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truest blue tiger Offline
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Post: #1
Another way to view it
I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.
12-14-2015 02:07 PM
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Antonio5fan Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.


Better players make better coaches. I don't think any of the players besides Will Barton ever lived up to the hype coming into Josh's program. Austin is yet to be determined. JJ had a good career and with better rebounders he might have been much better. He occasionally was the best rebounder on the team on a given night. I'm not sure how the University measures success but the large donors will probably be the final authority on Josh's future. On paper he's one of the winningest coaches at this stage in a career. I don't know if any school has dismissed a coach who has had the winning percentage Josh owns. Just have to wait and see. If he has a great season and does well in the tournaments there may be some sad posters who want him gone no matter what. We've only seen the Tigers play one top tier opponent, so there's not much to measure them by.
12-14-2015 02:44 PM
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RekeHavoc Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:44 PM)Antonio5fan Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.


Better players make better coaches. I don't think any of the players besides Will Barton ever lived up to the hype coming into Josh's program. Austin is yet to be determined. JJ had a good career and with better rebounders he might have been much better. He occasionally was the best rebounder on the team on a given night. I'm not sure how the University measures success but the large donors will probably be the final authority on Josh's future. On paper he's one of the winningest coaches at this stage in a career. I don't know if any school has dismissed a coach who has had the winning percentage Josh owns. Just have to wait and see. If he has a great season and does well in the tournaments there may be some sad posters who want him gone no matter what. We've only seen the Tigers play one top tier opponent, so there's not much to measure them by.

On the flip side, however, there a number of coaches doing much more with less. I contend that JP has had enough talent since he's been here to where he should have more than 2 first round tournament wins. What will ultimately do him in, though, is attendance.
12-14-2015 02:57 PM
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BuccTiger Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
If you can't adapt the way you play to the personnel you have, you better recruit the players who fit how you want to play.
12-14-2015 03:08 PM
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Tygrys Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 03:08 PM)BuccTiger Wrote:  If you can't adapt the way you play to the personnel you have, you better recruit the players who fit how you want to play.

I think that has been a large part of the frustration for fans. We can see the style clearly does not fit the personnel, yet the Coach is trying to force feed the style instead of adjusting. This year he seems to have better fit of his style and players, we shall see...
12-14-2015 03:12 PM
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Brother Bluto Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
I'm waiting until February to see what happens. Beating the crap out of an 0-8 team and 1-7 team doesn't say a whole lot.
12-14-2015 03:16 PM
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tigeriron Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
i completely agree w/ the op, but who's got 10 years to wait........................................

hello, i'm josh pastner. in 10 years i'm going to the final 4 2 years out of the next 5 years.
however, it might appear like that won't happen for the next 9 years. and i will be better than an average coach as well by then
(This post was last modified: 12-14-2015 03:28 PM by tigeriron.)
12-14-2015 03:26 PM
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bluecrew Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.
12-14-2015 03:42 PM
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Brother Bluto Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 03:42 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.

Was anyone really embarrassed about to NCAA's "selective prosecution"? Do you think Syracuse and UNC are embarrassed? Seriously I don't get the embarrassed part. Maybe if we had one player murdering another player like what happened at Baylor I'd be embarrassed. A brother getting a free plane ticket and a questionable ACT test don't embarrass me.
12-14-2015 04:37 PM
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bluecrew Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 04:37 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 03:42 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.

Was anyone really embarrassed about to NCAA's "selective prosecution"? Do you think Syracuse and UNC are embarrassed? Seriously I don't get the embarrassed part. Maybe if we had one player murdering another player like what happened at Baylor I'd be embarrassed. A brother getting a free plane ticket and a questionable ACT test don't embarrass me.

Oh no, I definitely wasn't. I just meant that Josh is going to represent the program in a positive light. That is worth something.
12-14-2015 04:43 PM
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tigergg Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:57 PM)RekeHavoc Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 02:44 PM)Antonio5fan Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.


