Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Acc divisions are too confusing...
Author Message
ken d Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 17,335
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 1211
I Root For: college sports
Location: Raleigh
Post: #61
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
(12-16-2015 07:15 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 06:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 05:35 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 04:52 PM)ken d Wrote:  I was under the impression that a lot of ACC schools voted to invite Syracuse, not just Coastal Division schools.

How about this as a compromise? Move Va Tech and Pitt to the Atlantic and move Louisville and Wake Forest to the Coastal. But instead of having a permanent crossover partner, have a "preferred partner" instead. There are two crossover games each year. With a permanent partner, that means you get the other teams only once every six years (and at home once in 12 years).

Every four years you play 8 cross division games, and there are seven teams in your rotation. My suggestion is that you play one of those seven - your "preferred partner" twice, and everyone else once in each four year cycle. In the years when you aren't scheduled to play your preferred partner, you can mutually agree to play them OOC instead of some other P5 team.

The preferred partners would be:

FSU - Miami
Clemson - Ga Tech
Va Tech - Virginia
NC State - UNC
Pitt - Louisville
BC - Duke
Syracuse - Wake

Now everybody has at least one NC team and one Virginia team every year. It comes at a price. Where the two divisions had been balanced, strength wise before, now the Atlantic would be clearly the stronger. But by keeping FSU and Clemson in the same division, you don't hurt your chances for multiple bids to NY 6 bowls.

Congrats! You now have the dumbest and second dumbest division plans I have ever seen on this board.

That's what comes from trying to satisfy Florida State and Clemson fans. The reality, of course, is that the schools those fans represent are much more reasonable, and understand why the current divisions make the most sense.

The divisions were put in place when Barker was representing Clemson so I wouldn't read into his compliance too much. There's more than one reason why he was replaced with an athletics friendly president.

And you wouldn't have to worry about Clemson and FSU raising hell about either one of your absolutely ignorant divisional proposals in this thread because Georgia Tech would pitch an absolute fit about not being assured of having Clemson at home every other year and assuring at least one sellout each year without having to give up a precious OOC game. There is a reason that Clemson was the game moved to opposite of Georgia and not any of the other ACC games on their regular schedule.

That's a good one. A Clemson fan calling somebody else ignorant. How ironic. As I have said from the beginning, I have zero interest in realigning the ACC's divisions. The current alignment suits the members of the league as well as any, and better than most. But if Clemson were given the keys to the conference, and allowed to make any schedule they want, then what would you complain about?

Over the past 60 years, Clemson has benefited greatly from its membership in the ACC. They benefited from the money and prestige that basketball provided when Clemson contributed very little to that. The league has grown enormously in wealth and prestige from those early days. You may complain it's only the fifth most powerful conference, but the reality is that moving up to fifth is a major improvement, and may be the best the ACC can realistically aspire to. For years, we weren't even in the conversation except for basketball.

If the league no longer meets your needs, you should go elsewhere, or go independent. If Florida State wants to go with you, that's OK too. We will wish you well, and we will do okay. But if all you want to do is kvetch, well that's really what the internet is for, isn't it?
12-16-2015 08:25 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kaplony Offline
Palmetto State Deplorable

Posts: 25,393
Joined: Apr 2013
I Root For: Newberry
Location: SC
Post: #62
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
(12-16-2015 08:25 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 07:15 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 06:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 05:35 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 04:52 PM)ken d Wrote:  I was under the impression that a lot of ACC schools voted to invite Syracuse, not just Coastal Division schools.

How about this as a compromise? Move Va Tech and Pitt to the Atlantic and move Louisville and Wake Forest to the Coastal. But instead of having a permanent crossover partner, have a "preferred partner" instead. There are two crossover games each year. With a permanent partner, that means you get the other teams only once every six years (and at home once in 12 years).

Every four years you play 8 cross division games, and there are seven teams in your rotation. My suggestion is that you play one of those seven - your "preferred partner" twice, and everyone else once in each four year cycle. In the years when you aren't scheduled to play your preferred partner, you can mutually agree to play them OOC instead of some other P5 team.

The preferred partners would be:

FSU - Miami
Clemson - Ga Tech
Va Tech - Virginia
NC State - UNC
Pitt - Louisville
BC - Duke
Syracuse - Wake

Now everybody has at least one NC team and one Virginia team every year. It comes at a price. Where the two divisions had been balanced, strength wise before, now the Atlantic would be clearly the stronger. But by keeping FSU and Clemson in the same division, you don't hurt your chances for multiple bids to NY 6 bowls.

