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Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
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1845 Bear Offline
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Post: #1
Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
http://bit.ly/1T0cIwK

Makes some good tv arguments for it but obviously includes issues.
08-07-2015 12:40 PM
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bluesox Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
BYU and Cincy make more sense. For byu + boise to work need to get ESPN to get the ACC/sec to take WVU…than the big 12 could add byu, boise, and col state or new mexico.
08-07-2015 12:46 PM
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stever20 Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 12:46 PM)bluesox Wrote:  BYU and Cincy make more sense. For byu + boise to work need to get ESPN to get the ACC/sec to take WVU…than the big 12 could add byu, boise, and col state or new mexico.

I don't know about that. I don't think the ACC/SEC want WVU at all. can't force it.

If WVU stays and they want to add BYU. You are going to have an outlier no matter what. Either WVU or BYU. The question then becomes who is better Boise or Cincy. That's a no brainer right now on the field, and with Boise able to host late night games, that's a winner as well.
08-07-2015 12:54 PM
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Nebraskafan Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
If they do expand, I would like to see them try and poach an Arkansas (not likely at all and it wouldn't be a wise move for Arkansas), but why not give it a try?

On the G5 level, if they do go west, no doubt BYU (football only) and Boise State (football only) and full members of UCF and Cincy out east.

You get Florida market (Orlando) with a big student body of UCF with easy airport access, Cincy with Ohio population, and decent football programs out west.
08-07-2015 12:55 PM
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Nebraskafan Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
Out of a scale of 1 to 10 for expansion happening, he gave it a 4.
08-07-2015 01:00 PM
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Otacon Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 12:54 PM)stever20 Wrote:  If WVU stays and they want to add BYU. You are going to have an outlier no matter what. Either WVU or BYU. The question then becomes who is better Boise or Cincy. That's a no brainer right now on the field, and with Boise able to host late night games, that's a winner as well.

The Big XII would have an outlier in each direction, but why does that matter anymore? Shouldn't bother anyone too much.
08-07-2015 01:54 PM
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stever20 Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:54 PM)Otacon Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 12:54 PM)stever20 Wrote:  If WVU stays and they want to add BYU. You are going to have an outlier no matter what. Either WVU or BYU. The question then becomes who is better Boise or Cincy. That's a no brainer right now on the field, and with Boise able to host late night games, that's a winner as well.

The Big XII would have an outlier in each direction, but why does that matter anymore? Shouldn't bother anyone too much.

My point is that it's not automatically going to be Cincy there just to provide WVU with a travel partner. Boise right now really far ahead of Cincy and has some other benefits as well.
08-07-2015 01:56 PM
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Otacon Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
What benefits does Boise have over Cincinnati? Slightly better football?
08-07-2015 01:57 PM
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YNot Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 12:55 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  If they do expand, I would like to see them try and poach an Arkansas (not likely at all and it wouldn't be a wise move for Arkansas), but why not give it a try?

On the G5 level, if they do go west, no doubt BYU (football only) and Boise State (football only) and full members of UCF and Cincy out east.

You get Florida market (Orlando) with a big student body of UCF with easy airport access, Cincy with Ohio population, and decent football programs out west.

If you bring both BYU and Boise St., there is little reason to do it for football only. BYU and Boise become a travel pair.

If anyone would be football only it would be UCF. They don't bring a whole lot in Olympic sports (as far as I can tell) and they would be 900 miles from the nearest member - with no travel partner.

If you bring BYU without Boise, then football only might make some sense.

But the Olympic sports travel is overstated. BYU and USD are travel partners in the WCC -711 miles between them. Gonzaga to USD is over 1,300 miles - and they play home-home every year. The Big Sky has North Dakota and Sacramento State (1,700 miles) and N. Arizona and Portland St. (1,300 miles). The WAC has Chicago St. and Seattle (2,000 miles!) and CSU-Bakersfield and UMKC (1,600 miles). Wyoming and San Diego St. (1,111 miles) and Fresno St. and Air Force (1,136 miles) play each other in the MWC.

If the WCC, MWC, WAC, and Big Sky can make it work in their Olympic sports, the Big 12 can make both BYU and UCF work.
(This post was last modified: 08-07-2015 01:59 PM by YNot.)
08-07-2015 01:58 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 12:40 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  http://bit.ly/1T0cIwK

Makes some good tv arguments for it but obviously includes issues.

West Virginia is going to get an eastern partner, Berry. (Yes, he spells it Berry.) Gee is on the committee for a reason.

