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Ron / Rand
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shiftyeagle Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Ron / Rand
^this for the most part. Charisma has nothing to do with it because Ron is not charismatic. He is, however, is a total stalwart when it comes to his beliefs of laissez-faire economics, individual liberty, and a foreign policy of non-interventionism. He was really good at rallies and had a "hip" side to him that resulted in a yuge cult following (myself included).

I actually like Rand better, but he's received even less press and less time in the debates that his father did. Which in itself is incredible. And honestly, the time he has received he hasn't done enough with it and he's a bit soft-spoken to boot. I don't think he's gone neo-con at all, in fact I think his views have become more and more like his father's during the campaign. He just simply has not gotten any traction or momentum. He should do better in New Hampshire because there are quite a few libertarians there, but who knows. This election season is cray.

The Lindsey Graham situation sounds A LOT like what happened down here with Thad Cochran and Chris McDaniel's Senate runoff a couple years ago. Cochran's good-ole-boy network went around to all the black neighborhoods saying that McDaniel is going to take all their entitlements away to score them into voting for Thad. Subsequently enough of those folks crossed over party lines to put Cochran in office for like the 32nd straight year.
(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 09:50 AM by shiftyeagle.)
02-02-2016 09:49 AM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-01-2016 11:07 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:05 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  As a 23 year old man, I can tell you, a lot of people my age are on the Sanders bandwagon, as sad as that is.

You may dislike the politics but that's the politics of the future.
No it isn't. Eventually those snot nosed brats have to pay taxes. Id like Sanders too if he was promising "free" college but eventually you become one of the people that pays for it.

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02-02-2016 10:16 AM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-01-2016 11:18 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:14 PM)Motown Bronco Wrote:  A socialist will be in the 'Final Four' for POTUS, even if he doesn't win the whole thing. It's only a matter of time before someone does.

No one wants to hear about pesky "debt" or dry terms like "capital flight."

Still, I can't help but think that a libertarian had his strengths in twenty somethings. Are Milennials just confused?

No, a majority of us just want to hear the word "free" over and over. Along with, "Tax the rich more".

Those that are conservative (such as myself) do tend to lean towards the Libertarian route.
What is so appealing about taxing the "rich"? Note the quotations.

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(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 10:19 AM by blunderbuss.)
02-02-2016 10:18 AM
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EverRespect Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Ron / Rand
I like Rand, but he comes across as weak. Not a good look for the low info yahoo crowd, which is probably 80% of the electorate. In 20 years of following this stuff, I have yet to see a libertarian candidate come across as strong. I think that is what's missing. It is like their ideology is caused by too much soy and flax in their diet. They need someone like Chris Christie arguing the same points and there could be some traction.
02-02-2016 10:58 AM
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ragincajun019 Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Ron / Rand
Rand is enough like his dad to turn off some of the Republican mainstream, but not nearly enough like his dad to get any of the youth support (especially from independents/moderate dems).

I honestly believe Ron was the only candidate who could have beaten Obama, because many of those young and/or indy/moderate dems who supported him ended up viewing Obama as the lesser of two evils compared with Romney, though they aligned most with Ron. He would have had most/all of the GOP support and many Obama castaways.

Rand does not have that crossover support.
02-02-2016 11:06 AM
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BleedsHuskieRed Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Ron / Rand
Rand isn't his dad. Some same ideas, but panders a lot. I, like GTS, donated money to Ron. Will not give anything to Rand. I will be donating to Gary Johnson this time around.
02-02-2016 11:22 AM
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Motown Bronco Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Ron / Rand
At the time, I thought Rand's all-day filibuster in 2013 over drones could've been the springboard he needed. But yeah, he never really grabbed a piece of the spotlight and held on to it.
02-02-2016 11:23 AM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-01-2016 10:58 PM)Motown Bronco Wrote:  Watching the caucus, they kept flashing back to 2012 and I'm reminded of how solid Ron Paul did in Iowa. Ron didn't quite get the Sanders level of frenzy, but I think he could've if there were only 2-3 GOP candidates from the get-go (like Bernie lucked out with). Ron actually enjoyed plenty of support from Millenials.

