(08-05-2015 07:54 PM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  

(08-05-2015 07:34 PM)monarx Wrote:  I agree, it'd be as bad as your basketball program comparing itself to the ODU basketball program.

Marshall has a #1 overall NBA draft pick, a top ten AP poll ranking, inventor of the zone defense and fast break, Hal Greer, and a 1947 NAIB National Championship banner hanging in our basketball arena. Your turn.

We finished 3rd in CUSA and lost to MTSU in the quarterfinals. - ODU fan

Just kidding, they did almost come back on Stanford in the NIT after being down like 25-2 in the first half

(08-05-2015 07:54 PM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  

(08-05-2015 07:34 PM)monarx Wrote:  I agree, it'd be as bad as your basketball program comparing itself to the ODU basketball program.

Marshall has a #1 overall NBA draft pick, a top ten AP poll ranking, inventor of the zone defense and fast break, Hal Greer, and a 1947 NAIB National Championship banner hanging in our basketball arena. Your turn.

You can't be serious but I'll bite.

First to your points:

Hal Greer--I'll give you that one. Great player.

No. 1 pick--Yes, Marshall graduate Andy Tonkovich was drafted no. 1 in 1948 by the vaunted Providence Steamrollers and played one whole season in the NBA averaging 2.6 points a game. ODU had a first round draft pick as recently as 1999 (Cal Bowdler--17th pick). Granted his career was only slightly better than Tonkovich (3 ppg over 3 seasons). He does have this unique distinction, however. "Bowdler is the only player in the modern era of basketball to commit seven personal fouls during an NBA game. This happened because the scorekeeper didn't realize seven fouls had been committed until after the game was over." So, yea, take that.

1947 NAIA Championship--Yes, you beat Mankato State to win the NAIA Championship. Other teams to win NAIA Championships in the 30's, 40's, and 50's include Central Missouri St., Southwestern (Kan.), Tarkio (Mo.), Hamline (Minn.), Southeast Missouri St., Southwest Missouri St., St. Benedict's (Kan.), East Texas St., McNeese St., and Tennessee St. So, if you can point to that banner, I think it's fair to point to ODU's 1975 NCAA Division II National Championship Banner (ODU beat Tennessee St. (who won the 1957, 1958, and 1959 NAIA Championships btw) in the semi-finals of that tournament). ODU also finished second in 1971 and made the final four in 1976.

Now to the kicker:

Marshall has been to 5 NCAA DI tournaments in its history (and never won a game) and has not been since 1987 (almost 30 years). Heck, Marshall has even only been to 5 NIT Tournaments ever and has not won a game since 1967 (has been once since 1988).

ODU has been to 11 NCAA D-1 Tournaments, all since 1980. ODU's appeared in 7 tournaments since Marshall last made the field and four in the past 10 years. ODU has also been to 11 NIT Tournaments and reached the semi-finals twice (2006 and 2015). Since Marshall last made the NIT, ODU has gone 5 times, winning 8 games.

You're correct--there is no comparison.

What are the educational requirements to get into Marshall? Is there some admissions test that measures one's illogical sense of superiority? Anyone that compares Marshall's basketball program (which peaked in the 1940s) to ODU's is a complete moron...with all due respect. That said, Marshall's football program is definitely ahead of ODU at this point, and rightfully so. We're at least 3-4 years away from consistently beating them.

(08-06-2015 08:34 AM)T-Mac Wrote:  What are the educational requirements to get into Marshall? Is there some admissions test that measures one's illogical sense of superiority? Anyone that compares Marshall's basketball program (which peaked in the 1940s) to ODU's is a complete moron...with all due respect. That said, Marshall's football program is definitely ahead of ODU at this point, and rightfully so. We're at least 3-4 years away from consistently beating them.

Let Marshall fans have their fun now while they can. It would be funny if they go 7-5 this year and even if they do beat us, we still finish 8-4. How funny would that be?

1.) Way to completely overlook the most important point... Marshall's Cam Henderson fundamentally changed the way the game is played with inventing and popularizing the 2-3 zone defense and "breaking fast" from an opponent's missed attempt. The game of basketball looks the way it does today, in part, because of Marshall...

2.) You are the one that suggested to compare "programs". Now, I have done nothing to dispute that Marshall basketball has been of little historical note in basketball since 1988... but I would hold the opinion that a program's history which fundamentally changes the way everyone plays the game by far trumps the "three first round NCAA tourney wins" argument.

If you want to compare basketball programs since the 1990s, I'll waive the white flag. Historically, though, Marshall had a long era from the 1940s through the early 1970s where we were very relevent on a regional and national level and changed the face of sport. None of us have anything going on today that comes close.

