& he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite ala SMU.

Make them prepare for both. Summers has looked good, but we are all still a little in the dark as to exactly how much of the playbook he has control over. If there are some downfield matchups that Ruff wants to exploit, Kemp may be the better choice at this point. However it plays out, I don't want Kemp or Summers left in too long if they are struggling early and it's a one or two score game. If it does get out hand, I'd like to see Summers getting the majority of the snaps so he's better prepared for the conference games.

(10-07-2015 09:06 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite ala SMU.

Make them prepare for both. Summers has looked good, but we are all still a little in the dark as to exactly how much of the playbook he has control over. If there are some downfield matchups that Ruff wants to exploit, Kemp may be the better choice at this point. However it plays out, I don't want Kemp or Summers left in too long if they are struggling early and it's a one or two score game. If it does get out hand, I'd like to see Summers getting the majority of the snaps so he's better prepared for the conference games.

What does it take to prepare for Kemp?

(10-07-2015 09:34 AM)PirateMarv Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:06 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite ala SMU.

Make them prepare for both. Summers has looked good, but we are all still a little in the dark as to exactly how much of the playbook he has control over. If there are some downfield matchups that Ruff wants to exploit, Kemp may be the better choice at this point. However it plays out, I don't want Kemp or Summers left in too long if they are struggling early and it's a one or two score game. If it does get out hand, I'd like to see Summers getting the majority of the snaps so he's better prepared for the conference games.

What does it take to prepare for Kemp?

Pass rushes. Lots and lots of pass rushes.

(10-07-2015 09:39 AM)8BitPirate Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:34 AM)PirateMarv Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:06 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite ala SMU.

Make them prepare for both. Summers has looked good, but we are all still a little in the dark as to exactly how much of the playbook he has control over. If there are some downfield matchups that Ruff wants to exploit, Kemp may be the better choice at this point. However it plays out, I don't want Kemp or Summers left in too long if they are struggling early and it's a one or two score game. If it does get out hand, I'd like to see Summers getting the majority of the snaps so he's better prepared for the conference games.

What does it take to prepare for Kemp?

Pass rushes. Lots and lots of pass rushes.

I would think that they would be practicing their sack dances.

Football is a game of strategy and one of those strategies can be misdirection. I wouldn't expect Ruff or the staff to show their true intentions because they become available to the opposition.

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

https://eastcarolina.rivals.com/content....&PT=4&PR=2

McNeill says he plans to stick with the usual script at quarterback again this week and has Kemp penciled in as the starter again this week.

ECU travels to Provo, Utah to take on BYU this Saturday night at 7:30 ET on ESPN U.
"I think it gives us the best opportunity as a team, then we'll go with whoever can give us the best advantage. James is getting more comfortable with the package and the system and he is great on the sideline. Blake and James exchange ideas on the sidelines. James gave us some energy and that helped open up the run game."

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)B easy Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

https://eastcarolina.rivals.com/content....&PT=4&PR=2

McNeill says he plans to stick with the usual script at quarterback again this week and has Kemp penciled in as the starter again this week.

ECU travels to Provo, Utah to take on BYU this Saturday night at 7:30 ET on ESPN U.
"I think it gives us the best opportunity as a team, then we'll go with whoever can give us the best advantage. James is getting more comfortable with the package and the system and he is great on the sideline. Blake and James exchange ideas on the sidelines. James gave us some energy and that helped open up the run game."

That's why Kemp still plays. Summers just doesn't have the whole package yet. Playing Kemp forces BYU coaches and players to look at film from last year and this year that features a pass heavy offense and gives them less time to look at Summers limited playing time. BYU's secondary has to prepare for the full offense, and not knowing how much of it that Summers knows beyond what he has shown in his limited passing is just another unknown that they have to deal with.

I'm comfortable with Kemp getting the start (even though I feel Summers has earned it and hopefully when he has at least half the playbook they will reward him with the starters job) and playing as long as he is effective. Summers has more of an ability to bail ECU out of a bad position if Kemp gets us in one that Kemp does if Summers gets us into a bad spot.