So for those more in the know, what went wrong for Rand? He had the golden opportunity to keep up the rEVOLution his old man started as a younger, smoother man. Did he go too neocon? Not charismatic enough? Where did he go wrong?

None of the front runners on either side are fiscal conservative, social liberals. Awful slate of candidates

The problem for Rand will always be that he just isn't a Republican. He's never going to be accepted in that party enough to get the nomination. And before you Trumpet, he will experience the same fate in the end.

But as far a going neocon, I think he's likely the farthest from a neocon of any of the Republican candidates. He's usually the voice of reason in the room when the others want to send in the military.
(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 02:19 PM by Redwingtom.)
02-02-2016 02:18 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-01-2016 11:07 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:05 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  As a 23 year old man, I can tell you, a lot of people my age are on the Sanders bandwagon, as sad as that is.

You may dislike the politics but that's the politics of the future.

LOL, no it isn't. People grow out of that crap once they get a job, and realize it's their money the Bernie types are wanting to play with.
(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 02:31 PM by Kronke.)
02-02-2016 02:31 PM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 11:22 AM)BleedsHuskieRed Wrote:  Rand isn't his dad. Some same ideas, but panders a lot. I, like GTS, donated money to Ron. Will not give anything to Rand. I will be donating to Gary Johnson this time around.

Lmao. I've heard of wasting your vote but... wow.

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02-02-2016 02:33 PM
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wmubroncopilot Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 02:33 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  
(02-02-2016 11:22 AM)BleedsHuskieRed Wrote:  Rand isn't his dad. Some same ideas, but panders a lot. I, like GTS, donated money to Ron. Will not give anything to Rand. I will be donating to Gary Johnson this time around.

Lmao. I've heard of wasting your vote but... wow.

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I may throw some money Johnson's way too. Be wasting it more helping one of the statist frontrunners.
02-02-2016 02:57 PM
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-01-2016 11:07 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:05 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  As a 23 year old man, I can tell you, a lot of people my age are on the Sanders bandwagon, as sad as that is.

You may dislike the politics but that's the politics of the future.

Until the money runs out, which it will.
02-02-2016 03:16 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 03:16 PM)VA49er Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:07 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:05 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  As a 23 year old man, I can tell you, a lot of people my age are on the Sanders bandwagon, as sad as that is.

You may dislike the politics but that's the politics of the future.

Until the money runs out, which it will.

03-zzz

We see this tired old meme all the time. However, the money already ran out! It ran out many years ago and then ran out again in 2002 shortly after the first round of Bush tax cuts and reckless spending.

[Image: P28ZmpjGqC5_r6lrh0rJmdcLN2_K8YuLkWXwuVi4...zMVTZhyACA]

Well, we're still here aren't we?
(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 03:38 PM by Redwingtom.)
02-02-2016 03:36 PM
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shiftyeagle Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Ron / Rand
I miss 1990's Republican budgets.
02-02-2016 03:39 PM
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CameramanJ Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Ron / Rand
What would it take for Rand to be a more successful candidate the next time around, assuming he finds the motivation to run again? I'm sure there will be a filibuster or some other sort of political shenanigans sometime in the next four years, but clearly that wasn't enough this time. I hope that he sharpens into more of a statesman. Not getting steamrolled by an opposing cult of personality would help too.
02-02-2016 04:09 PM
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wmubroncopilot Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 04:09 PM)CameramanJ Wrote:  What would it take for Rand to be a more successful candidate the next time around, assuming he finds the motivation to run again? I'm sure there will be a filibuster or some other sort of political shenanigans sometime in the next four years, but clearly that wasn't enough this time. I hope that he sharpens into more of a statesman. Not getting steamrolled by an opposing cult of personality would help too.

At the very least he needs to decide how he's going to run (what issues to emphasize, how to present them, etc) and stick to it. He hems and haws on how libertarian he wants to be and ends up alienating both sides.
02-02-2016 04:11 PM
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Redwingtom Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 04:11 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  
(02-02-2016 04:09 PM)CameramanJ Wrote:  What would it take for Rand to be a more successful candidate the next time around, assuming he finds the motivation to run again? I'm sure there will be a filibuster or some other sort of political shenanigans sometime in the next four years, but clearly that wasn't enough this time. I hope that he sharpens into more of a statesman. Not getting steamrolled by an opposing cult of personality would help too.

