http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/10/...s-fs1-fox/

FS1 now with 2 of the 3 worst rated LCS ever. It will be interesting to see if MLB tries to force the issue with them airing games on Big Fox rather than FS1. And if Fox balks- what that means for the next deal after the 2021 season.

I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

both. The fact that last years was the now 3rd worst hurts as well.

I think next year probably will be a make or break year in the playoffs for FS1.

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

(10-27-2015 12:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/10/...s-fs1-fox/

FS1 now with 2 of the 3 worst rated LCS ever. It will be interesting to see if MLB tries to force the issue with them airing games on Big Fox rather than FS1. And if Fox balks- what that means for the next deal after the 2021 season.

FS1 has other issues, but in the case of the LCS games, they have simply been the luck (or unluck) of the draw.

Regardless, MLB can't force them to move any games to Big Fox. MLB decided to take the most money possible, which meant taking cable money. if they wanted over-the-air games, then MLB would have had to take less money, so that's the contractual trade-off. Plus, TBS doesn't even have an over-the-air option, so they can't apply a different standard to Fox.

Finally, remember that many MLB teams (such as the Yankees, Angels and Cardinals) are getting *insanely* rich off of Fox via their regional sports network deals. Those RSN deals are significantly more important to those teams compared to the national TV deals. So, MLB is going to maintain a very close relationship with Fox overall.

(10-27-2015 12:32 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/10/...s-fs1-fox/

FS1 now with 2 of the 3 worst rated LCS ever. It will be interesting to see if MLB tries to force the issue with them airing games on Big Fox rather than FS1. And if Fox balks- what that means for the next deal after the 2021 season.

FS1 has other issues, but in the case of the LCS games, they have simply been the luck (or unluck) of the draw.

Regardless, MLB can't force them to move any games to Big Fox. MLB decided to take the most money possible, which meant taking cable money. if they wanted over-the-air games, then MLB would have had to take less money, so that's the contractual trade-off. Plus, TBS doesn't even have an over-the-air option, so they can't apply a different standard to Fox.

Finally, remember that many MLB teams (such as the Yankees, Angels and Cardinals) are getting *insanely* rich off of Fox via their regional sports network deals. Those RSN deals are significantly more important to those teams compared to the national TV deals. So, MLB is going to maintain a very close relationship with Fox overall.

MLB can strongly suggest to Fox to put them on Big Fox...

As far as the individual teams- yeah there are some with Fox- but a lot that aren't with Fox. I think you are kidding yourself that if the putrid ratings on FS1 continue- that MLB couldn't leave Fox when the deal ends in 2021. MLB absolutely could. If FS1 is still pulling in much smaller audiences compared to Turner, and Fox won't budge- MLB easily could make a move.

(10-27-2015 12:32 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/10/...s-fs1-fox/

FS1 now with 2 of the 3 worst rated LCS ever. It will be interesting to see if MLB tries to force the issue with them airing games on Big Fox rather than FS1. And if Fox balks- what that means for the next deal after the 2021 season.

FS1 has other issues, but in the case of the LCS games, they have simply been the luck (or unluck) of the draw.

Regardless, MLB can't force them to move any games to Big Fox. MLB decided to take the most money possible, which meant taking cable money. if they wanted over-the-air games, then MLB would have had to take less money, so that's the contractual trade-off. Plus, TBS doesn't even have an over-the-air option, so they can't apply a different standard to Fox.

Finally, remember that many MLB teams (such as the Yankees, Angels and Cardinals) are getting *insanely* rich off of Fox via their regional sports network deals. Those RSN deals are significantly more important to those teams compared to the national TV deals. So, MLB is going to maintain a very close relationship with Fox overall.

Yup. Fox RSNs have most of the MLB teams and they pay those teams lavishly. The Angels get $3 billion over 20 years to air games on their Fox Sports West RSN. The Padres are getting $1.5 billion over 20 years from Fox, even though they have one of the smallest MLB TV territories (I think MLB only allows them to have San Diego County and Imperial County, compared to some MLB teams who get to claim several states as their TV territory).

(10-27-2015 12:39 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:32 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/10/...s-fs1-fox/

FS1 now with 2 of the 3 worst rated LCS ever. It will be interesting to see if MLB tries to force the issue with them airing games on Big Fox rather than FS1. And if Fox balks- what that means for the next deal after the 2021 season.

FS1 has other issues, but in the case of the LCS games, they have simply been the luck (or unluck) of the draw.

Regardless, MLB can't force them to move any games to Big Fox. MLB decided to take the most money possible, which meant taking cable money. if they wanted over-the-air games, then MLB would have had to take less money, so that's the contractual trade-off. Plus, TBS doesn't even have an over-the-air option, so they can't apply a different standard to Fox.

Finally, remember that many MLB teams (such as the Yankees, Angels and Cardinals) are getting *insanely* rich off of Fox via their regional sports network deals. Those RSN deals are significantly more important to those teams compared to the national TV deals. So, MLB is going to maintain a very close relationship with Fox overall.

MLB can strongly suggest to Fox to put them on Big Fox...

As far as the individual teams- yeah there are some with Fox- but a lot that aren't with Fox. I think you are kidding yourself that if the putrid ratings on FS1 continue- that MLB couldn't leave Fox when the deal ends in 2021. MLB absolutely could. If FS1 is still pulling in much smaller audiences compared to Turner, and Fox won't budge- MLB easily could make a move.

