BYU needs to get back in the MWC. BYU and Boise make a very formidable conference. Their "Independence" thing is biting them in the butt.

(12-04-2015 09:16 PM)Big Frog II Wrote:  BYU needs to get back in the MWC. BYU and Boise make a very formidable conference. Their "Independence" thing is biting them in the butt.

BYU would rather drop to FCS and declare themselves the "Harvard of the West" than relinquish their "Notre Dame of the West" title in exchange for becoming just another Go5 school. Exceptionalism is too important to that culture.

The independence thing could work but they need a coach patient enough to see it through. They went indy in part because they saw themselves slipping below Utah thanks to their move to the Pac-x and in part because it was financially viable.

(12-04-2015 09:00 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  They need to realize they're not Notre Dame. The AAC was 5-7 deep this year with some of the traditional former C-USA powers down such as UCF and ECU. Houston had a faint chance at a national title had they won out, so BYU should know they can win big in the American, which still has national programs in basketball as well.

I agree....might be time for BYU to start thinking about joining the American Conference.

The American isn't great every year (last year for example) but they can do more than being a wanna-be ND.

(12-04-2015 09:58 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  

(12-04-2015 09:00 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  They need to realize they're not Notre Dame. The AAC was 5-7 deep this year with some of the traditional former C-USA powers down such as UCF and ECU. Houston had a faint chance at a national title had they won out, so BYU should know they can win big in the American, which still has national programs in basketball as well.

I agree....might be time for BYU to start thinking about joining the American Conference.

Both BYU and the American have 3 more years left on their TV deal.

Timing could be right.

If BYU were to go to a G5 conference, it would most likely be a "best of the rest" combo of the MWC and AAC. Second most likely option would be AAC.

However, there are a few big problems.

1. Independence makes more money than G5. Since BYU's athletics department has to be self-supporting, why would they do that?

2. BYU get's more exposure as an independent. Will a conference allow games to be rebroadcast on BYUtv? Giving that up for the Big 12 is an easy yes, but giving that up for a G5 TV contract? Not so good.

3. Ziggy Ansah. He came from Ghana where the LDS church is growing rapidly. If BYU were to build a sister campus in Africa (just like the ones in Idaho and Hawaii) they would be able to provide a much needed service to the new members there, in addition to opening up a good recruiting pipeline. Get better athletes, produce better results, get in a NY6 game, and many objections to getting BYU in the Big 12 go away.

This dude has only coached in the west for his entire career. How is he going to recruit at Virginia? Where are his recruiting contacts in talent-rich Delmarva or Hampton Roads?

I'm sorry but this is ridiculous hire by the Hoos.

The thing with the B12 is that 4 schools out 10 are in the state of Texas.

They want to double down in-state to keep a monopoly on Texas recruiting. When CUSA added UNT/UTSA and Texas State moved up the B12 had a special meeting to understand the impact the rising Texas schools had on their conference. There is a deep concern that in the long run it will mean increased competition.

That is why the B12 is thinking Houston would be a good add because there is enough recruits to split 5 ways between the Texas schools and keep UNT/Rice/UTSA/TXST down at the mid major level. Keep the talent in conference and keep the conference strong by adding another Texas school.

(12-04-2015 10:30 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  If BYU were to go to a G5 conference, it would most likely be a "best of the rest" combo of the MWC and AAC. Second most likely option would be AAC.

However, there are a few big problems.

1. Independence makes more money than G5. Since BYU's athletics department has to be self-supporting, why would they do that?

2014 Department of education data show that BYU made 4.8M in TV/Radio revenue. That does not account for BYU-TV covering ESPN's production costs, so that 4.8 is inflated. Boise made 3.7 that year in TV for football alone, and got a nice NY6 appearance reward. The money isn't any better for Indy BYU than it is for Boise. 2014 DOE data also show that BYU reported a $10M tuition subsidy (17% of budget). The self sufficiency is now transparently debunked.

With 4.8M in TV revenue, 11.8M in FB ticket revenue, and 9.4M in donations (all sports) Bronco was correct that BYU would not keep up as an Indy.

(12-04-2015 09:00 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  They need to realize they're not Notre Dame. The AAC was 5-7 deep this year with some of the traditional former C-USA powers down such as UCF and ECU. Houston had a faint chance at a national title had they won out, so BYU should know they can win big in the American, which still has national programs in basketball as well.

Yea. It always seemed to me that BYU's move to be an Indy was a 'knee jerk' response to Utah's invitation to the Pac 12.

BYU hasn't been relevant as an independent. Even Notre Dame felt pressure to work out some sort of agreement with the ACC.

BYU won't get that kind of deal. They don't play well with others. They make demands on others. But BYU is private (VERY private) and they aren't in the right area. The Big XII also has an outlier problem with West Virginia. Cincinnati or Uconn give them markets and travel partners. BYU gives them scheduling nightmares (no Sunday games), and another prima donna (they already have Texas).

The Pac12 isn't going to take BYU. Period. They already have Utah.

(12-04-2015 11:12 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  The thing with the B12 is that 4 schools out 10 are in the state of Texas.

They want to double down in-state to keep a monopoly on Texas recruiting. When CUSA added UNT/UTSA and Texas State moved up the B12 had a special meeting to understand the impact the rising Texas schools had on their conference. There is a deep concern that in the long run it will mean increased competition.