The guy who has most changed the way the NBA game is played today is a Marshall grad.

His brother is Marshall's second year coach.

ODU, love what you bring to the league, but you have no room to talk down to other programs in anything. You fit into our league very, very nicely. I'm glad to have you guys.

By that logic Springfield College is the most successful and relevant basketball program in the history of the world! Basketball was invented there.

Also, I don't think any ODU fans are talking down to anyone. We're simply pointing out that reality exists several rungs from where quite a few Marshall fans are currently residing. We know that CUSA was a step up and we're in the thick of things with room to improve. One thing you'll soon realize about ODU is that we're always at or near the top in every conference we've ever been in. We'll, no doubt, be a conference leader in most sports in a few years. We're not quite there yet in football, but we're there in just about every other sport already.

(08-06-2015 09:36 AM)ThunderingHerdFan Wrote:  The guy who has most changed the way the NBA game is played today is a Marshall grad.

His brother is Marshall's second year coach.

ODU, love what you bring to the league, but you have no room to talk down to other programs in anything. You fit into our league very, very nicely. I'm glad to have you guys.

We are glad that we are in the same league with Marshal no doubt you guys are way ahead of us in FB but we won't let couple of turds teach us basketball basics.

is the season here yet?

Marshall basketball?

(08-06-2015 10:17 AM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  Marshall basketball?

The thoughts of the collective un-green wrapped up into two simple words.

We have a nice history in B'ball but those days were well before many on this board were born. We've sucked in basketball since 1989, with the exception of 3-4 years. Its just sad.

We definitely have a long way to go. As I detailed in another thread, we are now 4 seasons removed from a Selection Sunday screw job that set the program back big time. Add in the coach we had at the time was a good band-aid but not a good solution, and we went South in a hurry. We had the worst roster in C-USA last year outside of Southern Miss, who had extenuating circumstances from Tindall. Their top 5 were equal or better than ours but we had slightly more depth.

Last year, we exceeded expectations that were as low as they've ever been. We're currently in the worst 3 year stretch of basketball Marshall has ever had. We improved through the year but we aren't ready to compete for the upper half of the league just yet. I'm hoping we put a team on the court that is just inside the Top 10 C-USA teams.

But if we get to contending for the league again (I am hoping for a baby step this year), we will put 7-8,000 in the seats for big league games, and average 5500-6000 if we sustain it.

We were on the cusp of turning the corner, when Hassan Whiteside was here. But we never did reach that level we wanted to, and we didn't slide back down, we rolled down with a foot on the accelerator.

ODU had an awful year a few years back, but they made a nice, quick recovery. We can't do that as quickly here, but I hope our system and player development show up in a big way.

ODU is the type of program we need to develop a rivalry with. To do so, we need to reach them. I hope we can go to battle by the 2016-2017 season.

I do apologize for seeming a bit brash, but I read from a few ODU fans (and I couldn't tell you if they're even posting in this thread) about how bad the league was, etc. while it does need to get better top to bottom, no one who lost in the league tournament should be calling the league the reason they didn't get an NCAA bid. That was the background for my tone, so I apologize for that.

Now for your opinion about Marshall and its fans...there's a disconnect. I think we can be great in football again. I saw the depth and the way Doc runs the program. We have guys who may not even play until game 5 or 6, but they suddenly show up and make plays. That's because Doc develops them until they're ready to play, whether that's in the middle of the season or not. But I wouldn't proclaim it's going to be easy to win any game, or anything like that.

This is a "show me" year for the rest of the league. Marshall football must prove it was more than Cato and Shuler. I think it is but we haven't proven that yet. Birdsong hasn't taken a snap in a Marshall uniform. We'll see how he performs when it matters.

There seems to be a wide variety of opinions though. The optimistic believe we are good enough to win each game. We may be, but we haven't proven that at this point. Many fans in the rest of the league have the perception that Marshall's recent run of success is linked to a few talented players and that MU will come back down to toward the rest of the league (compared to last year) without them.

I think it's reasonable to expect 9-3/10-2 type of record at the end of the season. But that could be 8-4 easily, or it could be 11-1 or maybe 12-0. My thought is: we'll see if we are really as good as I think we are from a talent standpoint this year. I don't know with certainty much of anything.

What Marshall fans need to guard against is expecting Birdsong to be Cato. He's not. He's Michael Birdsong..he's his own guy. Let him do his own thing. I can't wait for the season to begin.