So why even propose two Western schools?

Complete waste of time.
08-07-2015 02:00 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:58 PM)YNot Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 12:55 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  If they do expand, I would like to see them try and poach an Arkansas (not likely at all and it wouldn't be a wise move for Arkansas), but why not give it a try?

On the G5 level, if they do go west, no doubt BYU (football only) and Boise State (football only) and full members of UCF and Cincy out east.

You get Florida market (Orlando) with a big student body of UCF with easy airport access, Cincy with Ohio population, and decent football programs out west.

If you bring both BYU and Boise St., there is little reason to do it for football only. BYU and Boise become a travel pair.

If anyone would be football only it would be UCF. They don't bring a whole lot in Olympic sports (as far as I can tell) and they would be 900 miles from the nearest member with no travel partner.

If you bring BYU without Boise, then football only might make some sense.

But the Olympic sports travel is overstated. BYU and USD are travel partners in the WCC -711 miles between them. Gonzaga to USD is over 1,300 miles - and they play home-home every year. The Big Sky has North Dakota and Sacramento State (1,700 miles) and N. Arizona and Portland St. (1,300 miles). The WAC has Chicago St. and Seattle (2,000 miles!) and CSU-Bakersfield and UMKC (1,600 miles). Wyoming and San Diego St. (1,111 miles) and Fresno St. and Air Force (1,136 miles) play each other in the MWC.

If the WCC, MWC, WAC, and Big Sky can make it work in their Olympic sports, the Big 12 can make both BYU and UCF work.

Boise doesn't bring much besides football. UCF at least has a good baseball program.
08-07-2015 02:00 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
Baseball, bullet? 03-lmfao

Baseball will have nothing to do with it.

Geography and academics will keep Boise out.
(This post was last modified: 08-07-2015 02:02 PM by CougarRed.)
08-07-2015 02:01 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:57 PM)Otacon Wrote:  What benefits does Boise have over Cincinnati? Slightly better football?

Slightly better football?

last 10 years- Boise is 113-19. Cincy is 87-41. Over 2x the number of losses..
last 5 years- Boise is 55-11. Cincy is 44-22. Double the losses

so better football by a good size margin.

Also Boise willing to do Thursday/Friday games, which helps the TV contract.
08-07-2015 02:03 PM
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rosewater Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:56 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 01:54 PM)Otacon Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 12:54 PM)stever20 Wrote:  If WVU stays and they want to add BYU. You are going to have an outlier no matter what. Either WVU or BYU. The question then becomes who is better Boise or Cincy. That's a no brainer right now on the field, and with Boise able to host late night games, that's a winner as well.

The Big XII would have an outlier in each direction, but why does that matter anymore? Shouldn't bother anyone too much.

My point is that it's not automatically going to be Cincy there just to provide WVU with a travel partner. Boise right now really far ahead of Cincy and has some other benefits as well.

Boise has some real problems on the academic side of things. These decisions are made by University Presidents. Boise has had outstanding football success, but conferences are not about sports, exclusively. If that were the case, Northwestern would not be in the Big Ten etc. In addition, Boise lacks a media market. I think Cincy's hoops will also help separate from some of the other contenders. I am not so sure that UCF or Boise hoops have much to offer. I agree that Cincy is not a sure thing, but they do appear to have the most complete resume.
08-07-2015 02:06 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:56 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 01:54 PM)Otacon Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 12:54 PM)stever20 Wrote:  If WVU stays and they want to add BYU. You are going to have an outlier no matter what. Either WVU or BYU. The question then becomes who is better Boise or Cincy. That's a no brainer right now on the field, and with Boise able to host late night games, that's a winner as well.

The Big XII would have an outlier in each direction, but why does that matter anymore? Shouldn't bother anyone too much.

My point is that it's not automatically going to be Cincy there just to provide WVU with a travel partner. Boise right now really far ahead of Cincy and has some other benefits as well.

the geographically correct answer is ND and WVU join the ACC as 15 and 16. big12 then adds BYU, Boise State and Colorado State. but there's a better chance of Chris Christie leading a jazzercise class than WVU going to the ACC.
08-07-2015 02:07 PM
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stever20 Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 02:01 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  Baseball, bullet? 03-lmfao

Baseball will have nothing to do with it.

Geography and academics will keep Boise out.

How is Geography going to keep Boise out? Boise isn't even 400 miles away from Provo.