Better players make better coaches. I don't think any of the players besides Will Barton ever lived up to the hype coming into Josh's program. Austin is yet to be determined. JJ had a good career and with better rebounders he might have been much better. He occasionally was the best rebounder on the team on a given night. I'm not sure how the University measures success but the large donors will probably be the final authority on Josh's future. On paper he's one of the winningest coaches at this stage in a career. I don't know if any school has dismissed a coach who has had the winning percentage Josh owns. Just have to wait and see. If he has a great season and does well in the tournaments there may be some sad posters who want him gone no matter what. We've only seen the Tigers play one top tier opponent, so there's not much to measure them by.

On the flip side, however, there a number of coaches doing much more with less. I contend that JP has had enough talent since he's been here to where he should have more than 2 first round tournament wins. What will ultimately do him in, though, is attendance.

^^Yep^^
12-14-2015 05:07 PM
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Brother Bluto Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 04:43 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 04:37 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 03:42 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.

Was anyone really embarrassed about to NCAA's "selective prosecution"? Do you think Syracuse and UNC are embarrassed? Seriously I don't get the embarrassed part. Maybe if we had one player murdering another player like what happened at Baylor I'd be embarrassed. A brother getting a free plane ticket and a questionable ACT test don't embarrass me.

Oh no, I definitely wasn't. I just meant that Josh is going to represent the program in a positive light. That is worth something.

Not really unless he wins big
12-14-2015 05:40 PM
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bluebacker Away
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RE: Another way to view it
JP has been paid in advance for a couple of NCAA Sweet 16s (or better).

The team for sure looks better this year than last but who knows if that will translate to a substantive increase in wins.

It's year 7 of the Pastner regime. The roster is a mess. If this team even makes the NCAA tournament (much less advances) it'll be an upset.

There's a reason no one's been beating down the door to try to hire him away. Look at his salary and look at the results (no not just a blind grab at win percentage). Listen to the last 3-4 years of press conferences. There's probably a ton of schools that would love to have him for about 1/2 what he's making with us.
12-14-2015 05:42 PM
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Rob
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Post: #14
RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:44 PM)Antonio5fan Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.


Better players make better coaches. I don't think any of the players besides Will Barton ever lived up to the hype coming into Josh's program. Austin is yet to be determined. JJ had a good career and with better rebounders he might have been much better. He occasionally was the best rebounder on the team on a given night. I'm not sure how the University measures success but the large donors will probably be the final authority on Josh's future. On paper he's one of the winningest coaches at this stage in a career. I don't know if any school has dismissed a coach who has had the winning percentage Josh owns. Just have to wait and see. If he has a great season and does well in the tournaments there may be some sad posters who want him gone no matter what. We've only seen the Tigers play one top tier opponent, so there's not much to measure them by.

How do you explain Archie Miller then?
12-14-2015 05:47 PM
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Timmy989 Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
Oh I think anybody who thinks Josh wont go on to a good career if he leaves Memphis is just silly. Dude is 38 and already has 154 wins or whatever. He's already an accomplished coach but it doesnt meet the standards that fans set here so it's feels like it's too later for him to catch up to expectations unless something like an elite 8 run happens this year. The whole thing is just kinda weird
12-14-2015 06:32 PM
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bluecrew Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 05:40 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 04:43 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 04:37 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 03:42 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.

Was anyone really embarrassed about to NCAA's "selective prosecution"? Do you think Syracuse and UNC are embarrassed? Seriously I don't get the embarrassed part. Maybe if we had one player murdering another player like what happened at Baylor I'd be embarrassed. A brother getting a free plane ticket and a questionable ACT test don't embarrass me.

Oh no, I definitely wasn't. I just meant that Josh is going to represent the program in a positive light. That is worth something.

