Similarly, UConn might be fine for the Big 10 or ACC, but would be a mistake for the Big 12. They would be a very distant island surrounded by Big 10 and ACC schools. And like UCF, they have very little history at the top level in football.

(07-01-2015 01:27 PM)bullet Wrote:  Every state the P5 split involves the #1 school in one conference and the #2 in a different conference. Noone is picking up #4 or #5.

Pressing this over and over doesn't change people's mind, if they already disagree with your point. UCF will be just fine, regardless of your opinion of it.

(07-01-2015 01:32 PM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 01:27 PM)bullet Wrote:  Every state the P5 split involves the #1 school in one conference and the #2 in a different conference. Noone is picking up #4 or #5.

Pressing this over and over doesn't change people's mind, if they already disagree with your point. UCF will be just fine, regardless of your opinion of it.

Its a message board discussion, not a private conversation to convince 1 or 2 people. Its tough if you don't like it.

(07-01-2015 01:36 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 01:32 PM)Knightsweat Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 01:27 PM)bullet Wrote:  Every state the P5 split involves the #1 school in one conference and the #2 in a different conference. Noone is picking up #4 or #5.

Pressing this over and over doesn't change people's mind, if they already disagree with your point. UCF will be just fine, regardless of your opinion of it.

Its a message board discussion, not a private conversation to convince 1 or 2 people. Its tough if you don't like it.

That's the point i'm making to you. I don't care if you like it.

(07-01-2015 01:29 PM)bullet Wrote:  Similarly, UConn might be fine for the Big 10 or ACC, but would be a mistake for the Big 12. They would be a very distant island surrounded by Big 10 and ACC schools. And like UCF, they have very little history at the top level in football.

I agree. UConn needs regional help if it wants to avoid half full stands and in the Big 12 it would get no help in that department. They have major fan support issues in football. Thus why we added a school like WVU who has fan support on it's own.

(07-01-2015 02:38 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 01:29 PM)bullet Wrote:  Similarly, UConn might be fine for the Big 10 or ACC, but would be a mistake for the Big 12. They would be a very distant island surrounded by Big 10 and ACC schools. And like UCF, they have very little history at the top level in football.

I agree. UConn needs regional help if it wants to avoid half full stands and in the Big 12 it would get no help in that department. They have major fan support issues in football. Thus why we added a school like WVU who has fan support on it's own.

East Carolina has fan support on its own. Just saying....

(06-30-2015 07:30 AM)orangefan Wrote:  

(06-29-2015 07:55 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-29-2015 07:37 PM)Shox Wrote:  The Big 12 brass does not want any "commuter" schools in the conference which is the reason UC and UL are not in it today. It is arrogance at its finest. OU and KU will go to the B1G, while UT and Tech head west. At that point Memphis, UC, Houston USF, and UCF will get the call and we will start the death cycle once again. Within a few years the SEC will want more markets and if it can't poach the ACC, that leaves OSU, KSU, and WVU as the only worthy expansion candidates and we will basically be left with CUSA 8.0 as they all try to continue and win the lottery. It is funny but with all the changes we have had, only 3 schools have joined the P5 (Louisville, TCU, and Utah while only 2 or maybe 3 schools have actually worsened their position (UC, UCONN and perhaps BYU.) UCONN being the one with the largest grievance but also best hope to join the P5.

Based off what exactly?
Has any conference even named them as a top candidate? Don't' meet B1G academic requirements or have a blue blood FB program- Sorry that's a no go. ACC has already passed on UConn several times with no reason to believe they are interested in another basketball brand with weak football. It's a longshot at best in the Big 12. I don't see reason to think they are an automatic for the next spot. If any school should expect an invite that it's Cinci IMO as they fit the BIg 12 and ACC better.

My recollection is that UConn was next in line if Syracuse or Pitt had turned the ACC down and that they were the presumptive favorite to get Louisville's slot when Maryland went to the B1G. So they've been the bridesmaid a couple of times, it doesn't mean conferences are not interested. They are the state flagship in the largest state without a P5 school, have excellent academics, have an incredible fan base, and would give additional presence in the NYC market to any conference that added them.

My recollection is that they were the preferred to Pitt the first time around by the NC schools but BC wouldn't get on board.

