How about putting some of these games on ABC instead of ESPN? Maybe that would help ratings.

(01-08-2016 02:37 PM)bullet Wrote:  If I were ESPN, who owns all of those contracts, I would talk to the SEC and Big 12 about a sweetener to move the Sugar to NYE night 4 out of 6 years (staying on NYD night when it is a playoff game).
Fiesta would be 4 out of 6 4 pm NYE and NYD night the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Peach would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYE and 12:00 pm NYD the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Orange would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYD and switch with Peach when the Peach was a playoff game.
Cotton would float-NYD night when playoff, NYE night when Sugar is a playoff, NYE 4pm when Fiesta is a playoff.
Let Rose keep its slot, for now.

So the two playoff games would always be on NYD-4 out of 6 it would be noon and 8 and two years it would be 4 and 8.

That's likely the most reasonable solution given the contractual constraints that are in place.

(01-08-2016 01:37 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  lol. Suck it, ESPN!!!!

It's not like any of this is ESPN's fault. They tried like hell to get the semifinal dates changed for exactly this reason, and were rebuffed by the CFP members. The lousy ratings were predictable, as evidenced by the fact that the media partner actually did predict it.

Eventually, the cost of this debacle will be passed on to the CFP, as it should be. Whether that happens sooner, or doesn't happen until the next contract negotiation, it will happen.

(01-08-2016 02:39 PM)Big Frog II Wrote:  How about putting some of these games on ABC instead of ESPN? Maybe that would help ratings.

Won't happen. Yes, it would help the ratings portion, but then Disney cannot incorporate the expenses of the College Football Playoff into ESPN's carriage fees (which are worth much more than anything that ABC can provide). The same sporting event is worth MUCH more on ESPN compared to ABC (just as the same sporting event is worth MUCH more on your local regional sports network compared to your local over-the-air channel). That's why sports have migrated so heavily to cable for the past 30 years.

(01-08-2016 02:37 PM)bullet Wrote:  If I were ESPN, who owns all of those contracts, I would talk to the SEC and Big 12 about a sweetener to move the Sugar to NYE night 4 out of 6 years (staying on NYD night when it is a playoff game).
Fiesta would be 4 out of 6 4 pm NYE and NYD night the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Peach would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYE and 12:00 pm NYD the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Orange would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYD and switch with Peach when the Peach was a playoff game.
Cotton would float-NYD night when playoff, NYE night when Sugar is a playoff, NYE 4pm when Fiesta is a playoff.
Let Rose keep its slot, for now.

So the two playoff games would always be on NYD-4 out of 6 it would be noon and 8 and two years it would be 4 and 8.

That makes a lot of sense. But the CFP has no sense at all. They will get away with this for the next 2 years because Dec 31 is on a Saturday in 2016 and the games go back to the Sugar and Rose for 2017-18.

But, they need to address the kickoff times right now for Dec 31, 2016 They need to kickoff the Peach Bowl at 2:00pm and the Fiesta Bowl at 6pm to avoid people leaving their TV sets for a NYE party.

what motivation would the Big 12 and SEC have to move their game to the worst slot? That's just ******* stupid and a complete non starter. Yeah, screw the SEC/Big 12, but let the Rose Bowl/Big Ten/Pac 12 get their flaunted slot. And yes, I do think the SEC is thinking this more and more.

(01-08-2016 02:55 PM)stever20 Wrote:  what motivation would the Big 12 and SEC have to move their game to the worst slot? That's just ******* stupid and a complete non starter. Yeah, screw the SEC/Big 12, but let the Rose Bowl/Big Ten/Pac 12 get their flaunted slot. And yes, I do think the SEC is thinking this more and more.

Well, the Rose Bowl IS the significantly more valuable property. The SEC can deny it and not want it to be the case, but it's a simple fact. They're lucky that they're getting paid an equal amount for the much less valuable Sugar Bowl. Now, I agree that the SEC and Big 12 aren't going to move the Sugar Bowl out of the goodness of their hearts for free, though. The only motivation is if ESPN ponies up even more money to be able to move the date of the game.

Well, thanks to the 15 posters who replied simultaneously to explain the contractual inner workings of the ad business. I didn't know it was part of the contract. I thought the ad companies were trying to get something for nothing.

That said, it seems completely stupid to me for ESPN to "guarantee" ratings to their ad customers. That's their fault, entirely.

The only thing the CFP and conferences could've done would've been to provide teams that pull better ratings. Michigan St and Clemson are not mega-ratings teams. Sorry, they aren't.