Gee may be on the committee, but he's still only 1 vote.
08-07-2015 02:08 PM
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Otacon Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
I do not believe that distance matters anymore.... Boise would be a project...But are they worth the risk of adding them? For me, it is hard to tell.
08-07-2015 02:14 PM
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CougarRed Offline
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
Geography will keep BYU out too. That and the other things.

If the Big 12 decides to expand, Houston is a dead cinch lock. The other school will be Cincy or UCF.

End of story.
08-07-2015 02:15 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 02:03 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 01:57 PM)Otacon Wrote:  What benefits does Boise have over Cincinnati? Slightly better football?

Slightly better football?

last 10 years- Boise is 113-19. Cincy is 87-41. Over 2x the number of losses..
last 5 years- Boise is 55-11. Cincy is 44-22. Double the losses

so better football by a good size margin.

Also Boise willing to do Thursday/Friday games, which helps the TV contract.

Better football, no doubt, but it's not like we are comparing a losing program to a winning one. Let's also keep in mind UC was playing in the Big East for a fair amount of those years, which while far from a gauntlet, was much better than the WAC that Boise was playing in.

Not to mention, once you get past football, it's really not an argument. Boise's basketball and academics aren't even in the same stratosphere as UC's. Location and TV market also favor UC. And since when does UC not play Thurs/Friday? We have been doing so for years including the upcoming one.

Obviously I'm biased, and I typically try to stay out of my cheerleader outfit, but overall, this isn't really a comparison. I think most would agree.
(This post was last modified: 08-07-2015 02:21 PM by stxrunner.)
08-07-2015 02:18 PM
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RE: Oklahoma news selling the idea of BYU+Boise to Big 12
(08-07-2015 01:57 PM)Otacon Wrote:  What benefits does Boise have over Cincinnati? Slightly better football?

Boise St. consistently beats Cincinnati in football TV ratings and selection for better time slots and channels.

BOISE ST. 2014 TV RATINGS (top-5)
v. UConn (ABC) = 1.9 rating, 2.96M viewers
v. Ole Miss (ESPN-Thursday) = 1.5 rating, 2.42M viewers
v. Fresno St. (ESPN-Friday) = 1.0 rating, 1.62M viewers
MWC Championship (CBS)= 1.0 rating, 1.53M viewers
v. BYU (ESPN-Friday)= 0.6 rating, 1.02M viewers

CINCINNATI 2014 TV RATINGS (top-5)
v. Houston (ESPN) - 0.9 rating, 1.31M viewers
v. ECU (ESPN2-Thursday) = 0.5 rating, 821K viewers
v. Tulane (ESPN2-Friday) = 0.4 rating, 648K viewers
v. USF (ESPN2-Friday) = 0.4 rating, 576K viewers
v. Toledo (ESPNU-Friday) = 0.3 rating, 394K viewers

v. Ohio St. ?? - Big Ten Network
v. Miami ?? - GamePlan
v. Memphis ?? - CBSSN
v. Miami(OH) ?? - CBSSN

So, Boise St. has five games with more than one million viewers and four with 1.0 rating or better. Cincinnati has one such game.

Ohio St. v. Cincinnati gets placed on the BTN and Miami v. Cincinnati relegated to GamePlan. Meanwhile, Boise St. v. UConn makes ABC and Boise St. v. Ole Miss is picked for the first ESPN broadcast of the season.

BOISE ST. 2013 TV RATINGS (top-5)
v. Fresno St. (ESPN-Friday) = 1.4 rating, 2.12M viewers
v. Air Force (ESPN-Friday) = 1.3 rating, 2M viewers
v. BYU (ESPN-Friday) = 1.2 rating, 1.97M viewers
v. Washington (FS1) = 0.4 rating, 710K viewers
v. Wyoming (ESPN2) = 0.4 rating, 603K viewers

CINCINNATI 2013 TV RATINGS (top-5)
v. Louisville (ESPN-Thursday) = 1.1 rating, 1.57M viewers
v. Temple (ESPN-Friday) = 0.6 rating, 872K viewers
v. Illinois (ESPN2) = 0.4 rating, 553K viewers
v. Memphis (ESPN2-Wednesday) = 0.3 rating, 437K viewers
v. Purdue (ESPNU) = 0.2 rating, 412K viewers

Boise St. lands three games with around TWO million viewers, Cincinnati has one game at 1.5 million.
(This post was last modified: 08-07-2015 02:27 PM by YNot.)
08-07-2015 02:25 PM
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