(07-01-2015 11:57 AM)HHOOTter Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

Like many on these boards who have broken down what school/team would/could actually increase Big 12's revenue base, IMHO, the only REAL expansion candidates as others have mentioned are the f-ball ACC schools;G Tech, FSU, Clemson, &/or V Tech.

The $60 million buyout to leave the ACC was negotiated to under $30 million by Maryland. So, precedent has been set & don't think schools like FSU & Clemson are noticing the difference in the revenue stream between them & Little Big 12 schools like Iowa St & Kansas. It wouldn't B surprising when the next Big 12 TV contract comes up for negotiation that some of those f-ball oriented ACC schools will B all ears.

Not really in the topic of my comment but okay. Those 4 schools would undoubtedly add value to the Big 12 but it seems that FSU has already decided against the move. Maryland defense was that by ACC bylaws that the increased conference buyout wasn't in effect yet at the time of their announced departure. That time limit has longed since past & the ACC has signed a GOR. With these changes I'm not sure that Maryland could be used as a precedent.

With the conference payouts being similar between the two conferences & with the Big 12 also being without a network the gap between FSU & the SEC isn't closed enough to make the move worth it for them, as evidenced by their continued membership with the ACC.

ESPN has full tv rights to all ACC schools while they're there, why would they let any of them move to where they would have to at least share them? Taking the tv angle one step further, the Big 12 tv rights come up before the ACC's. Oklahoma & Texas will be available before anyone in the ACC.

(07-01-2015 01:25 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 01:08 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 12:29 PM)bullet Wrote:  I don't think there's anyone worth adding. But if we had to pick two, it should be BYU and Memphis. Houston would be 3rd choice.

BYU is heads above any other non-P5 school. Memphis has far more potential to become a Louisville than Cincinnati, Houston, UCF or USF. They were just the same as Louisville 25 years ago. Houston, has at least proven they can compete in the big time.

I think Boise State and UCF are there....

UCF can compete in Florida....there's room there

Boise State is there athletically, and could be Nebraska-west. They need better facilities and better academics, but the brand name is there, more so than any other non-BCS conference team

I'm not impressed with Memphis

UCF is #3 USF is #4 in Florida. The SEC and ACC dominate that state. So you would be getting someone way down the list in the state and would have trouble getting attention. It would also create yet another island for the Big 12 surrounded by other conferences. And you have the pro sports issue, less so in Orlando than Tampa, but you aren't that far from the NFL and the I-4 corridor has all 4 major sports.

UCF might turn out to be the best of the G5, but they would still be a mistake for the Big 12.

FIFY

(06-30-2015 04:10 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 04:00 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 02:40 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 02:21 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 07:30 AM)orangefan Wrote:  My recollection is that UConn was next in line if Syracuse or Pitt had turned the ACC down and that they were the presumptive favorite to get Louisville's slot when Maryland went to the B1G. So they've been the bridesmaid a couple of times, it doesn't mean conferences are not interested. They are the state flagship in the largest state without a P5 school, have excellent academics, have an incredible fan base, and would give additional presence in the NYC market to any conference that added them.

If ACC loses schools? UCF, Cincinnati, NAVY, Temple, U. Conn. and ARMY would be more attractive than any Big 12 rejects. There is way too much open country between Texas and the east coast.

LOL. The butthurt is strong with this one.

FSU and Clemson will surely bolt if the ACC adds another weak FB brand to further hurt their chances to get in the playoff. As it is they need to start the season in the top 10, go undefeated with OkState, Notre Dame,and Florida in OOC play, win the ACC CCG, and be lucky to get the #4 spot ahead of a 1 loss bible school from the Big 12 who did not go undefeated, did no win their conference, and best OOC game was Minnesota.

[/b]You do realize that essentially most ACC teams literally have no chance of getting in the playoff even if they go undefeated since most don't play a tough OOC schedule right?

Reality is a real downer for folks like you. Reality is that any of the Big 12 leftovers are more attractive than adding AAC schools.

Why do fans like yourself get all butthurt? Seriously. The whole "he said something true about my school/conference so I'm going to make up some ridiculous statement about how worthless all those schools are to get back at him" mentality is quite childish.

