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yet another division idea...
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jaminandjachin Offline
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Post: #61
RE: yet another division idea...
Leave divisions where they are and be more open to teams scheduling a conference team to count as a non conference game. That would satisfy those who want a nine game schedule without having to force the entire league to do it.
01-12-2016 11:24 AM
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georgia_tech_swagger Offline
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Post: #62
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-12-2016 11:09 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Say deregulation does pass & anything goes, what's the census on the top alternatives?

Mine would be the divisionless 3-5-5 or switching 3 set teams out every other year.

No divisions. Keep a few permanent rivals (3 to 5). Rotate everybody else. Top two teams go to the title game.
01-12-2016 11:31 AM
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georgia_tech_swagger Offline
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Post: #63
RE: yet another division idea...
I'd go with 5 permanent rivals to appease everyone. With 5 permanent rivals:

Miami: FSU, Pitt, BC, Cuse, UofL
FSU: Miami, GT, Clemson, VT, NCST
Clem: GT, NCST, FSU, Wake, VT
GT: Clemson, UNC, Duke, UVA, FSU
UNC: NCST, Duke, Wake, GT, UVA
NCST: UNC, Wake, Duke, Clemson, FSU
Duke: UNC, Wake, NCST, GT, UVA
Wake: UNC, Duke, NCST, Clemson, BC
UVA: UNC, Duke, VT, GT, UofL
VT: UVA, Clemson, Pitt, FSU, Cuse
Pitt: VT, BC, Cuse, UofL, Miami,
UofL: Pitt, BC, Cuse, UVA, Miami
BC: Cuse, UofL, Pitt, Miami, Wake
Cuse: BC, UofL, Pitt, Miami, VT
01-12-2016 11:44 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #64
RE: yet another division idea...
I can see why G tech would be mad losing the clemson game but they are in a spot where winning solves attendance problems. I mean a schedule with FSU, Miami, UVA, UGA every year is pretty good. Also, I would give G tech a annual ND game as part of the deal, so that's 5 solid games to go with BC, cuse, pitt, and Lville. Add another rotated ACC game for 10 h/a.
01-12-2016 12:03 PM
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georgia_tech_swagger Offline
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Post: #65
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-12-2016 12:03 PM)bluesox Wrote:  I can see why G tech would be mad losing the clemson game but they are in a spot where winning solves attendance problems. I mean a schedule with FSU, Miami, UVA, UGA every year is pretty good. Also, I would give G tech a annual ND game as part of the deal, so that's 5 solid games to go with BC, cuse, pitt, and Lville. Add another rotated ACC game for 10 h/a.

FSU would be a sellout every other year. UGA would be a sellout every other year. Miami would not be a sellout. Above average, but not a sellout. UVA would be average. BC, Cuse, Pitt, and UofL would all be well below average.

And if you want to help GT, you won't do it by giving them the NCST powderpuff schedule. The tards in Athens demand stiffer practice. If you want to help GT, start by firing AD Mike Bobinski, doing a complete restructuring and cleaning of house at the GTAA, and reboot the A-T Fund to be FAR more aggressively marketed like IPTAY. Given how football, men's basketball, baseball, women's basketball, volleyball .... hell pretty much everything but golf is going in the wrong direction along with deep financial systemic flaws ... I think you'd have pretty good fan support for a total cleaning of house right now.
(This post was last modified: 01-12-2016 01:50 PM by georgia_tech_swagger.)
01-12-2016 01:46 PM
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nzmorange Offline
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Post: #66
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-12-2016 11:44 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  I'd go with 5 permanent rivals to appease everyone. With 5 permanent rivals:

Miami: FSU, Pitt, BC, Cuse, UofL
FSU: Miami, GT, Clemson, VT, NCST
Clem: GT, NCST, FSU, Wake, VT
GT: Clemson, UNC, Duke, UVA, FSU
UNC: NCST, Duke, Wake, GT, UVA
NCST: UNC, Wake, Duke, Clemson, FSU
Duke: UNC, Wake, NCST, GT, UVA
Wake: UNC, Duke, NCST, Clemson, BC
UVA: UNC, Duke, VT, GT, UofL
VT: UVA, Clemson, Pitt, FSU, Cuse
Pitt: VT, BC, Cuse, UofL, Miami,
UofL: Pitt, BC, Cuse, UVA, Miami
BC: Cuse, UofL, Pitt, Miami, Wake
Cuse: BC, UofL, Pitt, Miami, VT

