(04-17-2015 08:02 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  I think Karl would be wise to just tell JMU, Missouri State, & EKU that there is one seat at the table left, and whomever jumps first gets it. Let all three parties know this.

Then sit back and wait. We aren't in a rush, they can rush themselves if they want the spot, and in the event someone else pops up, we then talk to Idaho and NMSU about how we help them find a conference that works for them geographically.

If that were the case, wouldn't EKU be the first to grab it since they are literally proclaiming they want FBS ASAP? JMU seems at best unsure of Sun Belt membership and MSU has made seemingly no overt effort to go FBS. Perhaps make a list of candidates, have Liberty of EKU at the bottom and just rank them in order of who the Sun Belt wants and go down the list and ask each school until you find someone who says yes. Once you get to Liberty or EKU they are almost a definite yes (at least in LU's case) so you don't need to go further than that unless you want more schools.

(04-17-2015 07:58 PM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 07:05 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  As for despising programs that look down upon the SBC, you must really dislike USA because they have been working really hard behind the scenes for C-USA. And don't let some of these other schools fool you as well, because their fans don't know what they are going behind the scenes. They are as clueless as Scott Farmer when it comes to the mantra of "we are all in this together."

If you've ever read any of my posts, you know I'm no fan of Scott Farmer. I've read about some of the amazingly stupid crap he's pulled. And while I've never met him, he comes across as extremely arrogant and self-agrandizing.

As for your comment about despising USA, why would I? They've been a good member of the Belt for years and if they're working to join another conference, that's their right.....just like it's the Cajun program's right to do the same if they so choose.

And frankly, speaking of conference affiliation, I'm getting weary of reading the stories that somehow all is lost if the Cajun program doesn't escape the SunBelt. Let's face it, where would we possibly go at this time other than C-USA? And while I understand all the talk of perception, etc, is that league really head & shoulders above ours? I say no. Is it worth $2MM or $3MM in exit & entrance fees to make that jump? I'm not certain it is. Might be better to spend that money on facilities improvement or COA expenses.

I understand it's what most Cajun fans want, and I don't begrudge them the right to push for it, it's just that I'm not certain it's worth the cost especially with the new rules of P5 versus G5....COA, etc sinking in. The G5 landscape might look significantly different in a very few years and I'm satisfied right now that the Cajun program is doing everything possible to position itself for the best opportunity comes along.

I'd also challenge any Cajun fan to explain to me what we might have accomplished the last two or three years that we haven't accomplished to date by being stuck in the Belt versus playing in C-USA. I'll gladly listen to all arguments.

And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

(04-17-2015 10:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

(04-17-2015 10:18 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

If playing in a conference comprised of long-time founding members is the be-all end-all, then we're basically talking about joining one of the P5's or the MAC. After the latest round of realignment, they're about the only ones who remained relatively stable.

The AAC is certainly a solid conference and anyone of us from the G5's would jump at an opportunity to join that conference, but the longterm quality of their football remains to be proven.

And while there are a few decent programs in the Southland, I'd imagine a quick review of athletic budgets, facilities, attendance, etc would demonstrate a significant difference between what the SLC offers an athlete and what the average team in the Belt offers. I honestly believe the Belt is on the verge of fielding some outstanding programs, especially in football and believe the results will be consistent and noticeable.

Most Cajun fans obviously want our program to compete at a higher level. I do as well. But we missed out on the last opportunity to move to a better conference because we just weren't ready. I recently came across a quote from Hud who said that he almost didn't accept our job because our facilities were stuck in the 70's. It was a shock to him. But look at where we are today as compared to just a few years ago......we're light years ahead and everyone knows it. Tulane knows it. LaTech knows it. And most of our fellow SunBelt members know it as well. The program is on the move allthewhile being a member of the lowly Belt. Conference affiliation defines a team only if the program lets it.

Cajun fans have a right to withhold their support and dollars from the program if they wish because of a preceived failure on the part of the athletic department or administration. I just don't see it. I see us doing more in the last 4 or 5 years than we've done since the opening game at Cajun Field which I attended in September of 1971.

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

(04-18-2015 07:56 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:18 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

If playing in a conference comprised of long-time founding members is the be-all end-all, then we're basically talking about joining one of the P5's or the MAC. After the latest round of realignment, they're about the only ones who remained relatively stable.

