Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

Take a moment and think through it logically. Now realize those rattling the sabers will not.

It's the thing to do these days. Strike while the iron is hot and the media is all over it.

I don't know if there are any significant issues (of course the article doesn't say what the issues are), but they appear to be taking advantage of the current climate to get their message out.

The list of demands the Irate8 put out are in line with the current liberal teachings and divisive media push - it all fits this narrative that there is a racism issue - whether true or not. Simply by the University not addressing those ridiculous demands, it is seen by that group as being racist.

(11-24-2015 11:54 AM)FLIP Wrote:  The list of demands the Irate8 put out are in line with the current liberal teachings and divisive media push - it all fits this narrative that there is a racism issue - whether true or not. Simply by the University not addressing those ridiculous demands, it is seen by that group as being racist.

If you notice all of these universities have followed the same template. My guess is all these people attended the same seminar last year and there was a plan to roll this out at the same time across the country.

(11-24-2015 12:47 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(11-24-2015 11:54 AM)FLIP Wrote:  The list of demands the Irate8 put out are in line with the current liberal teachings and divisive media push - it all fits this narrative that there is a racism issue - whether true or not. Simply by the University not addressing those ridiculous demands, it is seen by that group as being racist.

If you notice all of these universities have followed the same template. My guess is all these people attended the same seminar last year and there was a plan to roll this out at the same time across the country.

It reeks of the occupy and BLM crap.

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

I DON'T get the dubose shooting - saint Sammy had about 60 arrests, and was carrying dope and cash in his vehicle, and tried to get the h$#@ out of dodge before the handcuffs went on again - he didn't deserve to get shot, but he also was a career criminal who contributed to his own demise. if these groups want police to stop "killing" black men, or, for that matter, any other men, maybe they could stress that the men should stop criminal behavior, or, if they're caught, own up to it, and face the consequences in the system, instead of trying to escalate a situation with armed police.

(11-24-2015 02:36 PM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

I DON'T get the dubose shooting - saint Sammy had about 60 arrests, and was carrying dope and cash in his vehicle, and tried to get the h$#@ out of dodge before the handcuffs went on again - he didn't deserve to get shot, but he also was a career criminal who contributed to his own demise. if these groups want police to stop "killing" black men, or, for that matter, any other men, maybe they could stress that the men should stop criminal behavior, or, if they're caught, own up to it, and face the consequences in the system, instead of trying to escalate a situation with armed police.

Black, not armed, did not threaten the cop. Of course this has nothing to do with racism or discrimination relative to student admissions or hiring practices at UC.

(11-24-2015 02:36 PM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

I DON'T get the dubose shooting - saint Sammy had about 60 arrests, and was carrying dope and cash in his vehicle, and tried to get the h$#@ out of dodge before the handcuffs went on again - he didn't deserve to get shot, but he also was a career criminal who contributed to his own demise. if these groups want police to stop "killing" black men, or, for that matter, any other men, maybe they could stress that the men should stop criminal behavior, or, if they're caught, own up to it, and face the consequences in the system, instead of trying to escalate a situation with armed police.

The problem really doesn't have much to do with Sam Dubose. In his case, it will be really difficult to prove that Ray Tensing had racist intentions when he pulled the trigger that day.

The black community is using that event as a springboard to correct what they perceive as a bigger problem. I acknowledge that racism is still very prevent in our society. Frankly, so long as minorities exist, there will be some sort of psychological, subconscious predisposition to those that are are different than what we are used to. We can't correct that. What we can correct are blatant signs of racism, which have noticeably decreased since the Civil rights movement. So, knowing that racism does exist to some degree, I have no problem with the black community using an isolated incident to correct a larger issue. My problem is that many folks seem to extrapolate the ramifications of this incident too far. There may still be a disadvantage to the black community, but It is certainly not as though black individuals are at a significant risk of being executed by police officers. They may be more prone to police brutality, but that doesn't mean we are openly condoning the genocide of the black community through our police force.

