(08-03-2015 02:30 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 01:24 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 12:48 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West also wins in this arrangement. an independent Hawaii in fb means they are all but locked up as a full member permanently. They would only leave the Big West for the Pac-12 or the B12

I assume from this post that the BW doesn't mind the extra costs and logistics of having all the conferences sports flying to Hawaii?

Seems like it was a California bus league, prior to adding the islands.

Hawaii is providing $2 million worth of travel subsidies annually ($250k to each member). After Utah State and Idaho left in 2005 the BW was a California bus league until Hawaii re-joined in 2012; they were previously a member in the 80s and 90s in women's sports. Anyone who joins in the future is responsible for their own travel to the Islands. I like the Bows and hope they stay for a long time.

Getting back on track, I'm surprised no one has mentioned UNLV as a Pac-12 target. Las Vegas provides an excellent market and tourist destination, and their basketball tradition is one of the strongest nationally.

The same could be said about San Diego and SDSU.

I bet the PAC already has roughly the same amount of penetration in those respective markets with their teams.

But neither school is very high in research. While the PAC isn't quite as strong as the B1G, I don't know if they'd ever consider UNLV or SDSU.

(08-03-2015 09:58 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 02:30 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 01:24 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 12:48 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West also wins in this arrangement. an independent Hawaii in fb means they are all but locked up as a full member permanently. They would only leave the Big West for the Pac-12 or the B12

I assume from this post that the BW doesn't mind the extra costs and logistics of having all the conferences sports flying to Hawaii?

Seems like it was a California bus league, prior to adding the islands.

Hawaii is providing $2 million worth of travel subsidies annually ($250k to each member). After Utah State and Idaho left in 2005 the BW was a California bus league until Hawaii re-joined in 2012; they were previously a member in the 80s and 90s in women's sports. Anyone who joins in the future is responsible for their own travel to the Islands. I like the Bows and hope they stay for a long time.

Getting back on track, I'm surprised no one has mentioned UNLV as a Pac-12 target. Las Vegas provides an excellent market and tourist destination, and their basketball tradition is one of the strongest nationally.

The same could be said about San Diego and SDSU.

I bet the PAC already has roughly the same amount of penetration in those respective markets with their teams.

But neither school is very high in research. While the PAC isn't quite as strong as the B1G, I don't know if they'd ever consider UNLV or SDSU.

UNLV would provide an extra boost in exposure and tv revenues. They're at least worth keeping an eye on.

SDSU is the only Cal State nationally ranked in the USNWR. Granted that's not the be all, end all of academic endeavors. But it's noteworthy and indicates they are improving their profile.

Now UCSD on the other hand, has the academic prestige to join the conference. Their endowment also compares well with everyone in the Pac. They just don't have any school spirit. If they ever decide to move up, then maybe the Pac would consider them - even without football.

(08-03-2015 02:30 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 01:24 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 12:48 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West also wins in this arrangement. an independent Hawaii in fb means they are all but locked up as a full member permanently. They would only leave the Big West for the Pac-12 or the B12

I assume from this post that the BW doesn't mind the extra costs and logistics of having all the conferences sports flying to Hawaii?

Seems like it was a California bus league, prior to adding the islands.

Hawaii is providing $2 million worth of travel subsidies annually ($250k to each member). After Utah State and Idaho left in 2005 the BW was a California bus league until Hawaii re-joined in 2012; they were previously a member in the 80s and 90s in women's sports. Anyone who joins in the future is responsible for their own travel to the Islands. I like the Bows and hope they stay for a long time.

Getting back on track, I'm surprised no one has mentioned UNLV as a Pac-12 target. Las Vegas provides an excellent market and tourist destination, and their basketball tradition is one of the strongest nationally.

That's not quite right.

The total travel subsidy UH pays out to the MWC and BWC combined is about $1.2 million per year. A little more than half of that goes to the MWC and the rest to the BWC.

However, the travel subsidy combined with the cost of paying guarantees to visiting non-conference teams and UH's own travel expenses to play away games on the Mainland amounts to considerably more, e.g. over $5.6 million in 2012-13. That constituted over 16% of UH's total athletic budget that year, higher than any other school in the MWC, BWC, AAC or Pac-12.

See page 6 and table 6 in this report:

https://www.hawaii.edu/offices/bor/athle...Report.pdf

(08-03-2015 10:25 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 09:58 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 02:30 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 01:24 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 12:48 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West also wins in this arrangement. an independent Hawaii in fb means they are all but locked up as a full member permanently. They would only leave the Big West for the Pac-12 or the B12

I assume from this post that the BW doesn't mind the extra costs and logistics of having all the conferences sports flying to Hawaii?

Seems like it was a California bus league, prior to adding the islands.

Hawaii is providing $2 million worth of travel subsidies annually ($250k to each member). After Utah State and Idaho left in 2005 the BW was a California bus league until Hawaii re-joined in 2012; they were previously a member in the 80s and 90s in women's sports. Anyone who joins in the future is responsible for their own travel to the Islands. I like the Bows and hope they stay for a long time.

Getting back on track, I'm surprised no one has mentioned UNLV as a Pac-12 target. Las Vegas provides an excellent market and tourist destination, and their basketball tradition is one of the strongest nationally.

The same could be said about San Diego and SDSU.

I bet the PAC already has roughly the same amount of penetration in those respective markets with their teams.

But neither school is very high in research. While the PAC isn't quite as strong as the B1G, I don't know if they'd ever consider UNLV or SDSU.

UNLV would provide an extra boost in exposure and tv revenues. They're at least worth keeping an eye on.

SDSU is the only Cal State nationally ranked in the USNWR. Granted that's not the be all, end all of academic endeavors. But it's noteworthy and indicates they are improving their profile.

