(09-29-2015 02:24 PM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:10 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  I just don't see how they are going to do 4x16 (64) unless there will be some schools who are currently in P5 conferences who decide to drop a division. You have Notre Dame and BYU plus there are a hand full or two of schools who have a very good argument they belong with the big group-- maybe more so than some of the bottom tier group in the P5.

There will be some current schools drop out.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/col.../27598219/

There are several articles like this where the Presidents of Northwestern, Stanford, Notre Dame are adament that they will form a new NCAA division if amateur sports keep heading toward pro sports run by the ESPN ring leaders. NBC and Fox could take over this league. Vanderbilt, Boston College, Duke, etc would do the same followed by Rice, Tulane, and much of the G5.

.

Yeah I've seen that before. It might be true for a few of those schools but there are others I can't see passing up the revenue and exposure they draw from playing power conference football.

Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

(09-29-2015 03:05 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

And I'm pretty OK with this.

It wouldn't bother me either. But I'd be willing to bet you could hear most of the people in here screaming for years after it happened.

(09-29-2015 01:25 PM)Underdog Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:23 PM)Chappy Wrote:  It's not going to happen. I could see the SEC, B1G or ACC getting up to 18 teams before I see the Pac 12 becoming the Pac 14 or 16.

The conferences are going to expand as it makes sense for them, and not to reach some nice round even number.

... and which conference do you think those new members will come from?

Hint: It's not B1G, SEC, ACC, and PAC 12.

It will be the ACC conference that will be picked apart. Duke, Wake Forest, Miami, Pittsburgh, Syracuse and Boston College will be left out. But then again, you have P5 starting to name schools as P5 status like BYU, Army, Navy, UConn, and Cincinnati. They know there will be money there is you start to include others. This could mean if they do expand to 8 teams for the playoffs? The P5 could actually create a 6th Power conference with whom they like in it.

10 years or more it may happen. Until then I'm enjoying CFB, as it is.

(09-29-2015 02:10 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:59 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  4x18 or 4x20 just as likely as 4x16

Also, what about hoops?

I think geography and politics will not allow a 4 x any consistent number. The Pac is geographically confined, and isn't likely to add BYU or Boise. The only real shot would be UT, TT, OU and KU to the Pac, and that seems unlikely.

Even if it happened, that leaves few, if any, Big 12 teams that another P5 conference would want. Unless UT and OU bolt (and they have shopped themselves almost everywhere but the SEC), I think the P5 remains at 5.

Trying to be objective, and not just self serving.

The fans will not like that idea to travel half way across the country to support their teams. I see fans can weight in on this, and I do see that the PAC 12 will have to bite the bullet and take Boise State, BYU, Colorado State, UNR, Hawaii, San Deigo State and some others. Big 12 and PAC 12 could tear down the MWC conference to nothing which leaves Wyoming, San Jose State, and Utah State as independents which could bring New Mexico State and Idaho back together to reform the MWC and add schools from MVFC and Big Sky to get back to 12. MWC is a threat to both Big 12 and PAC 12 in both football and basketball.

(09-29-2015 03:05 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

There could be anti-trust lawsuits to take place against the P5 conferences if they do not start including some of the G5 schools or top FCS schools. This is ruining college sports the way you want it to come out with. I do not see them leaving money on the table if they leave out the top G5 schools that do make money like BYU, Boise State and East Carolina. But, how can schools like Northwestern, Duke, Wake and Vanderbilt stay in a P5 conferences with issues of fan support or the money issues? Vanderbilt is actually losing money than they are making money. They might wind up dropping football.

(09-29-2015 03:50 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:25 PM)Underdog Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:23 PM)Chappy Wrote:  It's not going to happen. I could see the SEC, B1G or ACC getting up to 18 teams before I see the Pac 12 becoming the Pac 14 or 16.

The conferences are going to expand as it makes sense for them, and not to reach some nice round even number.