That is why the B12 is thinking Houston would be a good add because there is enough recruits to split 5 ways between the Texas schools and keep UNT/Rice/UTSA/TXST down at the mid major level. Keep the talent in conference and keep the conference strong by adding another Texas school.

Houston makes some sense for the Big XII. The most important thing that UH to the Big XII-II does is to stop the encroachment of the SEC into Texas. Greater Houston has pretty much flipped to being SEC primary. And its a huge loss for the Big XII. Greater Houston + Beaumont + College Station has around 8 million people. That's the population of Virginia. Adding Houston wouldn't kick the SEC out. But it might stop the erosion to the SEC that is very obvious in SE Texas.

(12-05-2015 01:10 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(12-04-2015 11:12 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  The thing with the B12 is that 4 schools out 10 are in the state of Texas.

They want to double down in-state to keep a monopoly on Texas recruiting. When CUSA added UNT/UTSA and Texas State moved up the B12 had a special meeting to understand the impact the rising Texas schools had on their conference. There is a deep concern that in the long run it will mean increased competition.

That is why the B12 is thinking Houston would be a good add because there is enough recruits to split 5 ways between the Texas schools and keep UNT/Rice/UTSA/TXST down at the mid major level. Keep the talent in conference and keep the conference strong by adding another Texas school.

Houston makes some sense for the Big XII. The most important thing that UH to the Big XII-II does is to stop the encroachment of the SEC into Texas. Greater Houston has pretty much flipped to being SEC primary. And its a huge loss for the Big XII. Greater Houston + Beaumont + College Station has around 8 million people. That's the population of Virginia. Adding Houston wouldn't kick the SEC out. But it might stop the erosion to the SEC that is very obvious in SE Texas.

1) Checkmate on the SEC.
2) Add the Houston TV market.
3) Monopolize Texas recruiting
4) Add a school with major conference tradition.
5) Keep the University of Texas happy.

(12-05-2015 01:10 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Houston makes some sense for the Big XII. The most important thing that UH to the Big XII-II does is to stop the encroachment of the SEC into Texas. Greater Houston has pretty much flipped to being SEC primary. And its a huge loss for the Big XII. Greater Houston + Beaumont + College Station has around 8 million people. That's the population of Virginia. Adding Houston wouldn't kick the SEC out. But it might stop the erosion to the SEC that is very obvious in SE Texas.

Greater Houston gets behind whichever regional power is good at the time between UH, UT and A&M or in the unlikely event that Rice ever gets close to top 25 worthy (like in the late 90's), Rice. LSU also has a large presence because of the La. transplants.

(12-05-2015 05:15 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  

(12-05-2015 01:10 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Houston makes some sense for the Big XII. The most important thing that UH to the Big XII-II does is to stop the encroachment of the SEC into Texas. Greater Houston has pretty much flipped to being SEC primary. And its a huge loss for the Big XII. Greater Houston + Beaumont + College Station has around 8 million people. That's the population of Virginia. Adding Houston wouldn't kick the SEC out. But it might stop the erosion to the SEC that is very obvious in SE Texas.

Greater Houston gets behind whichever regional power is good at the time between UH, UT and A&M or in the unlikely event that Rice ever gets close to top 25 worthy (like in the late 90's), Rice. LSU also has a large presence because of the La. transplants.

Thats the problem for the Big XII. Its not just TAMU, but TAMU and LSU.

UCF and USF make the most sense for the Big 12, IMO.

(12-04-2015 10:04 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(12-04-2015 09:58 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  

(12-04-2015 09:00 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  They need to realize they're not Notre Dame. The AAC was 5-7 deep this year with some of the traditional former C-USA powers down such as UCF and ECU. Houston had a faint chance at a national title had they won out, so BYU should know they can win big in the American, which still has national programs in basketball as well.

I agree....might be time for BYU to start thinking about joining the American Conference.

Both BYU and the American have 3 more years left on their TV deal.

Timing could be right.

And more importantly, those deals are with the same four-letter network. If BYU does football only in the American, then the American can go to a 12/14 alignment with virtually any G5 school in the Eastern or Central Time Zones.

Quote:UCF and USF make the most sense for the Big 12, IMO.

Getting UCF or USF would only be a good idea if the B12 was getting a TV channel. That's what made the B1G expand geographically. B12 doesn't have one. And if they did, getting BOTH UCF & USF would be a real bad idea, as you want to cover different (TV-watching) areas of the country with each new team. I think UCF with their $$ into football would be a good choice. And probably Memphis due to great basketball, too.

But as some analysts say -- Boise & BYU would be good choices. Although Boise doesn't bring great TV ratings isolated in Idaho, the country knows them as a real team and will watch flipping the channels. Still not enough by itself, but it's actually moot anyway -- B12 doesn't have its own TV channel anyway. Due to that, having decent attendance and being known as a real team in the country is all that's needed. And they're close to 'home' in the B12, which is a good thing when you don't have your own TV station.

(12-04-2015 07:05 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  

(12-04-2015 06:15 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  I think we can surmise what this says about BYUs Big 12 chances.

BYU essentially doomed their Big 12 bid by making too many demands. This has nothing to do with it and if some of BYU's issues get solved (i.e. stop being such a prima donna, you're not Notre Dame), they'll be in get back on the Big 12's short list soon.

Bronco left because he knows something the general public does not, just like Herman stayed because he knows something.