(01-08-2016 03:14 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 02:55 PM)stever20 Wrote:  what motivation would the Big 12 and SEC have to move their game to the worst slot? That's just ******* stupid and a complete non starter. Yeah, screw the SEC/Big 12, but let the Rose Bowl/Big Ten/Pac 12 get their flaunted slot. And yes, I do think the SEC is thinking this more and more.

Well, the Rose Bowl IS the significantly more valuable property. The SEC can deny it and not want it to be the case, but it's a simple fact. They're lucky that they're getting paid an equal amount for the much less valuable Sugar Bowl. Now, I agree that the SEC and Big 12 aren't going to move the Sugar Bowl out of the goodness of their hearts for free, though. The only motivation is if ESPN ponies up even more money to be able to move the date of the game.

The question though is would the money that it would take to do that- it would be significant- 2 things. 1- would the Big Ten/Pac 12 want more money at that point- and 2- would it at that point not be worth it to ESPN to move things?

Also, I think if the Sugar got moved, it would be to after New Years and not NYE. That would be a complete and total non starter. I mean- ESPN comes to the SEC/Big 12. Hey we want you to move off of New Years night, and the reason is we don't want the semifinals on New Years eve night, but hey, we want to stick you there.

(01-08-2016 03:21 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well, thanks to the 15 posters who replied simultaneously to explain the contractual inner workings of the ad business. I didn't know it was part of the contract. I thought the ad companies were trying to get something for nothing.

That said, it seems completely stupid to me for ESPN to "guarantee" ratings to their ad customers. That's their fault, entirely.

The only thing the CFP and conferences could've done would've been to provide teams that pull better ratings. Michigan St and Clemson are not mega-ratings teams. Sorry, they aren't.

They guarantee a ratings range. Obviously a higher rating means higher ad revenue. It is a way to maximize ad revenue. It sometimes fails, but works more often that not.

If you were an advertiser, why would you advertise with a broadcaster that couldn't guarantee a minimum audience? You might, but you aren't going to pay a premium price for it.

(01-08-2016 01:37 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  lol. Suck it, ESPN!!!!

Couldn't agree with you more!!!!!! Cheers!!!!

(01-08-2016 02:51 PM)Metropolis777 Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 02:37 PM)bullet Wrote:  If I were ESPN, who owns all of those contracts, I would talk to the SEC and Big 12 about a sweetener to move the Sugar to NYE night 4 out of 6 years (staying on NYD night when it is a playoff game).
Fiesta would be 4 out of 6 4 pm NYE and NYD night the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Peach would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYE and 12:00 pm NYD the 2 years it was a playoff game.
Orange would be 4 out of 6 12:00 pm NYD and switch with Peach when the Peach was a playoff game.
Cotton would float-NYD night when playoff, NYE night when Sugar is a playoff, NYE 4pm when Fiesta is a playoff.
Let Rose keep its slot, for now.

So the two playoff games would always be on NYD-4 out of 6 it would be noon and 8 and two years it would be 4 and 8.

That makes a lot of sense. But the CFP has no sense at all. They will get away with this for the next 2 years because Dec 31 is on a Saturday in 2016 and the games go back to the Sugar and Rose for 2017-18.

But, they need to address the kickoff times right now for Dec 31, 2016 They need to kickoff the Peach Bowl at 2:00pm and the Fiesta Bowl at 6pm to avoid people leaving their TV sets for a NYE party.

Doesn't ESPN control the Dec. 31 kickoff times? The first two games that day should be the semifinal games. Cotton or Orange should get the 8 pm ET start.

(01-08-2016 03:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 03:14 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 02:55 PM)stever20 Wrote:  what motivation would the Big 12 and SEC have to move their game to the worst slot? That's just ******* stupid and a complete non starter. Yeah, screw the SEC/Big 12, but let the Rose Bowl/Big Ten/Pac 12 get their flaunted slot. And yes, I do think the SEC is thinking this more and more.

Well, the Rose Bowl IS the significantly more valuable property. The SEC can deny it and not want it to be the case, but it's a simple fact. They're lucky that they're getting paid an equal amount for the much less valuable Sugar Bowl. Now, I agree that the SEC and Big 12 aren't going to move the Sugar Bowl out of the goodness of their hearts for free, though. The only motivation is if ESPN ponies up even more money to be able to move the date of the game.

The question though is would the money that it would take to do that- it would be significant- 2 things. 1- would the Big Ten/Pac 12 want more money at that point- and 2- would it at that point not be worth it to ESPN to move things?

Also, I think if the Sugar got moved, it would be to after New Years and not NYE. That would be a complete and total non starter. I mean- ESPN comes to the SEC/Big 12. Hey we want you to move off of New Years night, and the reason is we don't want the semifinals on New Years eve night, but hey, we want to stick you there.

