Open ideas where does the program go from here?

It one 1 game this year. The over/under was 1.5. Business as usual. I believe this and the win over Wyoming were the only 2 games the team wasn't blown out. Not good.

(11-27-2015 05:14 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  It one 1 game this year. The over/under was 1.5. Business as usual. I believe this and the win over Wyoming were the only 2 games the team wasn't blown out. Not good.

Lost to ODU by 3. Lost to Ball State by 12. Lost to UMass by 11. None of those were blowouts.

Overall, I will say I see a tiny little bit of progress. Still nowhere near enough. I won't say maybe next year it will get better because we have been saying that for a pretty long time now.

(11-27-2015 05:19 PM)FrankAnderson Wrote:  

(11-27-2015 05:14 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  It one 1 game this year. The over/under was 1.5. Business as usual. I believe this and the win over Wyoming were the only 2 games the team wasn't blown out. Not good.

Lost to ODU by 3. Lost to Ball State by 12. Lost to UMass by 11. None of those were blowouts.

I forgot about ODU and yes, BSU and UMass were not horrible losses, points wise. UMass is an awful team, however.

Hard to gauge the progress. Offense was definitely better but the defense lost 8-10 players that would have contributed. Emu does not have enough depth to overcome that.

Not many players will be lost to graduation. Ibe and Creel are the only significant losses. All of the OL will be back. The key will be the return of all the guys that were out all/most of this season. That and this years red shirts.

(11-27-2015 05:45 PM)TheWoodenNickle Wrote:  Hard to gauge the progress. Offense was definitely better but the defense lost 8-10 players that would have contributed. Emu does not have enough depth to overcome that.

Not many players will be lost to graduation. Ibe and Creel are the only significant losses. All of the OL will be back. The key will be the return of all the guys that were out all/most of this season. That and this years red shirts.

And Mulder and Darius Jackson

(11-27-2015 06:00 PM)EAGLE KING Wrote:  

(11-27-2015 05:45 PM)TheWoodenNickle Wrote:  Hard to gauge the progress. Offense was definitely better but the defense lost 8-10 players that would have contributed. Emu does not have enough depth to overcome that.

Not many players will be lost to graduation. Ibe and Creel are the only significant losses. All of the OL will be back. The key will be the return of all the guys that were out all/most of this season. That and this years red shirts.

And Mulder and Darius Jackson

Yeah. Them too.

The color commentator from West Texas was/is probably suffering from CTE, but one thing he said about EMU's program today was dead on: if we want to turn this thing around, we need to build the offensive and defensive lines. They have both been terrible this year. If they are terrible next year, nothing will change.

If we don't switch out of the 3-4 (which I think I'm in favor of doing), we'll have Pat O'Connor, Luke McClean, and Lemar Harris up front. We return everyone from our offensive line, plus the redshirts from this season.

This obviously doesn't guarantee improvement, but if the coaching staff is worth a penny, both the OL and DL should be better.





PS: Speaking of the staff, I have a feeling we're going to see some turnover this offseason. And honestly, for several positions, that's probably a good thing...

Honestly, I believe Chris Creighton should be on the hot seat and coaching for his job next season. If we have 4 wins or more, with fewer blow outs, then he should stay. But if it's another season like this, he needs to go. We had a very young team, but those guys will be a year older, and it's on the coaches to develop them into quality football players.

A few things...

1) Brogan Roback needs to be the QB. I'm with Bovine (and others who have been saying it) in that Reggie needs to be on the field. If that's as a WR, pace changing RB, whatever. But Roback is my QB and shouldn't have to worry about a rotation. He's inconsistent, but you can see the talent is there to be a star. A lot of our improvement depends on how he grows into next season.

2) We have some nice young talent in our front seven, but I don't see a lot in our secondary. That's a problem. Having O'Connor back will help the pass rush, but can this secondary grow? It'll take a lot for some defensive improvement, but I wouldn't be opposed to Creighton looking at the JUCO ranks for a corner.

3) Our young receivers have to get open and catch the ball. Daugherty looks promising, but I have hopes for other freshmen like Snelling to be able to help right away in '16. Far too often Roback had nowhere to throw the rock. Those guys need to help their QB.

All in all, these guys need to grow up in a hurry, or else we will have a new "Head Coach Search" thread pretty quickly. The rest of the MAC isn't going anywhere. We need to improve, and improve fast.

(11-27-2015 07:39 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  Honestly, I believe Chris Creighton should be on the hot seat and coaching for his job next season. If we have 4 wins or more, with fewer blow outs, then he should stay. But if it's another season like this, he needs to go. We had a very young team, but those guys will be a year older, and it's on the coaches to develop them into quality football players.

A few things...

1) Brogan Roback needs to be the QB. I'm with Bovine (and others who have been saying it) in that Reggie needs to be on the field. If that's as a WR, pace changing RB, whatever. But Roback is my QB and shouldn't have to worry about a rotation. He's inconsistent, but you can see the talent is there to be a star. A lot of our improvement depends on how he grows into next season.

2) We have some nice young talent in our front seven, but I don't see a lot in our secondary. That's a problem. Having O'Connor back will help the pass rush, but can this secondary grow? It'll take a lot for some defensive improvement, but I wouldn't be opposed to Creighton looking at the JUCO ranks for a corner.

3) Our young receivers have to get open and catch the ball. Daugherty looks promising, but I have hopes for other freshmen like Snelling to be able to help right away in '16. Far too often Roback had nowhere to throw the rock. Those guys need to help their QB.