Do you really think FSU wants to play against Temple/Navy or TCU/Baylor?

Says the dude whose conference got left out of the playoffs in year one, while the ACC team made the playoffs.

LOL. I just love how the conversation always ends up getting switched when someones feelers get hurt. The Discussion about UConn being next and how they fit into ACC expansion ends up with butthurt, change of subject, and talking about the Big 12 getting in the playoffs.

If you want to get technical the Big 12 would have missed the playoffs in 2012 and 2013 as well. Is that what you want to talk about instead?

Lol, this is the funniest post I've seen in a long time and just utterly full of fail. First the response was to "you do realize that most ACC teams literally have no chance of getting into the playoff even if they go undefeated since most don't play a tough OOC schedule right?" Therefore there was absolutely no switching of conversation, it was a direct rebuttal of your quoted statement. Unless UConn is in the ACC (which they are not) you are the one interjecting a "switch" of conversation away from ACC teams to UConn and some imagined "butthurt." If you would take the time to notice which team I am a fan of (UCF) you would realize I'm not butthurt about anything as I don't root for FSU or any ACC team, nor am I a huge fan of UConn. I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of your quoted statement wherein you stated that teams from the ACC weren't going to make the playoffs when after the first year the only p-5 conference that didn't make the playoffs was the b-12, of which OK st. (Your team) is a member of. Oh the delicious irony! Projection, look it up. If the shoe fits as they say........

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

FSU didn't have a problem they made the playoffs.

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

Not quite, dude.

FSU's problem last year was who they played - AND how they played who they played.

(07-01-2015 03:58 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

FSU didn't have a problem they made the playoffs.

Yes they did (make the playoffs). I was responding to comments of how they barely got in despite being undefeated & how any ACC would barely get in undefeated. FSU dripping in the polls had to do with them looking bad against inferior competition.

(07-01-2015 03:51 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 04:10 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 04:00 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 02:40 PM)Okielite Wrote:  

(06-30-2015 02:21 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  If ACC loses schools? UCF, Cincinnati, NAVY, Temple, U. Conn. and ARMY would be more attractive than any Big 12 rejects. There is way too much open country between Texas and the east coast.

LOL. The butthurt is strong with this one.

FSU and Clemson will surely bolt if the ACC adds another weak FB brand to further hurt their chances to get in the playoff. As it is they need to start the season in the top 10, go undefeated with OkState, Notre Dame,and Florida in OOC play, win the ACC CCG, and be lucky to get the #4 spot ahead of a 1 loss bible school from the Big 12 who did not go undefeated, did no win their conference, and best OOC game was Minnesota.

[/b]You do realize that essentially most ACC teams literally have no chance of getting in the playoff even if they go undefeated since most don't play a tough OOC schedule right?

Reality is a real downer for folks like you. Reality is that any of the Big 12 leftovers are more attractive than adding AAC schools.

Why do fans like yourself get all butthurt? Seriously. The whole "he said something true about my school/conference so I'm going to make up some ridiculous statement about how worthless all those schools are to get back at him" mentality is quite childish.

Do you really think FSU wants to play against Temple/Navy or TCU/Baylor?

Says the dude whose conference got left out of the playoffs in year one, while the ACC team made the playoffs.

LOL. I just love how the conversation always ends up getting switched when someones feelers get hurt. The Discussion about UConn being next and how they fit into ACC expansion ends up with butthurt, change of subject, and talking about the Big 12 getting in the playoffs.

If you want to get technical the Big 12 would have missed the playoffs in 2012 and 2013 as well. Is that what you want to talk about instead?

Lol, this is the funniest post I've seen in a long time and just utterly full of fail. First the response was to "you do realize that most ACC teams literally have no chance of getting into the playoff even if they go undefeated since most don't play a tough OOC schedule right?" Therefore there was absolutely no switching of conversation, it was a direct rebuttal of your quoted statement. Unless UConn is in the ACC (which they are not) you are the one interjecting a "switch" of conversation away from ACC teams to UConn and some imagined "butthurt." If you would take the time to notice which team I am a fan of (UCF) you would realize I'm not butthurt about anything as I don't root for FSU or any ACC team, nor am I a huge fan of UConn. I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of your quoted statement wherein you stated that teams from the ACC weren't going to make the playoffs when after the first year the only p-5 conference that didn't make the playoffs was the b-12, of which OK st. (Your team) is a member of. Oh the delicious irony! Projection, look it up. If the shoe fits as they say........