Congrats! You now have the dumbest and second dumbest division plans I have ever seen on this board.

That's what comes from trying to satisfy Florida State and Clemson fans. The reality, of course, is that the schools those fans represent are much more reasonable, and understand why the current divisions make the most sense.

The divisions were put in place when Barker was representing Clemson so I wouldn't read into his compliance too much. There's more than one reason why he was replaced with an athletics friendly president.

And you wouldn't have to worry about Clemson and FSU raising hell about either one of your absolutely ignorant divisional proposals in this thread because Georgia Tech would pitch an absolute fit about not being assured of having Clemson at home every other year and assuring at least one sellout each year without having to give up a precious OOC game. There is a reason that Clemson was the game moved to opposite of Georgia and not any of the other ACC games on their regular schedule.

That's a good one. A Clemson fan calling somebody else ignorant. How ironic. As I have said from the beginning, I have zero interest in realigning the ACC's divisions. The current alignment suits the members of the league as well as any, and better than most. But if Clemson were given the keys to the conference, and allowed to make any schedule they want, then what would you complain about?

Over the past 60 years, Clemson has benefited greatly from its membership in the ACC. They benefited from the money and prestige that basketball provided when Clemson contributed very little to that. The league has grown enormously in wealth and prestige from those early days. You may complain it's only the fifth most powerful conference, but the reality is that moving up to fifth is a major improvement, and may be the best the ACC can realistically aspire to. For years, we weren't even in the conversation except for basketball.

If the league no longer meets your needs, you should go elsewhere, or go independent. If Florida State wants to go with you, that's OK too. We will wish you well, and we will do okay. But if all you want to do is kvetch, well that's really what the internet is for, isn't it?

So I gather from that little diatribe that we should just sit back and shut up about the fact that our conference is being led by a bunch of idiots who think it's still 1991 and basketball is king so we expand by adding a pair of football limited basketball schools, that not maximizing the profitability of football by improving divisions, that not pushing for a conference network when everybody and their brother EXCEPT the idiots in Greensboro knew it was the next big revenue generator and signing an absolute garbage bowl lineup outside of teh Orange Bowl.

Now I understand why you have posted the two absolute dumbest divisional alignments. You simply posted at the maximum you are capable of posting.
12-16-2015 08:44 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ren.hoek Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,361
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 149
I Root For: Clemson
Location:
Post: #63
Acc divisions are too confusing...
I like the zipper model. Swap Syracuse for VT and it's a true zipper model. Atlantic is way better, but that only helps the SOS for the schools that care about football and could conceivably benefit from better SOS to make the CFP.
12-16-2015 09:16 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
XLance Online
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 14,232
Joined: Mar 2008
Reputation: 762
I Root For: Carolina
Location: Greensboro, NC
Post: #64
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
(12-16-2015 09:16 PM)ren.hoek Wrote:  I like the zipper model. Swap Syracuse for VT and it's a true zipper model. Atlantic is way better, but that only helps the SOS for the schools that care about football and could conceivably benefit from better SOS to make the CFP.

Good idea!
That plan works for me.
12-16-2015 09:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ClemVegas Offline
Banned

Posts: 1,271
Joined: Jul 2015
I Root For: Clemson
Location:
Post: #65
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
I think Virginia Tech and Clemson playing yearly would be good move by ACC. Swap Louisville and Va Tech. And G Tech and FSU yearly.

or get ride of the permanent cross divisional rival. I'd like to see two new teams on schedule every year
(This post was last modified: 12-16-2015 10:47 PM by ClemVegas.)
12-16-2015 10:41 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kaplony Offline
Palmetto State Deplorable

Posts: 25,393
Joined: Apr 2013
I Root For: Newberry
Location: SC
Post: #66
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
(12-16-2015 10:41 PM)ClemVegas Wrote:  I think Virginia Tech and Clemson playing yearly would be good move by ACC. Swap Louisville and Va Tech. And G Tech and FSU yearly.

or get ride of the permanent cross divisional rival. I'd like to see two new teams on schedule every year

Neither Clemson nor Georgia Tech want to have a schedule without the other on it. The only two ACC teams that consistently draw premium ticket prices at Clemson are GT and FSU.
12-16-2015 11:18 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ClemVegas Offline
Banned

Posts: 1,271
Joined: Jul 2015
I Root For: Clemson
Location:
Post: #67
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
i think Va tech and Clemson would be a hot ticket as well
12-17-2015 07:55 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ken d Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 17,335
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 1211
I Root For: college sports
Location: Raleigh
Post: #68
RE: Acc divisions are too confusing...
(12-16-2015 08:44 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 08:25 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 07:15 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 06:54 PM)ken d Wrote:  
(12-16-2015 05:35 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  Congrats! You now have the dumbest and second dumbest division plans I have ever seen on this board.