The AAC is certainly a solid conference and anyone of us from the G5's would jump at an opportunity to join that conference, but the longterm quality of their football remains to be proven.

And while there are a few decent programs in the Southland, I'd imagine a quick review of athletic budgets, facilities, attendance, etc would demonstrate a significant difference between what the SLC offers an athlete and what the average team in the Belt offers. I honestly believe the Belt is on the verge of fielding some outstanding programs, especially in football and believe the results will be consistent and noticeable.

Most Cajun fans obviously want our program to compete at a higher level. I do as well. But we missed out on the last opportunity to move to a better conference because we just weren't ready. I recently came across a quote from Hud who said that he almost didn't accept our job because our facilities were stuck in the 70's. It was a shock to him. But look at where we are today as compared to just a few years ago......we're light years ahead and everyone knows it. Tulane knows it. LaTech knows it. And most of our fellow SunBelt members know it as well. The program is on the move allthewhile being a member of the lowly Belt. Conference affiliation defines a team only if the program lets it.

Cajun fans have a right to withhold their support and dollars from the program if they wish because of a preceived failure on the part of the athletic department or administration. I just don't see it. I see us doing more in the last 4 or 5 years than we've done since the opening game at Cajun Field which I attended in September of 1971.

I honestly don't know how SBC members stomach having ULL in the conference. The delusions of grandeur are non-stop.

(04-18-2015 08:46 AM)BRtransplant Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:56 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:18 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

If playing in a conference comprised of long-time founding members is the be-all end-all, then we're basically talking about joining one of the P5's or the MAC. After the latest round of realignment, they're about the only ones who remained relatively stable.

The AAC is certainly a solid conference and anyone of us from the G5's would jump at an opportunity to join that conference, but the longterm quality of their football remains to be proven.

And while there are a few decent programs in the Southland, I'd imagine a quick review of athletic budgets, facilities, attendance, etc would demonstrate a significant difference between what the SLC offers an athlete and what the average team in the Belt offers. I honestly believe the Belt is on the verge of fielding some outstanding programs, especially in football and believe the results will be consistent and noticeable.

Most Cajun fans obviously want our program to compete at a higher level. I do as well. But we missed out on the last opportunity to move to a better conference because we just weren't ready. I recently came across a quote from Hud who said that he almost didn't accept our job because our facilities were stuck in the 70's. It was a shock to him. But look at where we are today as compared to just a few years ago......we're light years ahead and everyone knows it. Tulane knows it. LaTech knows it. And most of our fellow SunBelt members know it as well. The program is on the move allthewhile being a member of the lowly Belt. Conference affiliation defines a team only if the program lets it.

Cajun fans have a right to withhold their support and dollars from the program if they wish because of a preceived failure on the part of the athletic department or administration. I just don't see it. I see us doing more in the last 4 or 5 years than we've done since the opening game at Cajun Field which I attended in September of 1971.

I honestly don't know how SBC members stomach having ULL in the conference. The delusions of grandeur are non-stop.

Your obsession with UL is duly noted.

(04-18-2015 08:03 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

People perceive that the "perception" means a lot. But it really doesn't mean as much as they think because a Bottom 10 team is still a Bottom 10 team no matter where you go. I'd still rather be Boise than Indiana and I'd still rather be ULL than FIU.

When Arkansas was one of the worst teams in the country and a running joke, and ranked lower than A-State, and were beaten by a ULM team that was beaten by A-State, many of their fans told me they were still superior to A-State that year just because of who they lost to.

I was told that winning zero SEC games is better than winning conference championships and bowl games in any G5. Yes, losing is better than winning depending on who you are with.

That's not sports. That is Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". Where perception of who you are with is more important than what you do.

When are you all just going to admit that the only people that actually WANT the Sunbelt to be their final home are those that feel they have no chance of getting into another conference? I don't get how you can be mad at them when they feel like the Sunbelt isn't a fit for them.

(04-18-2015 09:47 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 08:03 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

People perceive that the "perception" means a lot. But it really doesn't mean as much as they think because a Bottom 10 team is still a Bottom 10 team no matter where you go. I'd still rather be Boise than Indiana and I'd still rather be ULL than FIU.

