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B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #61
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
(03-24-2016 06:06 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(03-24-2016 02:14 AM)dxdtdemon Wrote:  I'm not saying that the Big Ten is as popular as Michael Jordan, the iPod, or the NFL, but it does have quite a bit of a loyal national following, and if the Michigan-Rutgers game is on FS2, there will be lots more demand for FS2.
If Fox could convince the Big Ten to allow Michigan-Rutgers to go on FS2, when it is in the Big Ten's interest to have it on BTN if it is not going OTA/ESPN, nor something in the ESPN2 / FS1 level of basic cable availability.

I don't know whether the Big Ten would allow some Big Ten basketball games on FS2 for the right price, but Big Ten FB games on FS2 does not sound like a plausible scenario.

Here is the Big East men's bball schedule for 2015-16. A few games went to FS2, but not many and not good.

And we weren't in much of a position to negotiate coverage and exposure details.
03-24-2016 07:15 AM
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PGEMF Offline
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Post: #62
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
(03-24-2016 02:14 AM)dxdtdemon Wrote:  
(03-23-2016 05:32 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(03-23-2016 04:01 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(03-23-2016 02:41 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(03-23-2016 01:41 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  The B1G already has games on CBSSports. Rutgers played a few games there last season so it looks like ESPN does and will continue to do the same thing.

Here's the thing though. Those day games on ESPN/ABC are all regional. Thats not exposure. Fox games would be national.

You seriously believe that Fox would think that there is OTA-level interest nationally in Rutgers vs Illinois?

There really isn't any reason to think that every B1G game worthy of national OTA broadcast isn't already being broadcast nationally OTA.

When did I say that? Also NYC/Chicago markets would be a factor if they wanted to show that game at like noon depending what other match ups were that weekend.

Point was, many seem to think that FOX has an advantage over ESPN re the B1G rights because they can air more OTA national games, and your post read that way to me. My contention is that this is a chimera, because the B1G already gets all of its games with national interest aired OTA anyway. It's not like there are Michigan - Ohio State games that are currently relegated to ESPN2 that FOX can jump in and say "we'll put that on Big Fox for you!".

If you aren't one of those who seem to think that, my apologies. 04-cheers

Actually, the fact that Ohio State-Michigan is no longer shown nationally on ABC could be the way that FOX can get the contract. The Big Ten is something that has enough popularity that it could transfer it's popularity to the various FOX networks.

Consider...

Adidas seemed to be the dominant worldwide leader in athletic apparel until Nike used Michael Jordan to propel them to the top.

Microsoft had a near monopoly on computing systems until the iPhone and "I'm a Mac, and I'm a PC" commercials started coming out, and lots of loyal iPod users switched to Apple.

There are lots of similar examples, like the NFL taking over the MLB as the most popular team sport in the US, etc. I'm not saying that the Big Ten is as popular as Michael Jordan, the iPod, or the NFL, but it does have quite a bit of a loyal national following, and if the Michigan-Rutgers game is on FS2, there will be lots more demand for FS2.

When hasn't it been shown nationally?
03-24-2016 11:41 AM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #63
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
Ohio St/Michigan has been shown nationally all the time. recent years noon Thanksgiving weekend Saturday.
03-24-2016 11:51 AM
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RutgersGuy Offline
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Post: #64
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
(03-23-2016 07:16 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(03-23-2016 04:29 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  Wait, so CBSSports isn't good enough but ESPN News is?

ESPNews is in 72 million homes on basic cable.
ESPN-U is in 73 million homes on basic cable.
CBS-SN is in 61 million homes, not on the basic cable tier.
http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/02...uary-2015/
http://www.foxsports.com/college-footbal...rks-050715

Quote:ESPNU? C'mon guys, I know you all have a hard on for ESPN but if Delany is adamant about exposure why would he sign off on any of those (SEC Network? 01-wingedeagle)? If they sign off on ESPN News thats no different than CBSSports.

I wasn't listing SEC network as an option for Big Ten games, but if ESPN has some kind of issue where they have to figure out how to show all of these games, they could run 3 SEC games on the SEC network.

And the games on ESPNews, I'm fairly sure, are games that otherwise would have been on BTN on a split feed, where half the footprint is watching Rutgers vs LAfayette and half the footprint is watching Illinois vs Southern Illinois. I don't think Delaney is going to sign off on Tier 1 Big Ten games on ESPNews.

