(11-19-2015 02:23 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Highest rated G5 to NY6 bowl is best scenario. Winning the CCG is nice but should not be required.

Its always been highest rated conference champion.

Go back to the BCS days and that is what it was.

Arkansas has been on a tear the last few weeks with wins over Ole Miss & LSU on the road, if they finish up with home wins over MS St & Mizzou at home; that givss them a 6-2 conference record and 2nd Place in the SEC West Likely a poll ranking in the 20's. Toledo would have to be ranked ahead of them provided they do not lose any more games.

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

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(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

It was a hypothetical question.

NIU could've lost all four of its non-conf games, lost a MAC game to C Michigan and still been in the position that they're right now.


To say 8-5 NIU is a more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, because they got lucky on one game, is a farce.

(11-19-2015 02:23 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Highest rated G5 to NY6 bowl is best scenario. Winning the CCG is nice but should not be required.

Yep

(11-19-2015 02:49 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

It was a hypothetical question.

NIU could've lost all four of its non-conf games, lost a MAC game to C Michigan and still been in the position that they're right now.


To say 8-5 NIU is a more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, because they got lucky on one game, is a farce.

So then the playoffs for the top teams shouldn't just be champions only then. Gotcha.

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

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Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

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(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Yes, the requirement that the G5 Access Bowl rep be a conference champ is silly. Sometimes the best team isn't a conference champ.

It should just be the highest-rated G5 team. The committee can (and surely would) factor in being a conference champ.

(11-19-2015 02:50 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:49 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

It was a hypothetical question.

NIU could've lost all four of its non-conf games, lost a MAC game to C Michigan and still been in the position that they're right now.


To say 8-5 NIU is a more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, because they got lucky on one game, is a farce.

So then the playoffs for the top teams shouldn't just be champions only then. Gotcha.

Correct. Who was saying it should be?

I've been saying that CFP II may consider having a reserved slot for each P4 conferences' highest ranked team.

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

One game determines your season?

Absolute nonsense.

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Yes, the requirement that the G5 Access Bowl rep be a conference champ is silly. Sometimes the best team isn't a conference champ.

It should just be the highest-rated G5 team. The committee can (and surely would) factor in being a conference champ.

Correct. And that's a good point. The committee may boost the rating of a conf champion G5 team because it is a champion.

No reason to limit it.

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Sure. Unless Toldeo had the same schedule as NIU. If NIU playing a much tougher schedule than Toledo warrants that and it would be shown on the field head to head.

Say NIU OOC was 4 P5 team that just happen to be all ranked in the top ten and lost them all but were competitive till the end. NIU 5th loss would be the 1 conference loss, but still beat Toledo. NIU is still deserving because Toledo didn't play the same teams as NIU and they beat Toledo head to head. That still makes them deserving.

(11-19-2015 03:10 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

One game determines your season?

Absolute nonsense.

I mean, one game at the end of the year can define your season. But you need to win the important games before that to even get there. Fact is Toledo lost one of their most important games to NIU, and they are paying the price. The MACC would have defined their season, and they have only themselves to blame for not being able to get there.

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(11-19-2015 03:11 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 03:10 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

One game determines your season?

Absolute nonsense.

I mean, one game at the end of the year can define your season. But you need to win the important games before that to even get there. Fact is Toledo lost one of their most important games to NIU, and they are paying the price. The MACC would have defined their season, and they have only themselves to blame for not being able to get there.

I was talking about ranking the success of the regular season. Sorry for the poor wording.

One game, no matter how good or how bad, can not determine the success of a regular season.


And success of the regular season is what it should be about. I just don't see how anyone can deny that being a conference champion should have nothing to do being the highest rated G5 team.

(11-19-2015 03:10 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

One game determines your season?

Absolute nonsense.

A lot of times One game does determine your season. Look at what Oklahoma is going thru. Or Michigan even(if they beat MSU, they right now are totally controlling their own destiny). Or last year with Baylor/TCU.

(11-19-2015 03:11 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:31 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 01:46 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  If you are G5 and you can't win your conference, you don't deserve to go to NY6. Sorry.

8-5 NIU is a better, more deserving team than 11-1 Toledo, when considering the whole season??

Absolute nonsense.


Usually it won't matter. But this case, it does.

Sure. Unless Toldeo had the same schedule as NIU. If NIU playing a much tougher schedule than Toledo warrants that and it would be shown on the field head to head.

Say NIU OOC was 4 P5 team that just happen to be all ranked in the top ten and lost them all but were competitive till the end. NIU 5th loss would be the 1 conference loss, but still beat Toledo. NIU is still deserving because Toledo didn't play the same teams as NIU and they beat Toledo head to head. That still makes them deserving.

It was a worst case hypothetical. Clearly, the case you describe would not be the worst case. Heck, in that case I probably wouldn't say peep.

The worst case is for NIU to lose all four non-conf games that aren't difficult, then swoop in and beat Toledo on one game and get in over them, when Toledo has had a great season overall.

If you just strip away all the names, it's obvious the American conference has played at a pretty high level all year....even if Toledo weren't trapped, I can't imagine the American champ not getting in

(11-19-2015 03:14 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 03:10 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:54 PM)HawkeyeCoug Wrote:  

(11-19-2015 02:37 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  Well head to head record said NIU is the better team... also NIU is 8-3 man, where you pulling these facts from? If NIU wins out they will be 10-3, not 8-5...

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Head-to-head says that the Huskies were better *that night.* The Longhorns were also better than the Sooners for one 60 minute stretch this year - think Texas should be going to the playoffs?

Hard to say what would happen if the NIU and Toledo played 10 times, but their records on the year indicate it would skew a little toward the Rockets. Boston College and Central Michigan are not high-level losses. Composite has NIU at 57, Toledo at 29 - pretty large gap.

Northern Illinois can get their reward by playing in the title game. Toledo should be rewarded for their much larger body of successful work by getting the G5 slot if they are the highest rated G5 team. The entire season should count, and the Rockets should not be cheated out of a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity that they earned.

Well they weren't cheated. They choked on a national stage. Beat NIU and nobody asks these hypotheticals.

One game determines your season?

Absolute nonsense.

A lot of times One game does determine your season. Look at what Oklahoma is going thru. Or Michigan even(if they beat MSU, they right now are totally controlling their own destiny). Or last year with Baylor/TCU.

Nope, that's not the same thing.

Oklahoma will be judged on their entire season of work. Their entire season of work at 11-1 would be (slightly) worse than Notre Dame's season of work at 11-1.


If Toledo was allowed to be judged using the same method, their season of work would clearly be superior at 11-1 than NIU at 8-5.