When Arkansas was one of the worst teams in the country and a running joke, and ranked lower than A-State, and were beaten by a ULM team that was beaten by A-State, many of their fans told me they were still superior to A-State that year just because of who they lost to.

I was told that winning zero SEC games is better than winning conference championships and bowl games in any G5. Yes, losing is better than winning depending on who you are with.

That's not sports. That is Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". Where perception of who you are with is more important than what you do.

I take nothing away from the accomplishments of teams in this conference, particularly those who've been in the Belt for a considerable time . . . But perception does matter . . . When other conferences can reload with FBS schools when they have a need, while the Belt has to rebuild with FCS call ups, then those other conferences have a distinct advantage over the Belt . . . . Call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd," call it perception, call it reality . . . It is the uphill battle this conference struggles with . . . .

(04-18-2015 08:46 AM)BRtransplant Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:56 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:18 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

If playing in a conference comprised of long-time founding members is the be-all end-all, then we're basically talking about joining one of the P5's or the MAC. After the latest round of realignment, they're about the only ones who remained relatively stable.

The AAC is certainly a solid conference and anyone of us from the G5's would jump at an opportunity to join that conference, but the longterm quality of their football remains to be proven.

And while there are a few decent programs in the Southland, I'd imagine a quick review of athletic budgets, facilities, attendance, etc would demonstrate a significant difference between what the SLC offers an athlete and what the average team in the Belt offers. I honestly believe the Belt is on the verge of fielding some outstanding programs, especially in football and believe the results will be consistent and noticeable.

Most Cajun fans obviously want our program to compete at a higher level. I do as well. But we missed out on the last opportunity to move to a better conference because we just weren't ready. I recently came across a quote from Hud who said that he almost didn't accept our job because our facilities were stuck in the 70's. It was a shock to him. But look at where we are today as compared to just a few years ago......we're light years ahead and everyone knows it. Tulane knows it. LaTech knows it. And most of our fellow SunBelt members know it as well. The program is on the move allthewhile being a member of the lowly Belt. Conference affiliation defines a team only if the program lets it.

Cajun fans have a right to withhold their support and dollars from the program if they wish because of a preceived failure on the part of the athletic department or administration. I just don't see it. I see us doing more in the last 4 or 5 years than we've done since the opening game at Cajun Field which I attended in September of 1971.

I honestly don't know how SBC members stomach having ULL in the conference. The delusions of grandeur are non-stop.

Let's see. The guy who comes here constantly thumping his chest about how great it is that LaTech is in the mighty C-USA while the Cajuns were passed over is now lecturing us about delusions of grandeur.



You can't make this stuff up.

(04-18-2015 08:46 AM)BRtransplant Wrote:  I honestly don't know how SBC members stomach having ULL in the conference. The delusions of grandeur are non-stop.

We GS fans keep their minds off of the UL fans.

(04-18-2015 10:00 AM)AlwaysSunny Wrote:  When are you all just going to admit that the only people that actually WANT the Sunbelt to be their final home are those that feel they have no chance of getting into another conference? I don't get how you can be mad at them when they feel like the Sunbelt isn't a fit for them.

South Alabama is considered the front-runner to replace UAB and I don't see their fans jumping for joy.

If GS were a basketball school I would prefer the CUSA but football-wise I'm good. Just need to get Troy back to their normal selves, get Georgia State playing at least decent ball, and get rid of at least one of the dead weight Idaho and NMSU.

As for JMU, I think there's a chance they'll come around. There was a time when App State (at least according to their fans) were pretty much CUSA or bust when it cames to FBS and obviously that fell through.

(04-18-2015 10:14 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 09:47 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 08:03 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:52 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  I'm not sure who's "perception" we always talk about.

Is it the CFP committee? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it the sports media? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it P5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it other G5 fans? SBC and CUSA are interchangeably meaningless to them.
Is it non-fan types? SBC, SEC, CUSA, and Pac-12 are interchangeably meaningless to them.

Is it us? Do we perceive MTSU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't. Do we perceive FIU any different than it was in the SBC? I don't.

If MTSU loses to McNeese, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If FIU ends up in the Bottom 10, or we do, we will interchangeably be a laughing-stock. If USM loses 20 in a row, or we do, we will interchangeably be keeping our heads low. If ODU grabs the G5 access bowl slot and beats Oklahoma in it, or we do, we will interchangeably be G5 heroes.

