of the 18 are averaging double figures and 4 others clearly have major roles.

There's a chart with the 22 current players and then a 2nd chart with all players going back to the 40s.

Calipari is challenging Dean Smith for title of "most NBA talent with fewest NCAA championships to show for it".

Calipari isn't keeping them long enough.

You don't need to. Wooden won titles when Jabbar, Walton, Wicks, etc. were all playing their first year of college hoops. Talent should win out, if you can coach it.

Why do you think Coach K, clearly the best coach of the past 30 years, has also adopted the one-and-done approach? Because it's obviously the best approach.