The problem with the fallout from these shootings is that it gets far too polarized. One incident suddenly turns into an entire protest which turns into a riot. This nation, inherently, does not have laws any more than suggest it is okay to oppress minorities. This is a country full of people that support equal rights. When these situations arise, a multitude of individuals extend their support to the black community. But by forming divisive stances, and demanding unreasonable requests, and, most of all, searching for the progression of your community alone (I get it, black lives matter does not imply that only black lives matter, but many people will regard it in that light) only serves to further divide a country that is making great strides.



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(11-24-2015 02:36 PM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

I DON'T get the dubose shooting - saint Sammy had about 60 arrests, and was carrying dope and cash in his vehicle, and tried to get the h$#@ out of dodge before the handcuffs went on again - he didn't deserve to get shot, but he also was a career criminal who contributed to his own demise. if these groups want police to stop "killing" black men, or, for that matter, any other men, maybe they could stress that the men should stop criminal behavior, or, if they're caught, own up to it, and face the consequences in the system, instead of trying to escalate a situation with armed police.

Dubose was a bum. A first class bum. Even if he lived, his legacy would have been a gaggle of unsupervised kids who would carry on his legacy as irresponsible human beings. Though Dubose stupidly increased his chances of encountering this unfortunate incident, he didn't deserve to get shot. That's the issue and that's all that matters

There's a meme posted on Facebook this morning from one of my black Facebook friends that sums up his line of thinking: White guy shoots five cops at a Colorado abortion clinic and is taken out alive. Young black man walks away from police with a three inch knife in his hand and is shot 16 times, including in the back.

If Antwan murders Jaquan, Antwan goes to jail. If Officer Trigger Happy murders Antwan, Trigger Happy gets paid administrative leave and the video is withheld from the public for 400 days.

I'm so glad Ono is our president and not one of the folks here on this board. The University would have been burned to the ground months ago if that were the case.

(11-24-2015 09:19 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Another negative UC article at the Enquirer.

I am trying to be rational here, can someone explain to me why people are perceiving the university to be so racist? I get the Dubose shooting.... I really do... but keep in mind that was the act of one man and UC basically fired the guy on the spot and made many changes in the department as a result. What else is the university supposed to do to appease the masses?


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/pol.../76293520/

Serious question. What are the many changes made by the department? I know they hired two very expensive people to run things differently, but beyond that I'm not up to speed on what changes have actually been made.

(11-28-2015 08:30 AM)BearcatsUC Wrote:  There's a meme posted on Facebook this morning from one of my black Facebook friends that sums up his line of thinking: White guy shoots five cops at a Colorado abortion clinic and is taken out alive. Young black man walks away from police with a three inch knife in his hand and is shot 16 times, including in the back.

If Antwan murders Jaquan, Antwan goes to jail. If Officer Trigger Happy murders Antwan, Trigger Happy gets paid administrative leave and the video is withheld from the public for 400 days.

https://twitter.com/WesleyLowery/status/...wsrc%5Etfw

(11-29-2015 09:10 AM)Coopdaddy67 Wrote:  

(11-28-2015 08:30 AM)BearcatsUC Wrote:  There's a meme posted on Facebook this morning from one of my black Facebook friends that sums up his line of thinking: White guy shoots five cops at a Colorado abortion clinic and is taken out alive. Young black man walks away from police with a three inch knife in his hand and is shot 16 times, including in the back.

If Antwan murders Jaquan, Antwan goes to jail. If Officer Trigger Happy murders Antwan, Trigger Happy gets paid administrative leave and the video is withheld from the public for 400 days.

https://twitter.com/WesleyLowery/status/...wsrc%5Etfw

My, that post neglected to mention he had already killed a cop and wounded five others.

I would expect an indignant post like that; but history is showing us over and over that the Colorado FOP's version doesn't work that way in real life I all too many instances. From. Beavercreek, Ohio, to Chicago to Cincinnati...

Most cops are good and do their jobs to serve and protect, but the system is design to protect the bad apples as well.

You act as though individuals that murder police officers and/or civilians aren't taken alive on a regular basis. They are, provided they surrender and know how to follow basic commands. It had nothing to do with his skin color.