Quote:You don't think they can have at least 2 OTA games a week on Fox? MLB is over by Halloween, Pac and XII are combined on once a week tops. Whats the actual hold up to them showing multiple OTA games?

Because they are contractually obligated to show other things.

EDIT: Here's a PDF of the Fox college football schedule for 2015. And here's a link to the Fox MLB regular season schedule. There was also a playoff game on FS1 on Sat Oct 17 and a World Series game on big FOX on Sat, OCt 31.

Plus UFC, and various other things Fox Sports has.

I already posted a link with the full schedule of MLB playoff games last year. 3 games Fox of FS1 aired were on a saturday. Whats your point? I already addressed that. Once again, because they have other properties doesn't mean they can't air multiple OTA B1G games most weekends.

A 50/50 split means they will be willing to take less money, something that Delany hasn't indicated he is open to doing. Pitting ESPN against Fox is what will make the league the most money.
03-24-2016 12:19 PM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #65
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
Fox has shown absolutely no inclination to have tripleheaders any weekend, let alone every weekend.

Also- it's not just the playoffs for MLB. They have a game of the week every week of the season on fox or fs1. So like last year that was 5 weeks of baseball with games every Saturday- 9 windows.

Then you have the Big 12 and Pac 12. 14 games-minimum. And here's the thing. most all of those would be conference games, so in October/November.

And haven't even mentioned the UFC.

Look, I get that you are hell bent on going to Fox. But it really just isn't realistic. ESPN almost guaranteed is going to be part of the Big Ten package.....
03-24-2016 12:52 PM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #66
RE: B1G rights hit the market... need a lawyer to explain something...
(03-24-2016 12:19 PM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  I already posted a link with the full schedule of MLB playoff games last year. 3 games Fox of FS1 aired were on a saturday. Whats your point? I already addressed that. Once again, because they have other properties doesn't mean they can't air multiple OTA B1G games most weekends.

It kinda does, but I'm not interested in digging up everything Fox and FoxSports1 showed last year, most of which they have contracts saying how much has to be on FOX OTA. There are 13 x 3 = 39 or so "windows" on FOX-OTA on Saturdays during most college football seasons, 18 are spoken for with PAC-12 and Big 12, a half dozen are committed to MLB. That leaves a max of 15. I'm pretty sure some other FOX-OTA Saturday slots are spoken for, but I"m going to leave it there because theoretically Fox could bump a few of those (extra MLB, PAC, XII games) to FoxSports1. (Also I think a couple of PAC-12 games on Fox had super-late start times).

You can't fit 2 Big Ten games a week for 12-13 Saturdays into 15 windows. And that ignores the main attraction of the Big TEn for Fox--building up FoxSPorts1 so they can boost the per-subscriber price.

Quote:A 50/50 split means they will be willing to take less money, something that Delany hasn't indicated he is open to doing. Pitting ESPN against Fox is what will make the league the most money.

That only works if ESPN and Fox are both desperate to get the whole package. What's pretty likely is both ESPN and Fox tell Delaney "We're looking at $250M for the whole package, or $150 for our half of an even-steven split." (Assuming that ESPN doesn't tell Delaney "You don't have to spread this around, but Disney HQ is telling us that we can't spend any money on anything.")

The current ESPN-Big Ten package covers up to about 40 football games. The Big Ten might be in a position somewhat like the Pac-12 was. They had (making up numbers) 50 games to sell, and ESPN only wanted 20 and Fox only wanted 20. But they got ESPN and Fox to pay for the 20 what they would have paid for the 50, because the value is concentrated in the first 20.

What Fox really wants is to be able to put Big Ten football on Fox Sports 1, creating a habit of including FS1 in the channel flipping rotation with ESPN/2/U/OTA on Saturdays. Fox Sports 1 is fairly crowded, but not as crowded as Fox-OTA. So let's say 1-2 games a week, 20 games during the season. Another 10 games on Fox-OTA.

You may notice that 20 plus 10 is 30. And Fox could easily live with 20, 10 on Fox-OTA and 10 on FoxSports1. 10 weeks of Big Ten at noon, Big XII at 4 and PAC-12 at 8 (all times eastern) is pretty solid. (OK, less than 10 because FS1 has other programming.)
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2016 01:06 PM by johnbragg.)
03-24-2016 01:05 PM
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