At the very least he needs to decide how he's going to run (what issues to emphasize, how to present them, etc) and stick to it. He hems and haws on how libertarian he wants to be and ends up alienating both sides.

Yep. He needs to embrace the Libertarian wing which I really feel he's best suited for. The problem is that there is not money for him there to run with. The two-party system screws all that up. They have all the money and power. Unless you're a gazillionaire like Trump or Perot, you can't compete.
02-02-2016 04:18 PM
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Blazer4Life14 Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 10:18 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:18 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:14 PM)Motown Bronco Wrote:  A socialist will be in the 'Final Four' for POTUS, even if he doesn't win the whole thing. It's only a matter of time before someone does.

No one wants to hear about pesky "debt" or dry terms like "capital flight."

Still, I can't help but think that a libertarian had his strengths in twenty somethings. Are Milennials just confused?

No, a majority of us just want to hear the word "free" over and over. Along with, "Tax the rich more".

Those that are conservative (such as myself) do tend to lean towards the Libertarian route.
What is so appealing about taxing the "rich"? Note the quotations.

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Because most in my generation don't admire/have the work ethic that those who are "rich" have, so instead of following the lead, they just tend to say that those people have "expendable income" or somehow "stole" that money from someone else, without knowing their financial situation.

Example: A Bernie moron has told me recently my parents (who are admittedly well off) need to pay at least 33% in taxes despite the fact that they have just finished up paying for most of my college, currently paying for my sister's college, all while still having two younger children to take care of in their own home. My generation immediately assumes anyone who makes a decent amount of money probably doesn't deserve it, or thinks they make too much without caring what all they have going on in their lives.

In short, this is the motto of my pathetic generation: "We deserve more for doing less"
02-02-2016 07:42 PM
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bullet Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 04:09 PM)CameramanJ Wrote:  What would it take for Rand to be a more successful candidate the next time around, assuming he finds the motivation to run again? I'm sure there will be a filibuster or some other sort of political shenanigans sometime in the next four years, but clearly that wasn't enough this time. I hope that he sharpens into more of a statesman. Not getting steamrolled by an opposing cult of personality would help too.

An alternative reality.

He's done. Rubio or Cruz might have a chance again if they lose. For the rest, this is their only chance.
02-02-2016 07:53 PM
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blunderbuss Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Ron / Rand
(02-02-2016 07:42 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  
(02-02-2016 10:18 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:18 PM)Blazer4Life14 Wrote:  
(02-01-2016 11:14 PM)Motown Bronco Wrote:  A socialist will be in the 'Final Four' for POTUS, even if he doesn't win the whole thing. It's only a matter of time before someone does.

No one wants to hear about pesky "debt" or dry terms like "capital flight."

Still, I can't help but think that a libertarian had his strengths in twenty somethings. Are Milennials just confused?

No, a majority of us just want to hear the word "free" over and over. Along with, "Tax the rich more".

Those that are conservative (such as myself) do tend to lean towards the Libertarian route.
What is so appealing about taxing the "rich"? Note the quotations.

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Because most in my generation don't admire/have the work ethic that those who are "rich" have, so instead of following the lead, they just tend to say that those people have "expendable income" or somehow "stole" that money from someone else, without knowing their financial situation.

Example: A Bernie moron has told me recently my parents (who are admittedly well off) need to pay at least 33% in taxes despite the fact that they have just finished up paying for most of my college, currently paying for my sister's college, all while still having two younger children to take care of in their own home. My generation immediately assumes anyone who makes a decent amount of money probably doesn't deserve it, or thinks they make too much without caring what all they have going on in their lives.

In short, this is the motto of my pathetic generation: "We deserve more for doing less"
Your folks probably pay that already but I get your point. Consider yourself lucky, be thankful and take advantage of a good situation. That's the best advice I can give a 23 year old right now.

I was from a different and of the spectrum. I remember being jealous of what other kids had. I hate to admit that but it drove me to do something. Now days it seems like anybody disadvantaged just blames everybody but themselves. Misery loves company I guess. They think the "rich" need to pay. That mindset isn't what made this country great.

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(This post was last modified: 02-02-2016 11:05 PM by blunderbuss.)
02-02-2016 11:02 PM
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