... and which conference do you think those new members will come from?

Hint: It's not B1G, SEC, ACC, and PAC 12.

It will be the ACC conference that will be picked apart. Duke, Wake Forest, Miami, Pittsburgh, Syracuse and Boston College will be left out. But then again, you have P5 starting to name schools as P5 status like BYU, Army, Navy, UConn, and Cincinnati. They know there will be money there is you start to include others. This could mean if they do expand to 8 teams for the playoffs? The P5 could actually create a 6th Power conference with whom they like in it.

DavidSt…. You couldn’t stop after the above post. Instead, you decided to go full Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey on the board with the following post:

(09-29-2015 03:58 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  The fans will not like that idea to travel half way across the country to support their teams. I see fans can weight in on this, and I do see that the PAC 12 will have to bite the bullet and take Boise State, BYU, Colorado State, UNR, Hawaii, San Deigo State and some others. Big 12 and PAC 12 could tear down the MWC conference to nothing which leaves Wyoming, San Jose State, and Utah State as independents which could bring New Mexico State and Idaho back together to reform the MWC and add schools from MVFC and Big Sky to get back to 12. MWC is a threat to both Big 12 and PAC 12 in both football and basketball.

Please... don’t turn this thread into:

(09-29-2015 04:20 PM)Underdog Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:50 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:25 PM)Underdog Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:23 PM)Chappy Wrote:  It's not going to happen. I could see the SEC, B1G or ACC getting up to 18 teams before I see the Pac 12 becoming the Pac 14 or 16.

The conferences are going to expand as it makes sense for them, and not to reach some nice round even number.

... and which conference do you think those new members will come from?

Hint: It's not B1G, SEC, ACC, and PAC 12.

It will be the ACC conference that will be picked apart. Duke, Wake Forest, Miami, Pittsburgh, Syracuse and Boston College will be left out. But then again, you have P5 starting to name schools as P5 status like BYU, Army, Navy, UConn, and Cincinnati. They know there will be money there is you start to include others. This could mean if they do expand to 8 teams for the playoffs? The P5 could actually create a 6th Power conference with whom they like in it.

DavidSt…. You couldn’t stop after the above post. Instead, you decided to go full Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey on the board with the following post:

(09-29-2015 03:58 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  The fans will not like that idea to travel half way across the country to support their teams. I see fans can weight in on this, and I do see that the PAC 12 will have to bite the bullet and take Boise State, BYU, Colorado State, UNR, Hawaii, San Deigo State and some others. Big 12 and PAC 12 could tear down the MWC conference to nothing which leaves Wyoming, San Jose State, and Utah State as independents which could bring New Mexico State and Idaho back together to reform the MWC and add schools from MVFC and Big Sky to get back to 12. MWC is a threat to both Big 12 and PAC 12 in both football and basketball.

Please... don’t turn this thread into:

The ACC schools either joining the Big 10 or the SEC for network exposure and more money. There may not be enough interest for the left overs into the Big 12.

I could see this as the future of the ACC.

Boston College
Syracuse
Pittsburgh
Duke
Wake Forest
Miami Florida
West Virginia
East Carolina
UConn
Cincinnati
Navy
UCF
USF
U.Mass.

Big 12
Baylor
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Texas
TCU
Texas Tech
Houston
Memphis
Colorado State
BYU
Boise State
New Mexico
Northern Illinois

That will make 6 P5 Conferences. It depends who PAC 12 decides to add from the left overs of the MWC and Big Sky to go up to the same numbers as the others.

(09-29-2015 01:10 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  I just don't see how they are going to do 4x16 (64) unless there will be some schools who are currently in P5 conferences who decide to drop a division. You have Notre Dame and BYU plus there are a hand full or two of schools who have a very good argument they belong with the big group-- maybe more so than some of the bottom tier group in the P5.

U only have to lose one, No new adds other than ND. last in first out, good bye Lousiville. That being said I don't see it happening.