(11-29-2015 11:16 AM)Coopdaddy67 Wrote:  They are, provided they know how to follow basic commands. It had nothing to do with his skin color.

Coop, I slightly modified your text to take out the surrender part to reflect this is the primary reasons everyone gets shot (regardless of skin color). Police gives order ---> comply

(11-30-2015 09:54 AM)Crewdogz Wrote:  

(11-29-2015 11:16 AM)Coopdaddy67 Wrote:  They are, provided they know how to follow basic commands. It had nothing to do with his skin color.

Coop, I slightly modified your text to take out the surrender part to reflect this is the primary reasons everyone gets shot (regardless of skin color). Police gives order ---> comply

I'm not going to try to convince you otherwise, but in my opinion a black man is generally given less leeway in such matters. There are a whole host of complex reasons why this happens, but it does.

In general, I think African Americans get somewhat of a raw deal in the whole judicial and economic process. Life is difficult enough as it is; I wouldn't want "black" to make it more difficult.

On a personal note, my own kid has spent quite a bit of time in the judicial process over the course of the year. I actually feared that his white, clean cut appearance and polite/passive demeanor in court would help him evade punishment - and to a certain extent I think it did. The fact that he wasn't "just another inner city kid" helped him, even though he made a concerted effort to demonstrate he did not care about the law or the consequences of his actions.

I feel the court has given him an abundance of "second chances."

My position on all of this probably rests well to the left of most of the people on this board, but considerably to the right of Black Lives Matter. Truth probably lies somewhere in the middle.

Let's take one of the more famous black criminals during the last 20 years: Brian Nichols.

1. Escaped custody in the court building.
2. Murdered the judge sitting on his rape trial, the court reporter, a sheriff's deputy and a federal agent. Also beat the hell out of a female deputy.
3. After police responded to the apartment he was held up at, he surrendered and stood trial.

In the eyes of a law enforcement officer, I doubt you could find many individuals worse than him. Yet they took him alive, because he came out with his hands up and followed instructions.

Now let's take the shooting of Laquan McDonald. Excessive force? While I wasn't there and lack all of the relevant facts, I think it was excessive given the video we've seen. With that said, he did have a deadly weapon in his hand and was high on PCP.

You want to avoid being shot? As Crewdogz said, if the police give you an order, comply with it. Don't give police the opportunity to overreact or misread a situation in the heat of the moment. There's plenty of time after the fact for everything to be sorted out.

Quote:I actually feared that his white, clean cut appearance and polite/passive demeanor in court would help him evade punishment

Huh???

If the criminal justice system is so hard on offenders (white or black), why do criminals have multiple offenses and multiple incarcerations?

Seems to me a crooked system could save tax payers quite a bit of money by "offing them" or something... but they don't.

(11-30-2015 03:15 PM)BearcatsUC Wrote:  

(11-30-2015 09:54 AM)Crewdogz Wrote:  

(11-29-2015 11:16 AM)Coopdaddy67 Wrote:  They are, provided they know how to follow basic commands. It had nothing to do with his skin color.

Coop, I slightly modified your text to take out the surrender part to reflect this is the primary reasons everyone gets shot (regardless of skin color). Police gives order ---> comply

I'm not going to try to convince you otherwise, but in my opinion a black man is generally given less leeway in such matters. There are a whole host of complex reasons why this happens, but it does.

In general, I think African Americans get somewhat of a raw deal in the whole judicial and economic process. Life is difficult enough as it is; I wouldn't want "black" to make it more difficult.

On a personal note, my own kid has spent quite a bit of time in the judicial process over the course of the year. I actually feared that his white, clean cut appearance and polite/passive demeanor in court would help him evade punishment - and to a certain extent I think it did. The fact that he wasn't "just another inner city kid" helped him, even though he made a concerted effort to demonstrate he did not care about the law or the consequences of his actions.

I feel the court has given him an abundance of "second chances."

My position on all of this probably rests well to the left of most of the people on this board, but considerably to the right of Black Lives Matter. Truth probably lies somewhere in the middle.

This is the defintion of FUBAR.