Not really unless he wins big

You're right. Being a decent guy is in no way worth anything.
12-14-2015 06:54 PM
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Brother Bluto Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 06:54 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 05:40 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 04:43 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 04:37 PM)Brother Bluto Wrote:  
(12-14-2015 03:42 PM)bluecrew Wrote:  The time to have made a change and reap maximum benefits from that change has passed. Josh is and imo will always be a mediocre coach. You can do a lot worse than that. Switching a few years ago would have allowed us to keep a little momentum from the Cal years and retain 99% of our fans. I honestly believe that time has passed. so at this point whether he stays or goes I think is a pretty close call. He will bring in enough talent to compete and he will not embarrass the program on or off the court, so as a business decision, I think we've reached the point where making a change is a wash either way.

Was anyone really embarrassed about to NCAA's "selective prosecution"? Do you think Syracuse and UNC are embarrassed? Seriously I don't get the embarrassed part. Maybe if we had one player murdering another player like what happened at Baylor I'd be embarrassed. A brother getting a free plane ticket and a questionable ACT test don't embarrass me.

Oh no, I definitely wasn't. I just meant that Josh is going to represent the program in a positive light. That is worth something.

Not really unless he wins big

You're right. Being a decent guy is in no way worth anything.

Not when it comes to big time sports coaching
12-14-2015 09:21 PM
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Mimi Offline
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.

Well...In those four years when Jackson was here, the team did win three conference tourneys, two conference regular seasons, made four consecutive NCAA tourneys, advancing in the tourney twice, and beat a handful of ranked teams in his last season.

Yes...the fact those teams can up short of Sweet Sixteen leaves it feeling like a failure, but, while I was as disappointed as anyone we did not make it even further, it is distressing seeing those seasons viewed as abject failures. No one argued they were elite, yet people get assaulted with that belief far too often.

Now perhaps some differences may have allowed those teams to do even better...we will never know. What we do no is the mild disappointments of those seasons combined with last year's 18-14 season, combined with transfers out, be those transfers incredibly selfish, like last summers, or for whatever reason, turned otherwise rational fans into hysterical insulting poos.
12-14-2015 09:21 PM
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Memphis Bunch Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 02:07 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  I recall when Coach P 1st got the Memphis job, someone made the statement that it takes 10yrs to get 10yrs worth of experience. I know that a number of posters here just simply want coach gone, and I'm a believer that you will get your wish after this season. But if you can't see the growth in coach, you just don't want to see it.

I believe that he's finding his stride now as a coach, and that the style of play that's being played this year will be his identity, and he will recruit to fit this style. I think back to the JJ teams, and had we played the same way then, how successful would he have been. Once the new coach is in place, at least the cupboard won't be completely bare. But I think that coach is going to go on and have a great career. If we still don't achieve the level of success that we all desire, how much time should a new coach be given before we ask for a change. But one thing is for sure, we always seem to have success with coaches, and honestly, I still expect that. Sorry for any errors, I'm posting from my phone.

I agree with what you're saying. The problem was his contract. I also think we should have hired an existing coach but what's done is done. Rc should have handled the situation much better. We should have let USC take Josh instead of paying him 2.4m a year. It's over. I think pastner is coming into his own. He appears much more relaxed and I'm happy for him. He is doing a great job this year
12-14-2015 09:27 PM
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RE: Another way to view it
(12-14-2015 06:32 PM)Timmy989 Wrote:  Oh I think anybody who thinks Josh wont go on to a good career if he leaves Memphis is just silly. Dude is 38 and already has 154 wins or whatever. He's already an accomplished coach but it doesnt meet the standards that fans set here so it's feels like it's too later for him to catch up to expectations unless something like an elite 8 run happens this year. The whole thing is just kinda weird

You may be right,

But right now it seems like he is overpaid, if he wasn't there would at least have been one or two schools sniffing around trying to pluck him from us...That has not happened in recent years so I don't think it is only the FANS that view Josh in that light. Josh may turn out to be the greatest coach ever, but he has not shown that yet.

He doesn't have belief in his sets and didn't have much belief in his players until this year, but this year may be because there is a clear gap between the starters and the bench. Josh needs to learn how to identify what is going to be his teams identity early and get his team to buy in and play it to perfection and also settle on a rotation and stop subbing by feel because that kills guys confidence and puts too much pressure on players.
12-14-2015 09:31 PM
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