(09-29-2015 04:04 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:05 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

There could be anti-trust lawsuits to take place against the P5 conferences if they do not start including some of the G5 schools or top FCS schools. This is ruining college sports the way you want it to come out with. I do not see them leaving money on the table if they leave out the top G5 schools that do make money like BYU, Boise State and East Carolina. But, how can schools like Northwestern, Duke, Wake and Vanderbilt stay in a P5 conferences with issues of fan support or the money issues? Vanderbilt is actually losing money than they are making money. They might wind up dropping football.

If Vanderbilt drops football it won't be because of money. Vanderbilt has plenty of money.

I could see a division forming that would fall between the current FBS and FCS divisions if amateurism is compromised too far. A division I-B with the likes of Northwestern, Stanford, Notre Dame, Duke, the service academies, some of the smaller/more academically rigorous public schools like Georgia Tech, UVA and Pitt, and many current Division I basketball-only schools could be very successful. Especially if it is the top level of truly amateur college sports. I think people underestimate how much the appeal of college sports depends on the athletes' amateur/student status.

(09-29-2015 06:59 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:10 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  I just don't see how they are going to do 4x16 (64) unless there will be some schools who are currently in P5 conferences who decide to drop a division. You have Notre Dame and BYU plus there are a hand full or two of schools who have a very good argument they belong with the big group-- maybe more so than some of the bottom tier group in the P5.

U only have to lose one, No new adds other than ND. last in first out, good bye Lousiville. That being said I don't see it happening.

Louisville will never be left out. UCF on the other hand? Yes. They offer no value in anything

(09-29-2015 04:04 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:05 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

There could be anti-trust lawsuits to take place against the P5 conferences if they do not start including some of the G5 schools or top FCS schools. This is ruining college sports the way you want it to come out with. I do not see them leaving money on the table if they leave out the top G5 schools that do make money like BYU, Boise State and East Carolina. But, how can schools like Northwestern, Duke, Wake and Vanderbilt stay in a P5 conferences with issues of fan support or the money issues? Vanderbilt is actually losing money than they are making money. They might wind up dropping football.

Oh, really? The NCAA is a voluntary organization, an exclusive club, which does not come under anti-trust legislation. It's like trying to force Augusta National to take a member they don't want. The courts can't force it, since the membership determines the rules.

The NCAA is more like Augusta National than a business. Businesses fall under anti-trust legislation. Clubs don't, and the government can't force the NCAA to do diddly on that front.

They can't force a conference to take a school that wants in. They can't force the NCAA to allow anyone that wants to be FBS in. The government can't do on that front, buddy boy. Thinking otherwise will only lead you to despair.

(09-29-2015 02:10 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 01:59 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  4x18 or 4x20 just as likely as 4x16

Also, what about hoops?

I think geography and politics will not allow a 4 x any consistent number. The Pac is geographically confined, and isn't likely to add BYU or Boise. The only real shot would be UT, TT, OU and KU to the Pac, and that seems unlikely.

Even if it happened, that leaves few, if any, Big 12 teams that another P5 conference would want. Unless UT and OU bolt (and they have shopped themselves almost everywhere but the SEC), I think the P5 remains at 5.

Trying to be objective, and not just self serving.

OU has not shopped themselves to the SEC??? They've been in talks with the SEC since 1991 and in 2011 approached us about taking both OU and OSU, the same deal they shopped to the PAC. They've been in discussions through an SEC school in the past two years.

Now Texas is another matter.

(09-29-2015 03:31 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  It wouldn't bother me either. But I'd be willing to bet you could hear most of the people in here screaming for years after it happened.

They've been screwed far worse by the government in the last 30 years and I haven't heard a peep out of them at the polls, or elsewhere. I say they ***** and moan but roll over and take it. It is after all the track record. On the other hand I would applaud a good gutsy resistance from those left out.