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  Football is a game of strategy and one of those strategies can be misdirection. I wouldn't expect Ruff or the staff to show their true intentions because they become available to the opposition.

Ruff's never been afraid to name the starter or one to hold that out there as a some sort of ploy. Take Rio for example, once the change was made that was it, cut and dry never heard from him again. I don't think he's blowing smoke up anyone ass here.

(10-07-2015 09:34 AM)PirateMarv Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:06 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite ala SMU.

Make them prepare for both. Summers has looked good, but we are all still a little in the dark as to exactly how much of the playbook he has control over. If there are some downfield matchups that Ruff wants to exploit, Kemp may be the better choice at this point. However it plays out, I don't want Kemp or Summers left in too long if they are struggling early and it's a one or two score game. If it does get out hand, I'd like to see Summers getting the majority of the snaps so he's better prepared for the conference games.

What does it take to prepare for Kemp?

It's not so much the 2 QB's abilities that BYU has to prepare for, its basically 2 different offenses. That's why its very shrewd and smart to say we're going to use 2 QB's whether we really are or aren't. That's the main difference we aren't playing 2 QB's running the exact same Air Raid offense, and that's not to say that Summers can't run the Air Raid, it's just they're smart and realized with his athletic ability we can be far more diverse running read option with him.

When Kemp is in we are running a more traditional Air Raid offense, very heavy on the pass game which we've had success with. With Summers we run a different offense which is far more run heavy with a lot of read option with essentially 3 options-QB keep, QB handoff, QB pass. I've heard people compare it more to the Oregon offense which might be relatively close.

That's why Ruff and the other coaches keep saying that it is a challenge for other teams to prepare for because they have to be ready to play 2 different style of offenses. If they have success stopping one then we can theoretically play the other. Right now we've had greater success running Summer's offense the last 2 games. I do believe he is more talented them Kemp and will probably get the majority of snaps from this point forward in the season.

As far as why are we using 2 QB's when Summers can probably do both offenses well, my speculation (and it's pure guessing) is that we are teaching and working on certain packages for only Kemp and certain packages for only Summers to lessen the load, particularly for Summers who hasn't been here very long.

(10-07-2015 10:09 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)B easy Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

https://eastcarolina.rivals.com/content....&PT=4&PR=2

McNeill says he plans to stick with the usual script at quarterback again this week and has Kemp penciled in as the starter again this week.

ECU travels to Provo, Utah to take on BYU this Saturday night at 7:30 ET on ESPN U.
"I think it gives us the best opportunity as a team, then we'll go with whoever can give us the best advantage. James is getting more comfortable with the package and the system and he is great on the sideline. Blake and James exchange ideas on the sidelines. James gave us some energy and that helped open up the run game."

That's why Kemp still plays. Summers just doesn't have the whole package yet. Playing Kemp forces BYU coaches and players to look at film from last year and this year that features a pass heavy offense and gives them less time to look at Summers limited playing time. BYU's secondary has to prepare for the full offense, and not knowing how much of it that Summers knows beyond what he has shown in his limited passing is just another unknown that they have to deal with.

I'm comfortable with Kemp getting the start (even though I feel Summers has earned it and hopefully when he has at least half the playbook they will reward him with the starters job) and playing as long as he is effective. Summers has more of an ability to bail ECU out of a bad position if Kemp gets us in one that Kemp does if Summers gets us into a bad spot.

I'd start Summers and go with him until it didn't work, but having Kemp in the loop is the prudent thing to do this week regardless.

Summers hasn't really ran on a defense like BYU when they knew it was coming as VT was probably caught by surprise and SMU is just a bad run defense, and he hasn't had the pressure of a 60k+ road game enviroment all on him and when he did vs Florida for a series it was shaky.

