(05-28-2015 09:56 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  And how do you influense individual choice and committed relationships and why isn't that happening in black communities?

You don't, parents either will or won't. And with damn near infinite access to information, the kids will either care, or they won't.

Quote:Which side of the political spectrum has repeatedly attempted to defund programs that would educate these people in this way?

I'll play along with your 'evil GOP' meme for a second. Why do we need to spend several bags of money to dole out information that is freely available yet obviously unwanted?

Quote:Here in Texas, education has repreatedly been cut even though we implemented the lottery 20years ago to supposedly pay for education.

Where specifically do you think the money should go?

(05-28-2015 09:56 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 09:54 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 09:45 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 09:43 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 09:39 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  O'Reilly isn't wrong when he quotes those statistics.

But he never says why? Why is the African American families disfunctional. Why are 73% of black babies born out of wedlock.

That is the crux of the issue.

this^

but on the same token, why don't prominent black figures such as Obama, Sharpton, etc take a more prominent stand on trying to fix these issues? They have the spotlight, they will get the attention.

They have. And the republicans have tried to stop them every step of the way.

The bolded is completely false. But that is because NCEagle has presented a deflective position. Prominent figures, regardless of race, can't influence individual choices and the way people analyze cost/benefits. The simplest guarantee to is the graduate from high school and not have kids before 21, preferably within a committed relationship. Why do people choose to ignore this sensible advice: because the short term gain of unprotected sex in high school outweighs the future (and thus intangible) benefits of delay.

And how do you influense individual choice and committed relationships and why isn't that happening in black communities?

Which side of the political spectrum has repeatedly attempted to defund programs that would educate these people in this way?

Here in Texas, education has repreatedly been cut even though we implemented the lottery 20years ago to supposedly pay for education.

Do you really believe that if you head into the Ghetto and ask just about any 15 or 16 year old of either sex:

How do girls get pregnant? Do you really think 15 or 16 year olds don't know the answer? Really?

If you were to ask them: Who do you think will make more money, a high school graduate or someone that only finishes 9th grade? Do you think they won't know that answer?

Vandiver is exactly right - not getting a girl pregnant (using protection), graduating from high school at minimum, entering into a committed relationship - those all require some discipline, work, and foregoing immediate pleasure to attain a future goal. This is where the failure is - not programs to inform how to not get pregnant or graduate high school.

Far too many choose the (at the moment) more pleasurable and easier path of unprotected sex and 'eff school - and those immediate choices deliver devastating consequences for a lifetime.

According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

(05-28-2015 10:47 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

I ask this, because I don't completely know the answer, but what type of programs have been created, or have been shot down which address this problem?

(05-28-2015 09:24 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:  I agree with most of what he said.

The blaming of bad behavior on entertainment (video games, music, etc.) is really getting tiresome though.

Tipper Gore redux?

(05-28-2015 10:47 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

So more money from the taxpayers is what's needed to fix this issue?

(05-28-2015 10:48 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 10:47 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

I ask this, because I don't completely know the answer, but what type of programs have been created, or have been shot down which address this problem?

For example

House Republicans looking for ways to balance the budget want to roll back President Obama's expansion of a federal program allowing many of the country's poorest students attend college.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonk...-students/


In yet another example, the Frederick County, Maryland, Board of County Commissioners voted to end the county’s contribution to its Head Start program, cutting overall funding for the program by more than 50 percent. Two of the Republican officials justified their decision to cut Head Start — which provides early childhood education to the children of low-income parents


http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/0...omen-kids/

(05-28-2015 10:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 10:48 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 10:47 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

I ask this, because I don't completely know the answer, but what type of programs have been created, or have been shot down which address this problem?

For example

House Republicans looking for ways to balance the budget want to roll back President Obama's expansion of a federal program allowing many of the country's poorest students attend college.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonk...-students/


In yet another example, the Frederick County, Maryland, Board of County Commissioners voted to end the county’s contribution to its Head Start program, cutting overall funding for the program by more than 50 percent. Two of the Republican officials justified their decision to cut Head Start — which provides early childhood education to the children of low-income parents


http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/0...omen-kids/

so I'm speculating here, as I do not know the facts. But in terms of allowing poor kids to go to college, one would assume that they have the grades, which means they have the discipline to go to college. So we aren't really solving the problem of girls getting knocked up out of wedlock. I would bet that the kids that would benefit from this doesn't probably have any kids, and will still probably be able to do something with their lives.