And I repeat: I am glad to have Old Dominion in our league. Your football team will only get better, and you add a lot to our league. We're all a lot alike in terms of athletic department overall level of performance. It's why we're all here. :)

about as little talent on the team last yr as I have seen since 1958 when I started watching and we still beat WKU and UTEP in Huntington. And 4 bigs, a small fwd and 4 guards added since last yr. We will be some better.

(08-03-2015 08:27 PM)banker Wrote:  The FAU game last year was odd. FAU ran 90 plays and only scored 16 points. Marshall only ran 59 plays, but scored 35 points. We averaged almost 10 yards per play, FAU averaged about 4.

It was an interesting gameplan by FAU. Basically sacrifice all chance at offensive efficiency to keep Marshall off the field offensively. FAU only had one play over 20 yards on the day. They were content to make short throws and run into the line. Of course when the field shrunk in the redzone they stalled and had to kick FGs. After Marshall made half time adjustments to the game plan, they shut FAU out in the second half and only gave up 158 yards in 7 possessions. That was also the game Devon had 272 yards and 4 TDs. We had TD drives of 1 play, 2 plays, and 3 plays, all ending in about 60 yard runs by Johnson.

FAU is a deeper team this year and the game is in Boca where Marshall needed a late deep pass to sneak away with one two year ago.

(08-05-2015 04:26 PM)bonegreen Wrote:  Bud if you saw the game last yr at your own place and think one player diff is gonna matter you might need to question your own edu. And last I Herd you are breaking in a new QB too. Surely you realize that it will be a little harder to sack him this time around. We have a little better team than JMU. Our last yr in FCS we were 15 and 0 and Nat'l champs for the second time. If you consider what we have accomplished and what your program has its ridiculous for you guys to be as cocky as you are. There is absolutely no comparison.

Hey I got a question Marshall fans. Did you not have a quality quarterback ready to replace Cato? Just curious how a transfer QB came in and took the job over the quarterbacks you already have there.

(08-07-2015 12:59 PM)pcm0103 Wrote:  

(08-05-2015 04:26 PM)bonegreen Wrote:  Bud if you saw the game last yr at your own place and think one player diff is gonna matter you might need to question your own edu. And last I Herd you are breaking in a new QB too. Surely you realize that it will be a little harder to sack him this time around. We have a little better team than JMU. Our last yr in FCS we were 15 and 0 and Nat'l champs for the second time. If you consider what we have accomplished and what your program has its ridiculous for you guys to be as cocky as you are. There is absolutely no comparison.

Hey I got a question Marshall fans. Did you not have a quality quarterback ready to replace Cato? Just curious how a transfer QB came in and took the job over the quarterbacks you already have there.

A mediocre FCS QB at that.

(08-06-2015 12:36 PM)SPACESCAPE Wrote:  

(08-06-2015 10:17 AM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  Marshall basketball?

The thoughts of the collective un-green wrapped up into two simple words.

Dude...you and that photo is distracting as hell...

PLEASE...PLEASE...KEEP IT!!!

(08-07-2015 01:04 PM)T-Mac Wrote:  

(08-07-2015 12:59 PM)pcm0103 Wrote:  

(08-05-2015 04:26 PM)bonegreen Wrote:  Bud if you saw the game last yr at your own place and think one player diff is gonna matter you might need to question your own edu. And last I Herd you are breaking in a new QB too. Surely you realize that it will be a little harder to sack him this time around. We have a little better team than JMU. Our last yr in FCS we were 15 and 0 and Nat'l champs for the second time. If you consider what we have accomplished and what your program has its ridiculous for you guys to be as cocky as you are. There is absolutely no comparison.

Hey I got a question Marshall fans. Did you not have a quality quarterback ready to replace Cato? Just curious how a transfer QB came in and took the job over the quarterbacks you already have there.

A mediocre FCS QB at that.

Considering how JMU did without him? I'm glad he's had a year to sit back and see the game played from the sidelines. I know he has more talent around him, and won't be pressed to make plays early. We'll see how it goes.

Marshall was in on two QB's who got last minute offers to Ohio State. Pretty sure at least one of them will transfer to Marshall after this season. Don't be shocked if it happens.

In the meantime, the next big time QB appears to be a true freshman named Litton. We missed on a couple of guys in-between. This was also the year we would have turned Blake Frohnapfel loose (remember him, ECU guy?).. He transferred to UMass and had a really good year last season on a bad team. We had to make new plans when he chose to leave (a decision no one blames him for). We went 10 years without hitting on a QB, then we had two in the same class (Cato and Blake Froh.)

I'm not worried about it at this point. I'm not sold, either. I'm just taking a wait and see approach with Birdsong.