You talked me into it.
01-12-2016 11:42 PM
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esayem Offline
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Post: #67
RE: yet another division idea...
Wake Forest and VT should be every year if there are going to be multiple permanent rivals.
01-13-2016 10:03 AM
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esayem Offline
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Post: #68
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-12-2016 11:24 AM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  Leave divisions where they are and be more open to teams scheduling a conference team to count as a non conference game. That would satisfy those who want a nine game schedule without having to force the entire league to do it.

I think that is probably going the be the way to go.
01-13-2016 10:05 AM
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Hokie Mark Offline
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Post: #69
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-13-2016 10:05 AM)esayem Wrote:  
(01-12-2016 11:24 AM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  Leave divisions where they are and be more open to teams scheduling a conference team to count as a non conference game. That would satisfy those who want a nine game schedule without having to force the entire league to do it.

I think that is probably going the be the way to go.

+1. I still think it's possible to pass an NCAA rule change which (1) still requires 12 teams for a CCG, (2) still requires 2 division winners play in it, but (3) does NOT require full round-robin within the divisions. (I could see both the B1G and the SEC getting behind that last one).
01-13-2016 10:13 AM
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ren.hoek Offline
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Post: #70
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-13-2016 10:13 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  
(01-13-2016 10:05 AM)esayem Wrote:  
(01-12-2016 11:24 AM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  Leave divisions where they are and be more open to teams scheduling a conference team to count as a non conference game. That would satisfy those who want a nine game schedule without having to force the entire league to do it.

I think that is probably going the be the way to go.

+1. I still think it's possible to pass an NCAA rule change which (1) still requires 12 teams for a CCG, (2) still requires 2 division winners play in it, but (3) does NOT require full round-robin within the divisions. (I could see both the B1G and the SEC getting behind that last one).

not sure that would pass just because divisions without full round robin is essentially a divisionless setup for all intents and purposes. tie breakers within a division would get messy.
01-13-2016 10:25 AM
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ken d Offline
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Post: #71
RE: yet another division idea...
Whenever we discuss ACC division alignment, I think we tend to look for symmetrical solutions to whatever perceived problems there may be. We may even impose our notions of "fairness" on potential solutions. Personally, I tend to be more concerned with maintaining traditional relationships and geographic rivalries than I do with either of those criteria. The only symmetry I care about is that every school have four home games and four away games in conference play.

So this may be a little out there for some of us, but what the heck. It's not like our opinions influence the outcome much. Here's a suggestion.

Atlantic Division:

Louisville
Va Tech
Miami
Pitt
Syracuse
BC
Wake Forest

Coastal Division:

Florida State
Clemson
Ga Tech
UNC
NC State
Duke
Virginia

Now here's where I start to break from that symmetry thing. I don't think it is necessary that if one school has a protected crossover rival that everybody should have one. In this set up, I would only have a few annual crossovers: FSU - Miami, Virginia - Va Tech, Wake Forest - Duke and Wake Forest - UNC. And, to compensate Wake for being the odd man out of the four NC schools, I would want to assure them that they will have permanent OOC home and home arrangements with both Virginia and NC State.

Beyond that, every school should be allowed to play any other ACC school OOC if that meets the needs of both schools. For some, like Clemson, who usually has two SEC opponents each year, that won't leave room for another ACC opponent unless they agree to always play in Death Valley. That's the only way they get the 7 home games they want very much. Pitt may not want any more ACC opponents if they could have West Virginia and Penn State on their schedule every year instead.

A downside of my arrangement is that Wake Forest would probably never get to play FSU, Clemson and Ga Tech (and vice versa). But some folks here might consider that an upside - that's the nature of realignment discussions. It's a tradeoff for getting all of the NC and Virginia schools every year. Personally, I think it's OK if some schools have more schools in their rotation than others. Heck, for many years, some of those schools rarely played each other anyway.