I've read complaints about low ratings on this board in the following ways:

a) ratings were down because NYE is obviously a worse day than NYD to play the game

b) ratings were down because the game was played before the playoff games, so the playoff games stole focus away from the game

c) ratings were down because the game was played after the playoff games, so the people didn't care about college football anymore at that point


Seems to me that you're screwed, any way you go. Unless you're a playoff game, on NYD.


I think it has a lot more to do with the teams involved. I can't guarantee that Ohio St v Alabama on NYE this season would've got the ratings that Ohio St v Alabama got on NYD last season. But I'm sure it would've been a more competitive game and it would've been between two mega-ratings teams, rather than just one.

The ratings for the CFP natty will be telling. I wouldn't say that Oregon is a mega-ratings team. And neither is Clemson. Then again, the midwest + the west is bigger/more populated than just the southeast.

(01-08-2016 03:38 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 03:21 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Well, thanks to the 15 posters who replied simultaneously to explain the contractual inner workings of the ad business. I didn't know it was part of the contract. I thought the ad companies were trying to get something for nothing.

That said, it seems completely stupid to me for ESPN to "guarantee" ratings to their ad customers. That's their fault, entirely.

The only thing the CFP and conferences could've done would've been to provide teams that pull better ratings. Michigan St and Clemson are not mega-ratings teams. Sorry, they aren't.

They guarantee a ratings range. Obviously a higher rating means higher ad revenue. It is a way to maximize ad revenue. It sometimes fails, but works more often that not.

If you were an advertiser, why would you advertise with a broadcaster that couldn't guarantee a minimum audience? You might, but you aren't going to pay a premium price for it.

Guy selling you a used car tells you "I guarantee you'll get at least 100,000 mi out of this baby! *giant, fake tooth smile* "

Who's the fool?


I mean ... am I really about to quote Tommy Boy?? "Look, if you want a guaranteed piece of ****, I can take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed."

(01-08-2016 02:45 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 02:39 PM)Big Frog II Wrote:  How about putting some of these games on ABC instead of ESPN? Maybe that would help ratings.

Won't happen. Yes, it would help the ratings portion, but then Disney cannot incorporate the expenses of the College Football Playoff into ESPN's carriage fees (which are worth much more than anything that ABC can provide). The same sporting event is worth MUCH more on ESPN compared to ABC (just as the same sporting event is worth MUCH more on your local regional sports network compared to your local over-the-air channel). That's why sports have migrated so heavily to cable for the past 30 years.

They make less money on broadcast TV, in general. Carriage fees are huge, huge money. More than advertising money.

That's why I think, eventually, they're going to pull all national content off of broadcast stations. FOX, ABC, NBC and CBS will have their own cable/streaming channels, just as they do now on Apple TV.

And this is why greed will be the ultimate undoing of College Football. Entities are looking out for their own good and not the greater good of the sport.

(01-08-2016 02:06 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 02:03 PM)Dasville Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 01:43 PM)stever20 Wrote:  a shame that almost certainly the Big Ten won't be morons and leave ESPN completely.

B1G and their digging in on Rose Bowl time slot is big reason for the ratings disaster. Losses, like taxes are passed on. B1G will lighten stance on Rose time slot or pay price in bidding. Just my opinion.

Uh, it has nothing to do with that here and it's quite unfair to single out the B1G when the Pac-12, SEC and Big 12 (the latter 2 via their protected Sugar Bowl time slot) have the exact same incentives. The Big Ten is going to get paid quite handsomely regardless of the CFP ratings - those two issues have nothing to do with each other.

jmo

(01-08-2016 03:53 PM)BamaScorpio69 Wrote:  And this is why greed will be the ultimate undoing of College Football. Entities are looking out for their own good and not the greater good of the sport.

The undoing of the sport is if players become university employees.

But that's outside this thread.

just love how the SEC/Big 12 are supposed to look out for the sport, but Big Ten/Pac 12 don't have to at all. Sorry but that's a load of BS.

(01-08-2016 03:59 PM)stever20 Wrote:  just love how the SEC/Big 12 are supposed to look out for the sport, but Big Ten/Pac 12 don't have to at all. Sorry but that's a load of BS.

Why don't we just call it even and say that the CFP semi's will no longer be connected to bowl games?

Make them standalone and bid out the venues. Done.

And if it was up to me, I'd also try to work with the NFL or whatever has to be done so that these standalone CFP semi games can always be played on the Saturday, except when the Saturday is NYD.