So you are so butthurt about me calling UCF a commuter school and embarrassing you in the other thread you dug through my old posts to find something to claim victory on becasue of being proven wrong in the other thread. Wow. I had no idea you took it that seriously. I don't.
Originally we were talking about UConn being the next likely expansin candidate. We discussed thier fit with each conference and I suggested that the ACC would not add a weak FB brand to hurt it's already terrible SOS which is hard to overcome even with a great OOC schedule like what FSU had last year. So then we were talking about how FSU was able to make the playoff with a high preseason ranking, going undefeated, playing 3 power conference teams OOC (2 big names
), and winning the CCG. Which somehow ended up hurting someones feelers so they decided to make a comment about how Temple is more attractive to the ACC than TCU,Baylor, KSU, TT, OSU, ISU, and WVU and how an AAC team would get added to the ACC before a leftover Big 12 team would. So yes that is how the subject got changed. It's pretty obvious that nobody really thinks Temple is going to get an invite before say TCU or WVU so it's pretty clear that the comment was not based on reality, just butthurt. And then you piled on to claim victory even though you have nothing to do with the conversation and didn't' bother to read the conversation.

That's pretty much how it went down. You didn't fool anybody. But if you want to talk about which conference is likely to make the playoff we can. I have 2 questions for you.

What we know is it took a blueblood FB program who was also a defending NC and had the Heisman winner starting. This resulted in an extremely high preseason ranking. FSU went undefeated in ACC play and beat 3 power conference teams, OSU/Florida/Notre Dame, and won the ACC championship game. All of this resulted in a team who was falling in polls and was in serious jeopardy of missing out of the playoff in spite of having a perfect undefeated season.

How many schools in the ACC have the reputation, talent, and OOC schedule to replicate that feat?

Another school, TCU, was coming off its' worst season in quite some time, had little preseason hype, and started much lower in the polls. They did not go undefeated, did not win their conference (Co-champ at best) and only had 1 mediocre power conference team in OOC play, Minnesota. That team was in the top 4 at one point and found themselves just missing the playoff as #5 in it's first year.


How many Big 12 schools have the reputation, talent, and OOC schedule to replicate that 1 loss season?

IMO the answer to question #1 is likely FSU, Clemson, and UTEch. Nobody else is likely to have that kind of preseason ranking and I am not aware of any who have and OOC of 3 power conference teams with 2 blue bloods.
Question #2 is likely everyone except ISU. They have all done that is the last 10-15 years. Even TT tied with OU and UT as a 1 loss top 5 team after the 07??? regular season. Kansas won a BCS game and finished with 1 loss. OSU in 2011 was a 1 loss Big 12 team that would have been in the playoff. Baylor, KSU, and TCU have all had similar seasons to what TCU had during last years regular season. WVU has also had serious NC type seasons recently.

But not be a homer the Big 12 would have missed out on the last 3 playoffs. But there is a legitimate chance for even little brothers and bible schools to make the playoffs in the Big 12. Not so in the ACC IMO.

(07-01-2015 04:03 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

Not quite, dude.

FSU's problem last year was who they played - AND how they played who they played.

I disagree, they played a solid schedule but looked bad. If they were more dominant they would have been a 1 seed.

(07-01-2015 04:21 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 04:03 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 11:22 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  FSU problem last year wasn't who they played but how they played.

Not quite, dude.

FSU's problem last year was who they played - AND how they played who they played.

I disagree, they played a solid schedule but looked bad. If they were more dominant they would have been a 1 seed.

FSU was all but beaten 4 times last year and Clemson totally gave away their game with Clemson. FSU was not as good last year as they were the year before and it showed. It showed in games against Clemson, ND, NC State, and OSU.

The prior's years team was astoundingly good on both sides of the ball.