If they shut his running down he's not had a game he's had to throw 50 passes either. Kemp is tested in that area and did all those things pretty well vs #11 Florida in the swamp in front of 85k and had us in a position to win and that's the kind of quality of team and game and environment that more resembles this BYU road trip than VT at home or infront of 5k fans at SMU. I think you got to keep him in the mix right now too. If Summers comes and and does the same running to BYU or shows he can pass in high volume if they take away his run then would be the time to completely move on at that point.

(10-07-2015 10:09 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)B easy Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

https://eastcarolina.rivals.com/content....&PT=4&PR=2

McNeill says he plans to stick with the usual script at quarterback again this week and has Kemp penciled in as the starter again this week.

ECU travels to Provo, Utah to take on BYU this Saturday night at 7:30 ET on ESPN U.
"I think it gives us the best opportunity as a team, then we'll go with whoever can give us the best advantage. James is getting more comfortable with the package and the system and he is great on the sideline. Blake and James exchange ideas on the sidelines. James gave us some energy and that helped open up the run game."

That's why Kemp still plays. Summers just doesn't have the whole package yet. Playing Kemp forces BYU coaches and players to look at film from last year and this year that features a pass heavy offense and gives them less time to look at Summers limited playing time. BYU's secondary has to prepare for the full offense, and not knowing how much of it that Summers knows beyond what he has shown in his limited passing is just another unknown that they have to deal with.

I'm comfortable with Kemp getting the start (even though I feel Summers has earned it and hopefully when he has at least half the playbook they will reward him with the starters job) and playing as long as he is effective. Summers has more of an ability to bail ECU out of a bad position if Kemp gets us in one that Kemp does if Summers gets us into a bad spot.

23pts is too much to give up before making a change. Let Kemp start. If he has trouble early, there is no reason to keep him in for an extended period of time. Especially if you're just going to run the same read option plays Summers would get. There is no advantage to leaving a struggling Kemp in. BYU is not going to stay on their heals fearful of plays he can't make. They will become even more aggressive. We cannot afford to dig ourselves the hole we spotted SMU.

I'm not a Kemp hater. I think he's actually pretty good. I just think he needs more time to become the QB we need. Unfortunately, Summers needs time as well to learn the playbook.

(10-07-2015 10:12 AM)StillJonesing Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  Football is a game of strategy and one of those strategies can be misdirection. I wouldn't expect Ruff or the staff to show their true intentions because they become available to the opposition.

Ruff's never been afraid to name the starter or one to hold that out there as a some sort of ploy. Take Rio for example, once the change was made that was it, cut and dry never heard from him again. I don't think he's blowing smoke up anyone ass here.

Agree.

BYU...

(10-07-2015 10:09 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:49 AM)B easy Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 09:03 AM)Indiana Bones Wrote:  & he's adamant about using both QBs. This has got to be a ploy, right? Summers is by far the better option & he matches up particularly well against the BYU defense. BYU makes a living by making QBs like Kemp turn the ball over but dual threat QBs may be their kryptonite à la SMU.

https://eastcarolina.rivals.com/content....&PT=4&PR=2

McNeill says he plans to stick with the usual script at quarterback again this week and has Kemp penciled in as the starter again this week.

ECU travels to Provo, Utah to take on BYU this Saturday night at 7:30 ET on ESPN U.
"I think it gives us the best opportunity as a team, then we'll go with whoever can give us the best advantage. James is getting more comfortable with the package and the system and he is great on the sideline. Blake and James exchange ideas on the sidelines. James gave us some energy and that helped open up the run game."

That's why Kemp still plays. Summers just doesn't have the whole package yet. Playing Kemp forces BYU coaches and players to look at film from last year and this year that features a pass heavy offense and gives them less time to look at Summers limited playing time. BYU's secondary has to prepare for the full offense, and not knowing how much of it that Summers knows beyond what he has shown in his limited passing is just another unknown that they have to deal with.

I'm comfortable with Kemp getting the start (even though I feel Summers has earned it and hopefully when he has at least half the playbook they will reward him with the starters job) and playing as long as he is effective. Summers has more of an ability to bail ECU out of a bad position if Kemp gets us in one that Kemp does if Summers gets us into a bad spot.