The value of the "perception" of CUSA is over-rated.

JMU's "perception" will not come from joining CUSA, it will come from from WHAT IT DOES IN FBS. If JMU entered CUSA and lost 30 games in a row it would not be perceived as better than an SBC champion Georgia Southern just because it was in the mighty CUSA.

The fact that their administration apparently thinks that the "perception" difference between SBC, MAC, and CUSA is worth turning down an FBS invitation over makes me think they are just jerking their own fans around or are too dense to want to be associated with.

I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

People perceive that the "perception" means a lot. But it really doesn't mean as much as they think because a Bottom 10 team is still a Bottom 10 team no matter where you go. I'd still rather be Boise than Indiana and I'd still rather be ULL than FIU.

When Arkansas was one of the worst teams in the country and a running joke, and ranked lower than A-State, and were beaten by a ULM team that was beaten by A-State, many of their fans told me they were still superior to A-State that year just because of who they lost to.

I was told that winning zero SEC games is better than winning conference championships and bowl games in any G5. Yes, losing is better than winning depending on who you are with.

That's not sports. That is Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". Where perception of who you are with is more important than what you do.

I take nothing away from the accomplishments of teams in this conference, particularly those who've been in the Belt for a considerable time . . . But perception does matter . . . When other conferences can reload with FBS schools when they have a need, while the Belt has to rebuild with FCS call ups, then those other conferences have a distinct advantage over the Belt . . . . Call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd," call it perception, call it reality . . . It is the uphill battle this conference struggles with . . . .

Yeah, I call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". And there are a lot of them masquerading as sports fans.

And a good part of the SBC's uphill struggle is that our own conference members constantly reinforce the "perception" and validate it by being obsessed with the "perception".

An example you provided is one. CUSA gets to "reload" with mightly Cadillac FBS programs like FIU and FBS programs with vast FBS history of success like WKU. while we have to "settle" for FCS moveup scraps like Georgia Southern and App State.

Totally ignoring Charlotte and ODU for instance, and that App State and Georgia Southern totally lapped them in FCS (at least the one that actually existed). Totally ignoring that WKU is itself a recent FCS moveup and Bottom 10 dweller.

We filter our view of our own conference through the "hierarchy" lens just like we are supposed to. CUSA flaws don't matter. SBC positives don't matter. History of programs don't matter. The "perception" matters.

No thanks man. You can't solve this conference's "pecking order" problem by propping up the "pecking order" ever chance you get.

When I was a kid we all laughed at a product marked Made in Japan.

Perceptions change, sometimes rapidly.

We'll get a good look at what the market thinks of our products....Belt, C-USA, etc when the next round of TV contracts is completed.

(04-18-2015 10:45 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 10:14 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 09:47 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 08:03 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

People perceive that the "perception" means a lot. But it really doesn't mean as much as they think because a Bottom 10 team is still a Bottom 10 team no matter where you go. I'd still rather be Boise than Indiana and I'd still rather be ULL than FIU.

When Arkansas was one of the worst teams in the country and a running joke, and ranked lower than A-State, and were beaten by a ULM team that was beaten by A-State, many of their fans told me they were still superior to A-State that year just because of who they lost to.

I was told that winning zero SEC games is better than winning conference championships and bowl games in any G5. Yes, losing is better than winning depending on who you are with.

That's not sports. That is Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". Where perception of who you are with is more important than what you do.

I take nothing away from the accomplishments of teams in this conference, particularly those who've been in the Belt for a considerable time . . . But perception does matter . . . When other conferences can reload with FBS schools when they have a need, while the Belt has to rebuild with FCS call ups, then those other conferences have a distinct advantage over the Belt . . . . Call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd," call it perception, call it reality . . . It is the uphill battle this conference struggles with . . . .

Yeah, I call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". And there are a lot of them masquerading as sports fans.

And a good part of the SBC's uphill struggle is that our own conference members constantly reinforce the "perception" and validate it by being obsessed with the "perception".

An example you provided is one. CUSA gets to "reload" with mightly Cadillac FBS programs like FIU and FBS programs with vast FBS history of success like WKU. while we have to "settle" for FCS moveup scraps like Georgia Southern and App State.