Over half of the ACC would make a 4 team playoff if they go undefeated - FSU, Clemson, Miami, GT, VT, UNC, Pitt, UVa, and Louisville. These 9 have an out of conference slate that would underpin winning the ACC at 9-0. Only NC State and Duke have OOC's that would not support a bid. WF, Syracuse, and BC all share the handicap that goes with having a small football stadium and a reputation of a small football traveling crowd.

The only way an ACC team gets left out if undefeated is that it has to be a school that does not have an SEC game (Clemson, FSU, GT, Louisville) and that school would have to avoid FSU or Clemson or GT in the title game and the OOC games would have to be over very medicore OOC schools. VT has Ohio State and a slate of upcoming B10 OOC games.

For this year, only NC State, Duke, WF, Syracuse, and BC could go undefeated and not make the playoff.

(06-29-2015 09:53 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  WVU will end up in the ACC when its all said and done. WVU now has more allies in the ACC then they've ever had and they threw the academics argument out the window when they added UL(WVU and UL had the same academic ranking when UL was added).

The UofL add was a bitter one for most of the ACC. And UofL was at least putting 9 figures into overhauling the academics, unlike WVU. Also Louisville is a real market .. unlike ... uhh ... does WV have a market?

The issues that will impede WVU's entrance to the ACC are fan behavior and academics. If WVU put serious work into fixing those, I think they'd be invited. My only hope is that the other part of the matching pair is Tennessee.

My ideal ACC working with the existing pieces:

ACC Atlantic South: UVA, VT, UofL, TN
ACC Atlantic North: BC, Cuse, Pitt, WV
ACC Coastal South: Clemson, GT, FSU, Miami
ACC Coastal North: UNC, Duke, NCST, WF

I'm not sold on that division arrangement entirely .... but I like the teams. Now if I could punt BC, Cuse, and UofL for Penn State, UCF, and Auburn that'd be perfection!

(07-01-2015 05:56 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(06-29-2015 09:53 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  WVU will end up in the ACC when its all said and done. WVU now has more allies in the ACC then they've ever had and they threw the academics argument out the window when they added UL(WVU and UL had the same academic ranking when UL was added).

The UofL add was a bitter one for most of the ACC. And UofL was at least putting 9 figures into overhauling the academics, unlike WVU. Also Louisville is a real market .. unlike ... uhh ... does WV have a market?

The issues that will impede WVU's entrance to the ACC are fan behavior and academics. If WVU put serious work into fixing those, I think they'd be invited. My only hope is that the other part of the matching pair is Tennessee.

Yes, WVU needs to get some of those fake classes like UNC so they fit in better. And they need to help their players like Syracuse did Melo. And maybe their players need to start acting more like Miami's. They need their own Shapiro. And they could hire Bernie Fine and maybe get Bobby Petrino so their coaches could have the same high moral standards. Right now they just don't really fit that culture.

(07-01-2015 06:03 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-01-2015 05:56 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(06-29-2015 09:53 PM)OldGoldnBlue Wrote:  WVU will end up in the ACC when its all said and done. WVU now has more allies in the ACC then they've ever had and they threw the academics argument out the window when they added UL(WVU and UL had the same academic ranking when UL was added).

The UofL add was a bitter one for most of the ACC. And UofL was at least putting 9 figures into overhauling the academics, unlike WVU. Also Louisville is a real market .. unlike ... uhh ... does WV have a market?

The issues that will impede WVU's entrance to the ACC are fan behavior and academics. If WVU put serious work into fixing those, I think they'd be invited. My only hope is that the other part of the matching pair is Tennessee.

Yes, WVU needs to get some of those fake classes like UNC so they fit in better. And they need to help their players like Syracuse did Melo. And maybe their players need to start acting more like Miami's. They need their own Shapiro. And they could hire Bernie Fine and maybe get Bobby Petrino so their coaches could have the same high moral standards. Right now they just don't really fit that culture.

Hmmmmm ..... is a fake degree from UNC-CH is still more impressive than a real one from Morgantown?

WVU is the lone true flagship in their state, just like Nebraska and LSU, so they will admit people Georgia Tech won't. But that didn't stop the Big 10 from taking Nebraska. And the ACC would take LSU in a heartbeat.

And until all the ACC starts taking the "student" part of "student-athlete" even halfway seriously they really don't need to be talking about anyone's academics.