Will my "solution" insure that the best two teams play for the championship every year? Absolutely not. So what? Until we consistently have three teams in the NY6 mix, we are more likely to get two if our second best team doesn't get another loss to knock them out of contention. And in some years, we will have the two best in the CCG. Are these two divisions "balanced" strength-wise? Not at the moment. But that could change. Besides, the SEC West is felt to be much superior to the SEC East, and that doesn't seem to hurt them any.

I just don't think asymmetry is a bad thing if it helps more members get to play the schools they really want to play as often as possible.
(This post was last modified: 01-25-2016 03:29 PM by ken d.)
01-25-2016 03:21 PM
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KRoach11 Offline
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Post: #72
RE: yet another division idea...
Here is a North/South proposal with the Carolina/Virginia schools rotating between divisions to protect their rivalries. End result is a 3-5-5.

North: BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Louisville

Atlantic: VT, NC St, Wake
Coastal: UVA, UNC, Duke

South: Clemson, GT, FSU, Miami

North: play each other (3), the Atlantic/Coastal in division (rotate every 2 years, 3 games) & 2 South teams for total of 8.

South: same format as North with the Opposite Atlantic/Coastal division opponents of the rotation.

Atlantic/coastal: play each other (2), 1 permanent crossover (VA/VT, NC/NCST, Wake/Duke), 1 other rotating crossover & the 4 North or South "divisional"
opponents.

Everyone plays 3 teams yearly, everyone at least 2 of 4 years, divisions marketed as North and South, everyone plays at least 1 Florida team, 1 Virginia team, 2 Carolina schools every year.
01-26-2016 10:38 PM
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Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Offline
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Post: #73
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-08-2016 01:57 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  swap GT for Louisville, which is fairly even competitively.
rearrange crossover rivalries as follows
BC-Louisville
GT-Virginia
Clemson-VT

other crossovers are unchanged.

cue the divisionless advocates to comment in 3, 2, 1,...

I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.
01-28-2016 01:58 PM
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Hokie Mark Offline
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Post: #74
RE: yet another division idea...
Forget all that...

[Image: beervswine.png]

Beer vs Wine.

Some schools have blue-collar, beer-drinking student bodies; other teams attract more of the wine & cheese crowd.

Beer Division
Va Tech
Clemson
Florida State
NC State
Ga Tech
Pittsburgh
Louisville

Wine Division
Duke
N Carolina
Virginia
Wake Forest
Boston College
Syracuse
Miami

GREAT FOR TAILGATING!

OR, you could divide the teams based on how many words in the name of the university.

One Word Names
Clemson
Duke
Louisville
Miami
Pittsburgh
Syracuse
Virginia

Two Word Names
Boston College
Florida State
Georgia Tech
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Virginia Tech
Wake Forest

Makes no rivalry sense, but it's actually kind of balanced.

OR, you could just go with Red vs Blue(-ish)

We could base division on primary jersey colors (replace Maryland with Louisville - both are red).

[Image: colors.jpg]

Look, there are Red vs. Blue fans already!

[Image: 515ExHds8jL._SX258_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg]

[previously published here].
01-28-2016 02:10 PM
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TIGER-PAUL Offline
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Post: #75
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-28-2016 01:58 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  
(01-08-2016 01:57 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  swap GT for Louisville, which is fairly even competitively.
rearrange crossover rivalries as follows
BC-Louisville
GT-Virginia
Clemson-VT

other crossovers are unchanged.

cue the divisionless advocates to comment in 3, 2, 1,...

I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.

I would too, but I would think Ville and for sure GaTech would want it and I haven't seen Tech saying they are unhappy or requesting anything different.
01-28-2016 05:21 PM
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Lenvillecards Offline
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Post: #76
yet another division idea...
(01-28-2016 05:21 PM)TIGER-PAUL Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 01:58 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  
(01-08-2016 01:57 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  swap GT for Louisville, which is fairly even competitively.
rearrange crossover rivalries as follows
BC-Louisville
GT-Virginia
Clemson-VT

other crossovers are unchanged.

cue the divisionless advocates to comment in 3, 2, 1,...