That's what comes from trying to satisfy Florida State and Clemson fans. The reality, of course, is that the schools those fans represent are much more reasonable, and understand why the current divisions make the most sense.

The divisions were put in place when Barker was representing Clemson so I wouldn't read into his compliance too much. There's more than one reason why he was replaced with an athletics friendly president.

And you wouldn't have to worry about Clemson and FSU raising hell about either one of your absolutely ignorant divisional proposals in this thread because Georgia Tech would pitch an absolute fit about not being assured of having Clemson at home every other year and assuring at least one sellout each year without having to give up a precious OOC game. There is a reason that Clemson was the game moved to opposite of Georgia and not any of the other ACC games on their regular schedule.

That's a good one. A Clemson fan calling somebody else ignorant. How ironic. As I have said from the beginning, I have zero interest in realigning the ACC's divisions. The current alignment suits the members of the league as well as any, and better than most. But if Clemson were given the keys to the conference, and allowed to make any schedule they want, then what would you complain about?

Over the past 60 years, Clemson has benefited greatly from its membership in the ACC. They benefited from the money and prestige that basketball provided when Clemson contributed very little to that. The league has grown enormously in wealth and prestige from those early days. You may complain it's only the fifth most powerful conference, but the reality is that moving up to fifth is a major improvement, and may be the best the ACC can realistically aspire to. For years, we weren't even in the conversation except for basketball.

If the league no longer meets your needs, you should go elsewhere, or go independent. If Florida State wants to go with you, that's OK too. We will wish you well, and we will do okay. But if all you want to do is kvetch, well that's really what the internet is for, isn't it?

So I gather from that little diatribe that we should just sit back and shut up about the fact that our conference is being led by a bunch of idiots who think it's still 1991 and basketball is king so we expand by adding a pair of football limited basketball schools, that not maximizing the profitability of football by improving divisions, that not pushing for a conference network when everybody and their brother EXCEPT the idiots in Greensboro knew it was the next big revenue generator and signing an absolute garbage bowl lineup outside of teh Orange Bowl.

Now I understand why you have posted the two absolute dumbest divisional alignments. You simply posted at the maximum you are capable of posting.

What is clear is that when you have to resort to insults, it is because you have nothing of value to add to the conversation. You just don't know what you are talking about, and your faux outrage at the direction the ACC is heading is nothing more than revisionist history.

While schools like Clemson and Maryland were motivated by football reasons to form the ACC, from the beginning it was clearly better at basketball than football. Its national identity was as a basketball league, and a good one.

Since that founding, 8 new schools have joined the league, and two have left. Instead of ignoring the importance of improving its football status, the league added first Georgia Tech and then Florida State. It tried to bring Miami in at the same time FSU joined, but they opted to join the Big East instead.

In 2004, for the first time since its founding more than 50 years before, the league made a play for a school that was good at basketball - Syracuse. But just because they had a strong national reputation in hoops does not mean they were a slouch in football. In the 20 years before they were invited, only one ACC school - FSU - had more wins in football than Syracuse.

And Miami was also added, a school that in that 20 year period was second only to FSU in football wins (one fewer). BC was invited to be the 12th team largely because Miami wanted them to be. While their football success was more modest, they were hardly a basketball school.

As it turned out, politics kept Syracuse out, and brought Virginia Tech in. They, too, were a football first school, with a record in football every bit as good as Clemson's. The Tigers had won 152 games in the previous 20 years, the Hokies 149.

Over the next five years, those three new teams averaged 9 wins a season, compared with FSU and Clemson's 7.8 wins. So they weren't exactly a downgrade.

And finally, after more than 60 years of its existence, the ACC added Syracuse and Pitt. So, one strong basketball reputation added in 60 years, and the ACC doesn't care about football. Right.

Complain all you want. But it's clear that those complaints are just hot air, with no substance. If you no longer want to be part of the ACC, that's fine. Nobody's holding you back. You've had recent success that gives you hope that you could join the upper echelon of college football, and that you could sustain that success against tougher competition. Go for it, but be careful what you wish for.
12-17-2015 11:13 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.