(09-29-2015 08:16 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:31 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  It wouldn't bother me either. But I'd be willing to bet you could hear most of the people in here screaming for years after it happened.

They've been screwed far worse by the government in the last 30 years and I haven't heard a peep out of them at the polls, or elsewhere. I say they ***** and moan but roll over and take it. It is after all the track record. On the other hand I would applaud a good gutsy resistance from those left out.

Most folks here kind of remind me of my wife, at least in attitude. She worries about insignificant details, and blows off major things.

It drives me nuts. But after more than a quarter of a century together, I ignore it for the most part.

(09-29-2015 08:19 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 08:16 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:31 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  It wouldn't bother me either. But I'd be willing to bet you could hear most of the people in here screaming for years after it happened.

They've been screwed far worse by the government in the last 30 years and I haven't heard a peep out of them at the polls, or elsewhere. I say they ***** and moan but roll over and take it. It is after all the track record. On the other hand I would applaud a good gutsy resistance from those left out.

Most folks here kind of remind me of my wife, at least in attitude. She worries about insignificant details, and blows off major things.

It drives me nuts. But after more than a quarter of a century together, I ignore it for the most part.

Roger that Bit!

(09-29-2015 08:08 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 04:04 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:05 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Okay. Let's take this ridiculous need to force college football into the NFL's mold to its logical conclusion.

There will be 4 super conferences
THAT will be the extent of Division 1 (FBS)
The G5 schools become Division 2, along with the better FCS schools
Division 3 on down from there

And for those that don't like that situation, you'll be screwed. The 4 super conferences will be an EXCLUSIVE club, which by their very nature EXCLUDE.

So everyone will get what they asked for, even though it's not what they want. But them's the breaks.

There could be anti-trust lawsuits to take place against the P5 conferences if they do not start including some of the G5 schools or top FCS schools. This is ruining college sports the way you want it to come out with. I do not see them leaving money on the table if they leave out the top G5 schools that do make money like BYU, Boise State and East Carolina. But, how can schools like Northwestern, Duke, Wake and Vanderbilt stay in a P5 conferences with issues of fan support or the money issues? Vanderbilt is actually losing money than they are making money. They might wind up dropping football.

Oh, really? The NCAA is a voluntary organization, an exclusive club, which does not come under anti-trust legislation. It's like trying to force Augusta National to take a member they don't want. The courts can't force it, since the membership determines the rules.

The NCAA is more like Augusta National than a business. Businesses fall under anti-trust legislation. Clubs don't, and the government can't force the NCAA to do diddly on that front.

They can't force a conference to take a school that wants in. They can't force the NCAA to allow anyone that wants to be FBS in. The government can't do on that front, buddy boy. Thinking otherwise will only lead you to despair.

Not a good analogy. Court gave Augusta National a choice. Take on female members, or lose funding and pga certification, ala Butler National. Augusta National caved in, and eventually agreed to take female members.

As for the NCAA, it's members all receive federal funds through various grant-in-aid programs. So yes, all members of the NCAA are under government oversight.

An anti-trust suit would not be brought against the NCAA. It would be brought against the conspiring members of the P5, who have no protection of association. An anti-trust lawsuit is definitely not out of the question, especially with the amount of money involved.

(09-29-2015 08:19 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 08:16 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(09-29-2015 03:31 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  It wouldn't bother me either. But I'd be willing to bet you could hear most of the people in here screaming for years after it happened.

They've been screwed far worse by the government in the last 30 years and I haven't heard a peep out of them at the polls, or elsewhere. I say they ***** and moan but roll over and take it. It is after all the track record. On the other hand I would applaud a good gutsy resistance from those left out.

Most folks here kind of remind me of my wife, at least in attitude. She worries about insignificant details, and blows off major things.

It drives me nuts. But after more than a quarter of a century together, I ignore it for the most part.

Concussions are the big issue facing college (and pro) football.
That's the thing that could cause some schools to de-emphasize.