I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.

I would too, but I would think Ville and for sure GaTech would want it and I haven't seen Tech saying they are unhappy or requesting anything different.

Ville would rather play FSU & Clemson but if you switch our crossover to either GT or Clemson than we would be happy.
01-28-2016 05:35 PM
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Dasville Offline
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Post: #77
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-28-2016 05:35 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 05:21 PM)TIGER-PAUL Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 01:58 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  
(01-08-2016 01:57 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  swap GT for Louisville, which is fairly even competitively.
rearrange crossover rivalries as follows
BC-Louisville
GT-Virginia
Clemson-VT

other crossovers are unchanged.

cue the divisionless advocates to comment in 3, 2, 1,...

I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.

I would too, but I would think Ville and for sure GaTech would want it and I haven't seen Tech saying they are unhappy or requesting anything different.

Ville would rather play FSU & Clemson but if you switch our crossover to either GT or Clemson than we would be happy.

I'd take this, though I would rather play FSU and Clemson every year. The Coastal would provide us a football schedule against the better basketball schools. Might help build rivalries.04-cheers
01-28-2016 06:05 PM
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nzmorange Offline
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Post: #78
RE: yet another division idea...
(01-28-2016 06:05 PM)Dasville Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 05:35 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 05:21 PM)TIGER-PAUL Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 01:58 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  
(01-08-2016 01:57 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  swap GT for Louisville, which is fairly even competitively.
rearrange crossover rivalries as follows
BC-Louisville
GT-Virginia
Clemson-VT

other crossovers are unchanged.

cue the divisionless advocates to comment in 3, 2, 1,...

I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.

I would too, but I would think Ville and for sure GaTech would want it and I haven't seen Tech saying they are unhappy or requesting anything different.

Ville would rather play FSU & Clemson but if you switch our crossover to either GT or Clemson than we would be happy.

I'd take this, though I would rather play FSU and Clemson every year. The Coastal would provide us a football schedule against the better basketball schools. Might help build rivalries.04-cheers

I don't see GT-Duke ending easily. There isn't a way to rearrange divisions that's better than the status quo without going to a 3-5-5 formal.
01-28-2016 06:17 PM
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Dasville Offline
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Post: #79
RE: yet another division idea...
What did Maryland want when they were in the Conference regarding divisions?
01-28-2016 06:19 PM
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Lenvillecards Offline
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Post: #80
yet another division idea...
(01-28-2016 06:17 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 06:05 PM)Dasville Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 05:35 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 05:21 PM)TIGER-PAUL Wrote:  
(01-28-2016 01:58 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I prefer the status quo but I could certainly live with this scenario.

I would too, but I would think Ville and for sure GaTech would want it and I haven't seen Tech saying they are unhappy or requesting anything different.

Ville would rather play FSU & Clemson but if you switch our crossover to either GT or Clemson than we would be happy.

I'd take this, though I would rather play FSU and Clemson every year. The Coastal would provide us a football schedule against the better basketball schools. Might help build rivalries.04-cheers

I don't see GT-Duke ending easily. There isn't a way to rearrange divisions that's better than the status quo without going to a 3-5-5 formal.

If anything changes, I like the suggestion to switch VT & Syracuse. Or rotating 2-3 set teams every other year.

Perhaps something like this:
Atlantic - Coastal
FSU - Miami
Clemson-GT
VT - Virginia
NC State-NC
WF - Duke
Rotate
Louisville-Pittsburgh
Syracuse-BC

Louisville, Pitt, Cuse & BC would play each other every year & rotate between the divisions every other year. The 5 set divisional teams would play their permanent crossover & then rotate through the other division. They would complete the rotation H&A in 8 years.

You could also rotate the 4 NC schools, allowing them to play each other every year.

Atlantic - Coastal
FSU - Miami
Clemson-GT
Louisville-Virginia
Syracuse-Pittsburgh
BC - VT
Rotate
NC State- NC
WF - Duke
01-28-2016 07:33 PM
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