This is about the most well reasoned post on the QB situation I've seen and I agree.

The leash will be much shorter for Mr. Kemp this week. Personally..I hope he move the offense and puts points on the board. If he has the hot hand...ride it. If not?...Summers

(10-07-2015 12:06 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  The leash will be much shorter for Mr. Kemp this week. Personally..I hope he move the offense and puts points on the board. If he has the hot hand...ride it. If not?...Summers

I'd give him 2 drives.

-If he turns the ball over on either of those 2 drives, bench him.

-If he fails to lead TD drives on either of the first 2 drives, bench him.

-If he leads a TD drive on ONE of the 2 drives, still put Summers in on drive #3, and see how he does.

-If he leads back to back TD drives to open the game, keep him in until he turns the ball over, and then bench him.

Another thing to consider is the altitude. While I absolutely think that is overblown in the bigger picture if you have Summers essentially running or passing it every player or having to be an option decoy, especially at our normal tempo that could be an issue.

WR's and RB's and players that do serious running do come out of the game even with in drives to catch their breath which is why it shouldn't be an issue. If Summers is running or throwing just about every play it probably would have an affect then on him specifically and what he does.

(10-07-2015 01:12 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Another thing to consider is the altitude. While I absolutely think that is overblown in the bigger picture if you have Summers essentially running or passing it every player or having to be an option decoy, especially at our normal tempo that could be an issue.

WR's and RB's and players that do serious running do come out of the game even with in drives to catch their breath which is why it shouldn't be an issue. If Summers is running or throwing just about every play it probably would have an affect then on him specifically and what he does.

It's only 4,500 feet and for most people it takes 5-6 days to affect you. Flying up and playing a football with the level of S&C D-1 athletes have it's pretty much a none factor. It's nothing more than a overstatement by fans to have something to talk about. UConn's players didn't look gassed. Their RB was still going hard in the 4th. Their QB made bad throws and their O-line isn't any good. Had the O-line been better for UConn they could have won.

Above 5,500 feet yes it is an issue, O2 levels drop by over 29%. Under that, Provo, it's only about 10% lower.

(10-07-2015 01:40 PM)ecumbh1999 Wrote:  

(10-07-2015 01:12 PM)StillJonesing Wrote:  Another thing to consider is the altitude. While I absolutely think that is overblown in the bigger picture if you have Summers essentially running or passing it every player or having to be an option decoy, especially at our normal tempo that could be an issue.

WR's and RB's and players that do serious running do come out of the game even with in drives to catch their breath which is why it shouldn't be an issue. If Summers is running or throwing just about every play it probably would have an affect then on him specifically and what he does.

It's only 4,500 feet and for most people it takes 5-6 days to affect you. Flying up and playing a football with the level of S&C D-1 athletes have it's pretty much a none factor. It's nothing more than a overstatement by fans to have something to talk about. UConn's players didn't look gassed. Their RB was still going hard in the 4th. Their QB made bad throws and their O-line isn't any good. Had the O-line been better for UConn they could have won.

Above 5,500 feet yes it is an issue, O2 levels drop by over 29%. Under that, Provo, it's only about 10% lower.

I pointed that out last week. I've been on the top of a 14k+ mountain and had no issues and I watched our basketball team have no issue at Weber State in a sport that does a lot more non stop running. That said RB's and WR's look gassed all the time when in completely NORMAL circumstances if they carry it a couple times in a row. If Summers is going to be out there running the ball or throwing about every down that can be a fatigue issue regardless of which altitude would just be another factor to pile on. We haven't seen him an entire game. Even by the end of the VT game he was becoming less effective either through fatigue or adjustment.

For the people that don't even want to hear Kemp's name anymore there are still unknowns around Summers. I would have started Summers and played him like we have been until it doesn't work, but Kemp should have certainly had some reps this week and been prepared to play and not just in a way you mouth service that to any back up.