Now UCSD on the other hand, has the academic prestige to join the conference. Their endowment also compares well with everyone in the Pac. They just don't have any school spirit. If they ever decide to move up, then maybe the Pac would consider them - even without football.

UCSB, UCSD, UCD and UCI would all qualify academically.

UNLV and SDSU would not, in my opinion.

(08-04-2015 02:37 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 02:30 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 01:24 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(08-03-2015 12:48 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West also wins in this arrangement. an independent Hawaii in fb means they are all but locked up as a full member permanently. They would only leave the Big West for the Pac-12 or the B12

I assume from this post that the BW doesn't mind the extra costs and logistics of having all the conferences sports flying to Hawaii?

Seems like it was a California bus league, prior to adding the islands.

Hawaii is providing $2 million worth of travel subsidies annually ($250k to each member). After Utah State and Idaho left in 2005 the BW was a California bus league until Hawaii re-joined in 2012; they were previously a member in the 80s and 90s in women's sports. Anyone who joins in the future is responsible for their own travel to the Islands. I like the Bows and hope they stay for a long time.

Getting back on track, I'm surprised no one has mentioned UNLV as a Pac-12 target. Las Vegas provides an excellent market and tourist destination, and their basketball tradition is one of the strongest nationally.

That's not quite right.

The total travel subsidy UH pays out to the MWC and BWC combined is about $1.2 million per year. A little more than half of that goes to the MWC and the rest to the BWC.

However, the travel subsidy combined with the cost of paying guarantees to visiting non-conference teams and UH's own travel expenses to play away games on the Mainland amounts to considerably more, e.g. over $5.6 million in 2012-13. That constituted over 16% of UH's total athletic budget that year, higher than any other school in the MWC, BWC, AAC or Pac-12.

See page 6 and table 6 in this report:

https://www.hawaii.edu/offices/bor/athle...Report.pdf

Hypothetical question: if Hawaii somehow got into the PAC, would they still be expected to subsidize those big programs for travel? I should hope not.

There just aren't a lot of choices for Pac-12.

Hawaii seems more trouble than they are worth from a Pac-12 viewpoint. SDSU the Pac-12 presumes it owns that market. Heck they presume they own the Las Vegas market.

With more fan support and boosted academic credentials, I could see a UNLV or New Mexico being on the future list for Pac-12 consideration but within a decade? Top Big XII teams or no expansion will be the situation.

(08-04-2015 02:31 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  There just aren't a lot of choices for Pac-12.

Hawaii seems more trouble than they are worth from a Pac-12 viewpoint. SDSU the Pac-12 presumes it owns that market. Heck they presume they own the Las Vegas market.

With more fan support and boosted academic credentials, I could see a UNLV or New Mexico being on the future list for Pac-12 consideration but within a decade? Top Big XII teams or no expansion will be the situation.

Agreed.

Hawaii has the necessary academic credentials and has been competitive enough now and again to merit consideration, but doesn't bring sufficient financial value to the table to justify the travel hassle. Perhaps developing a meaningful fan following in East Asia and Oceania would do the trick, but Hawaii hasn't figured out how to crack that marketing nut.

(08-05-2015 01:12 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  Agreed.

Hawaii has the necessary academic credentials and has been competitive enough now and again to merit consideration, but doesn't bring sufficient financial value to the table to justify the travel hassle. Perhaps developing a meaningful fan following in East Asia and Oceania would do the trick, but Hawaii hasn't figured out how to crack that marketing nut.

Not necessarily, IMHO.

Hawaii is in an unusual spot due to their location only. MW and the Pac12 is their only options(For Football) and they know that. It would be a easy add for the Pac12, assuming if Stanford/Arizona schools are on board and the NCAA still let the Conference still have the Hawaii exception.

If they can get that figured out(along with the time difference, so the East Coast won't complain), everything, including Market, makes them a easy add.

I still think that if the PAC truly wants to do what they say they want to do, and increase their exposure in the Pacific Islands...they'd take Hawaii and hold their noses and take BYU. BYU makes sense in terms of increasing exposure out in the islands because the Pacific is choked FULL of Mormon missionaries, mostly BYU students. I admit it's not likely to happen, but it'd be the best way to do what they've said they wanted to do.

Pac 12, Big 12, ACC and Big 10 made sure that the AAC and MWC from becoming part of the haves. Right now MWC have 7 strong teams, maybe 8 this year if Hawaii improves this year. Just a few years ago, MWC was having upset victories over P5 schools. Before any strong schools from the AAC and MWC join forces? The P5 will swoop in to block it. It worked with Utah, TCU, Rutgers, Louisville, West Virginia and some others. If MWC and AAC decides to form a 24 team merger? Look out for the P5 start taken apart both conference.

(08-04-2015 02:31 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  There just aren't a lot of choices for Pac-12.

Hawaii seems more trouble than they are worth from a Pac-12 viewpoint. SDSU the Pac-12 presumes it owns that market. Heck they presume they own the Las Vegas market.

With more fan support and boosted academic credentials, I could see a UNLV or New Mexico being on the future list for Pac-12 consideration but within a decade? Top Big XII teams or no expansion will be the situation.

UNLV, SDSU, Fresno, Boise, BYU, Nevada, Idaho ... they're all way too low in research.

Colorado St and Hawaii are actually pretty decent. New Mexico is not as high as those two, but still OK.


I would think if, somehow, Hawaii was selected for the PAC, then the conference would work on some type of corporate sponsorship for the air travel to the islands, for the all the conference member schools. Hawaii Air, Alaska Air, Jet Blue, etc. could all bid on a package deal for X round trips per season year and become "The Official Airline of the PAC-__ Conference to Hawaii".