And in the second, having early childhood education is great, but what about when the parents aren't involved at all, and don't bother to make sure their kids get to this?
Again, provides opportunity for school education, but doesn't solve the problem of broken homes.

(05-28-2015 10:55 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  According to O'Reilly, we know what the problem is in the black community.

Disfunctional families, single mothers, and teen pregnancy.

We may disagree on how to fix the problem but there is no denying that one political party has repeatedly attempted to defund current methods of fixing this problem.

If there is another way, then let's hear it.

For example

House Republicans looking for ways to balance the budget want to roll back President Obama's expansion of a federal program allowing many of the country's poorest students attend college.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonk...-students/


In yet another example, the Frederick County, Maryland, Board of County Commissioners voted to end the county’s contribution to its Head Start program, cutting overall funding for the program by more than 50 percent. Two of the Republican officials justified their decision to cut Head Start — which provides early childhood education to the children of low-income parents


http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/0...omen-kids/

How do these programs stop kids from having sex? How do they help them graduate high school or increase their future time orientation? The answer is that they don't. With the Pell Grant example, the article mentions that the cuts are to ensure the long term viability of the current surplus. In this regard you should probably redirect your vitriol towards those who make post-secondary education so expensive: your fellow educators. The latter is a means of easing the burden of ones life choice. A choice no one forced you to make but want everyone to help with.

you can have all the activities you want before and after work, but if mom doesn't care and dad isn't around, the kid won't take advantage of it.

Pell Grants worked real well. Knew a guy from high school that got a nice guitar/amp with it.

(05-28-2015 10:25 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 09:56 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  And how do you influense individual choice and committed relationships and why isn't that happening in black communities?

You don't, parents either will or won't. And with damn near infinite access to information, the kids will either care, or they won't.

Quote:Which side of the political spectrum has repeatedly attempted to defund programs that would educate these people in this way?

I'll play along with your 'evil GOP' meme for a second. Why do we need to spend several bags of money to dole out information that is freely available yet obviously unwanted?

Quote:Here in Texas, education has repreatedly been cut even though we implemented the lottery 20years ago to supposedly pay for education.

Where specifically do you think the money should go?

This Fit!! This!! ....but if I play along and agree to increase the funding - what "rules" on those that participate should we adopt to insure they follow the program.

I mean, if I'm going to drop some cash to "educate" and "train" on how to not get pregnant and finish high school. What should we do for those that get trained but ignore the training? Do we cut them off from any further expenditures? Where is their part in the ownership?

Im not a fan of this guy..but..I don't disagree with any of that.

Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

(05-28-2015 11:28 AM)ragincajun019 Wrote:  Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

Think you may want to delve into this now trendy "issue" a bit deeper before bringing it up in this way.

(05-28-2015 11:28 AM)ragincajun019 Wrote:  Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

there are more black pot dealers than white pot dealers?

(05-28-2015 11:31 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 11:28 AM)ragincajun019 Wrote:  Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

there are more black pot dealers than white pot dealers?

Replace Pot with Heroin??

The train has already left the station folks. What we need are re-education camps. Round them up, ship them off, teach them how to be productive proper English speaking citizens with a skill. Drop them back into society. Problem solved.

(05-28-2015 11:31 AM)NCeagle Wrote:  

(05-28-2015 11:28 AM)ragincajun019 Wrote:  Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

there are more black pot dealers than white pot dealers?

Possibly, I do not know. I do not believe black people in this country use drugs at a higher rate than white people, however, and possessing/attempting to purchase drugs will get you in trouble. The likelihood of arrest/incarceration seems to increase with your melanin count.

(05-28-2015 11:28 AM)ragincajun019 Wrote:  Certainly not the end-all solution to these problems, but here's an idea that might help:

Stop locking up black men disproportionately for nonviolent drug crimes. There are more than 5 times as many white people than black people in this country. Why are white people not 5 times more likely to be arrested/incarcerated than black people for the same crime?

Winner winner chicken dinner.


You just hit the nail on the head.