Totally ignoring Charlotte and ODU for instance, and that App State and Georgia Southern totally lapped them in FCS (at least the one that actually existed). Totally ignoring that WKU is itself a recent FCS moveup and Bottom 10 dweller.

We filter our view of our own conference through the "hierarchy" lens just like we are supposed to. CUSA flaws don't matter. SBC positives don't matter. History of programs don't matter. The "perception" matters.

No thanks man. You can't solve this conference's "pecking order" problem by propping up the "pecking order" ever chance you get.

Regardless of who they took, they obviously could have taken anyone they wanted. I've always wanted to know, how were the UL and state programs at the time the decision (not the actual move) but the decision to select the Florida schools and unt? I believe those schools had recent success in the belt at the time they were selected. sure markets had a lot to do with it but I bet at the time they were selected UL had only 1 winning season, bowl game with an average baseball and basketball program. Am I crazy to think those selections of the Florida schools and unt were not that terrible at the time? Then they went with better all around programs like WKU and middle Tennessee with louisiana tech in there as well. And I believe odu has tons of potential. I think cusa did ok in hindsight.

(04-18-2015 10:28 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 08:46 AM)BRtransplant Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:56 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  

(04-17-2015 10:18 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  And I will gladly listen to your arguments as to playing in a SBC with only two other founding football members in ULM and Ark State versus playing in the SLC after the years you have been away? Don't see much difference.

If playing in a conference comprised of long-time founding members is the be-all end-all, then we're basically talking about joining one of the P5's or the MAC. After the latest round of realignment, they're about the only ones who remained relatively stable.

The AAC is certainly a solid conference and anyone of us from the G5's would jump at an opportunity to join that conference, but the longterm quality of their football remains to be proven.

And while there are a few decent programs in the Southland, I'd imagine a quick review of athletic budgets, facilities, attendance, etc would demonstrate a significant difference between what the SLC offers an athlete and what the average team in the Belt offers. I honestly believe the Belt is on the verge of fielding some outstanding programs, especially in football and believe the results will be consistent and noticeable.

Most Cajun fans obviously want our program to compete at a higher level. I do as well. But we missed out on the last opportunity to move to a better conference because we just weren't ready. I recently came across a quote from Hud who said that he almost didn't accept our job because our facilities were stuck in the 70's. It was a shock to him. But look at where we are today as compared to just a few years ago......we're light years ahead and everyone knows it. Tulane knows it. LaTech knows it. And most of our fellow SunBelt members know it as well. The program is on the move allthewhile being a member of the lowly Belt. Conference affiliation defines a team only if the program lets it.

Cajun fans have a right to withhold their support and dollars from the program if they wish because of a preceived failure on the part of the athletic department or administration. I just don't see it. I see us doing more in the last 4 or 5 years than we've done since the opening game at Cajun Field which I attended in September of 1971.

I honestly don't know how SBC members stomach having ULL in the conference. The delusions of grandeur are non-stop.

Let's see. The guy who comes here constantly thumping his chest about how great it is that LaTech is in the mighty C-USA while the Cajuns were passed over is now lecturing us about delusions of grandeur.



You can't make this stuff up.

No I don't. I only respond to the constant misinformation you spew about Tech and/or Ruston. I stopped saying anything negative about the SBC a long time ago because unlike you, I realize that we all have a whole lot more in common than not. In fact, I've said numerous times that I think the Sun Belt did quite well with adding GA Southern and App St. You're the one that appears to have no respect for the SBC. If every ULL fan thinks like you do, then it is no wonder that you guys were left out of discussions when realignment took place.

(04-18-2015 10:45 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 10:14 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 09:47 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 08:03 AM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  

(04-18-2015 07:46 AM)JTApps1 Wrote:  I'd say you are pretty much dead on when it comes to perception except for maybe among G5 fans. With so many teams changing conferences the last few years most fans can barely keep track of what team is in what conference. Most people just know that all of our leagues fall between the P5 and FCS. The MWC and AAC may have a slight edge to some, but to the decision makers we're all equal. So all of this worrying about preception is pointless (especially by JMU) when comparing CUSA, MAC, and Sun Belt .