In theory, sure. However, if MLB wants to get the highest rights fees, it will still likely need to be a cable partner of some sort. So, ESPN and NBCSN would need to get into the bidding, and ESPN is really the only cable network that would provide a guaranteed ratings boost simply because of channel placement over FS1. (NBCSN would likely be in the same general position as FS1, where the ratings are going to be highly variable depending upon the matchup.)

If all things are equal, then sure, MLB could move to ESPN. However, if Fox is offering more money than ESPN and keeping the World Series on Big Fox (much more important to MLB compared to the LCS games), then having games on FS1 is the cost of doing business. Disney wants to keep sports off of ABC with the exception of weekends (see college football and now the NBA package taking over Saturday nights) and don't want the World Series interrupting their fall prime time schedule. (The NBA Finals are a different matter because they are in the summer when ABC would otherwise be showing reruns.)

That's the bigger picture: it's not a matter of LCS games moving back to over-the-air. Instead, it's more of ensuring that the World Series *stays* on over-the-air (which has not been a presumed guarantee at all in recent negotiations).

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

Yup - if FS1 had the NL, and TBS had the AL, ratings would be reversed.

(10-27-2015 12:39 PM)stever20 Wrote:  MLB can strongly suggest to Fox to put them on Big Fox...

As far as the individual teams- yeah there are some with Fox- but a lot that aren't with Fox. I think you are kidding yourself that if the putrid ratings on FS1 continue- that MLB couldn't leave Fox when the deal ends in 2021. MLB absolutely could.

That is not what he is saying. What he is saying is Fox paid them ***EXTRA*** to allow them the freedom to move some games to FS1, including playoff games. That is what he means by it was a tradeoff MLB made going in, and they could have taken the games on Big Fox for less money. They (MLB) are getting paid to help the network grow.

(10-27-2015 12:59 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

Yup - if FS1 had the NL, and TBS had the AL, ratings would be reversed.

Um, no. TBS is in about 12 million more homes than FS1 is. No guarantee at all that the ratings would be reversed.

(10-27-2015 01:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:59 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

Yup - if FS1 had the NL, and TBS had the AL, ratings would be reversed.

Um, no. TBS is in about 12 million more homes than FS1 is. No guarantee at all that the ratings would be reversed.

People would find it. May not be a complete reversal, but close to it.

(10-27-2015 12:59 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:16 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I dunno if it's an indictment of FS1 as much as it was small market Kansas City playing foreign market Toronto.

Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

Yup - if FS1 had the NL, and TBS had the AL, ratings would be reversed.

FS1 was screwed this year when the Astros beat the Yankees as they were assured no matter what happened in the ALDS on they were destined to have a poor national draw in the ALCS. None of the four teams left were good national draws.

TBS hit the jackpot, especially when the Cubs beat the Pirates as three of four NLDS teams were big market teams and the fourth was the most successful MLB team in the past decade, who BTW is arguably the third most popular MLB team and no worse than fourth.

MLB revenues have surged in recent years, they are almost at NFL-level right now.

Selig was many things, but as a revenue-generator he was a Beast for MLB.

MLB has leveraged its huge inventory and the internet and regional networks to make massive amounts of dough the last 10 years.

(10-27-2015 01:05 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:59 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:27 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:24 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  Afternoon games as well. When they actually had prime time games the ratings weren't that bad.

Other series had day games as well though.

FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

Yup - if FS1 had the NL, and TBS had the AL, ratings would be reversed.

Um, no. TBS is in about 12 million more homes than FS1 is. No guarantee at all that the ratings would be reversed.

Depends entirely on how many casual fans were watching.

Any non-casual fan will find the game regardless what channel it's on, if he has the channel.


Given how boring baseball is to watch on TV, even for non-casual fans, I doubt many casual fans were cruising channels and said "oh hey, the American League Series with Kansas City vs Toronto ... sounds cool, let's watch this for 3 hours".

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

And the NL's most popular, historical franchise. And the luck of having LA play New York and the NL's biggest rivalry (okay, Dodgers/Giants is huge too).

(10-27-2015 03:23 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  

(10-27-2015 12:56 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  FS1 had a total of 5 prime time games this entire postseason. 2 of those were the networks top all time viewed events. They had the crappy draw this year and TBS hit the jackpot with New York, LA, and Chicago.

And the NL's most popular, historical franchise. And the luck of having LA play New York and the NL's biggest rivalry (okay, Dodgers/Giants is huge too).

Cardinals don't mean tv ratings though.

(10-27-2015 02:00 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  MLB revenues have surged in recent years, they are almost at NFL-level right now.

Selig was many things, but as a revenue-generator he was a Beast for MLB.

MLB has leveraged its huge inventory and the internet and regional networks to make massive amounts of dough the last 10 years.

MLB has made a comeback. In the 70's and 80's it lost a lot of ground to NFL and the NBA. The creation of the super bowl was a tremendous success. At half the high schools and colleges in the country basketball was the most popular sport so NBA was easy to get into. Playing in the winter is also a plus for NBA TV when there are less activities going on.

MLB has found a niche among upper middle class fans that like a non-violent sport in beautiful 40,000 seat ballparks. The development of ESPN/Fox cable baseball packages has been good for baseball. Business travelers like being able to go back to the hotel and flip on a mellow baseball game any Tuesday or Wednesday night of the summer. Its a very corporate friendly sport.