All in all, these guys need to grow up in a hurry, or else we will have a new "Head Coach Search" thread pretty quickly. The rest of the MAC isn't going anywhere. We need to improve, and improve fast.

Very well stated. I agree with everything you wrote, especially about player development - that's where coaching ability and talent really come through.

Agree, with Rob.

The top of the MAC is getting stronger, not weaker, we have to 'run faster' to keep up. There were years where the MAC was steeped in mediocrity. No more. MAC has say 4, 5, or 6 top tier teams.

I still maintain that our recruiting is a big area of concern. I have no idea how that gets fixed... If CC can get them into the program, I believe he can mold them, but have got to get them.

James Thompson IV shows what good recruiting can do. Thompson wasn't 'molded', he was delivered as a top athlete. Ditto Boykins, Theron Wilson, etc. We can see how winning was rooted in recruiting all-MAC caliber players. I'm using Wilson, Boykins, and Thompson as examples as they were impact players from day one. They were not prospects who were developed into all-MAC players. It was recruiting... (for those who don't remember, Theron Wilson was a MI 'Dream Team' player on a squad of h.s. players including Chris Webber, Jalen Rose, Voshon Leonard, etc - the hay days of MI h.s. basketball. Best senior class in my memory.

One point Rob alluded: Our WRs have to get much, much better. We don't have a whole lot of speed there. Weak group in a conference full of star WRs.

I'd like to see EMU (and the Lions) get more OL help. I really believe that controlling both lines is the key to winning in college or the NFL. Runners like Jackson, Vann, etc. will go as far as the line permits.

Recruiting wise I see us looking at JUCO WR to give us experience there and also DB maybe one. I don't see a class rated as high as the first two CC classes but better than historical EMU classes. By that I mean we wlll be getting kids with other Div I offers in most cases and kids with other MAC offers and kids rated at least two stars from Rivals. Unfortunately at this point I don't see any JUCO OL (although they've been offered) or JUCO DL as of now. I expect most of the 2016 class to redshirt. The theme for the 2016 class is speed guys with 4.5 or better in positions where it is needed.

I think we need bigger stronger and faster DBs. I think if Calderon was healthy that would help. Hoying as well.

LB wise lots of questions I really think one or two JUCOs here would help, not sure if Spearman or Matt will be returning. A guy to watch here is Holford.

DL- hopefully Crosby and Andrews are hitting the weight room so they can join the rotation as well as Dillion and Figueroa (who had a great frosh season) the whole DL needs to get bigger and stronger.

WR- yeah lots of untested redshirt WRs /a JUCO would give them some more time to grow.

OL-not sure how many of the 5th years will choose to graduate rather than return. The 2015 class has some good ones that you don't hear about Pavletich, Bergman and Leahey. I think the 2014 class which provided the depth this year needs to continue to get bigger all of them got experience this year.

TE-Tuttle and Browning I thought were impressive despite lack of Div I offers they were productive. All four redshirt TEs have potential, we may use two TEs next year. not seeing the need for a scholie at this spot.

QB-Roback has 2.3 years of experience, I still think it needs to be an open competition that TD to interception ratio really hurt us this year. What does Pensyl bring to the table?

RB-Vann was impressive, Banham was useful in a variety of roles, does Lewis come back for a 5th year and get some carries? Does Eriksen join rotation and of course Turner. We have one verbal in so far.

I think you and I disagree on recruiting. English recruited well but things didn't come together (other than that one year).

I don't see CC's recruits in the same class. When folks talk of key EMU players, e.g., Roback, Jackson, the OL, POC, the LBs, etc. they are ALMOST ALL English's recruits.

If I were asked to 'draft' 10 players off this year's squad, probably 8 would be English recruits. Easy to mention Vann, but I'd go with Roback, Jackson, POC, Ibe, Gardner, Mulder, Barnes, Bell, etc.

And yes, I'd make a slot back type player out of Bell.

The sad story of EMU FB is that the English recruits didn't produce a winning team. I thought the talent was there...

E.g., English brought in a whole class of OL kids, redshirted them, etc. They are the bulk of our team now. I don't see CC's OL recruits being anywhere equal in terms of abilities.

Matter of fact, if one was going to do "Keys to Victory" (assuming POC was healthy and playing) it might be:

"Roback (English) needs to run a controlled passing game behind the strong running of Jackson (English) and Vann (CC). Daughterty (CC) is his sole deep threat. On defense, EMU needs to stop the rush and dial up the pressure on Cooper Rush. Pat O'Connor (English) needs to have a big day and Ibe (English) needs to have another big game like he did two weeks ago in an award winning performance. If the game is close Mulder (English) could be the difference with his long field goals."

Jhm that ignores guys like Vann rachwal our frosh dl brown and the fact that those English starters improved under cc we had English 5 year starters last year under Kurt Anderson recruiting and coaching and they sucked the offensive line was better this year also tuttle and browning beck harris

They didn't quit i find that to be a huge plus!

(11-28-2015 07:13 AM)emu79 Wrote:  Jhm that ignores guys like Vann rachwal our frosh dl brown and the fact that those English starters improved under cc we had English 5 year starters last year under Kurt Anderson recruiting and coaching and they sucked the offensive line was better this year also tuttle and browning beck harris

Agreed, except I just don't see it with Beck. He looks lost far too often. Solid tackler, but can't cover a rug. He should bulk up and become a linebacker.

Anthony Brown and Luke Maclean are other "Creighton guys" that I liked this year. Maclean really finished strong. You can see why Pitt recruited him.