It may very well be pointless, but the perception IS there nevertheless. And schools act on it accordingly.
It's why CUSA is able to pick off teams from the Belt whenever they wish . . . And it's why the Belt can only reload from the ranks of the FCS . . . .
You may not like it, but the hierarchy exists . . . .
Is there really much difference between the schools in CUSA and the Belt, probably not, BUT perception . . . . . Makes all the difference in the world . . .

People perceive that the "perception" means a lot. But it really doesn't mean as much as they think because a Bottom 10 team is still a Bottom 10 team no matter where you go. I'd still rather be Boise than Indiana and I'd still rather be ULL than FIU.

When Arkansas was one of the worst teams in the country and a running joke, and ranked lower than A-State, and were beaten by a ULM team that was beaten by A-State, many of their fans told me they were still superior to A-State that year just because of who they lost to.

I was told that winning zero SEC games is better than winning conference championships and bowl games in any G5. Yes, losing is better than winning depending on who you are with.

That's not sports. That is Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". Where perception of who you are with is more important than what you do.

I take nothing away from the accomplishments of teams in this conference, particularly those who've been in the Belt for a considerable time . . . But perception does matter . . . When other conferences can reload with FBS schools when they have a need, while the Belt has to rebuild with FCS call ups, then those other conferences have a distinct advantage over the Belt . . . . Call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd," call it perception, call it reality . . . It is the uphill battle this conference struggles with . . . .

Yeah, I call it Middle School girls worrying about being in the "in crowd". And there are a lot of them masquerading as sports fans.

And a good part of the SBC's uphill struggle is that our own conference members constantly reinforce the "perception" and validate it by being obsessed with the "perception".

An example you provided is one. CUSA gets to "reload" with mightly Cadillac FBS programs like FIU and FBS programs with vast FBS history of success like WKU. while we have to "settle" for FCS moveup scraps like Georgia Southern and App State.

Totally ignoring Charlotte and ODU for instance, and that App State and Georgia Southern totally lapped them in FCS (at least the one that actually existed). Totally ignoring that WKU is itself a recent FCS moveup and Bottom 10 dweller.

We filter our view of our own conference through the "hierarchy" lens just like we are supposed to. CUSA flaws don't matter. SBC positives don't matter. History of programs don't matter. The "perception" matters.

No thanks man. You can't solve this conference's "pecking order" problem by propping up the "pecking order" ever chance you get.

I'm not trying to "prop up" anything . . . . I simply recognize that a hierarchy exists.

I guess when the Belt can "pluck" teams from CUSA at will, then the hierarchy/perception will have changed . . . .

I'm not saying the hierarchy/perception is Right . . I'm just saying it's There, and it has a bearing on the way conferences are viewed, and the way they develop as it pertains to membership.

There are also forces at work that we have no control over . . . Like location and TV market size. . .. . Things that shouldn't trump performance, but in reality do

And I think SBC positives DO matter, after all, when enough Belt schools perform well enough . . long enough, what happens? . . . They take that CUSA invite and leave the rest of us to rebuild . . . . Of course for some, it won't matter how well you perform, because other factors, like location, can't be overcome. . . .

(04-18-2015 10:51 AM)CajunFanatico Wrote:  When I was a kid we all laughed at a product marked Made in Japan.

Perceptions change, sometimes rapidly.

We'll get a good look at what the market thinks of our products....Belt, C-USA, etc when the next round of TV contracts is completed.

Well TV is coming around soon and CUSA will finish ahead of the SBC in football, basketball, and baseball this year. Tell me what the tv execs will think of our products...

(04-18-2015 11:19 AM)BRtransplant Wrote:  No I don't. I only respond to the constant misinformation you spew about Tech and/or Ruston. I stopped saying anything negative about the SBC a long time ago because unlike you, I realize that we all have a whole lot more in common than not. In fact, I've said numerous times that I think the Sun Belt did quite well with adding GA Southern and App St. You're the one that appears to have no respect for the SBC. If every ULL fan thinks like you do, then it is no wonder that you guys were left out of discussions when realignment took place.

Apparently you can read, but you're unable to comprehend.

I'm about the ONLY Cajun fan who defends the Sunbelt and the overall quality of our football. I'm also about the only one who believes our two conferences are practically mirror-images of one another.

And what have I said about LaTech or Ruston that is not accurate? Are you still mad that I link that pic of your water tower posted on your town's wiki page?