(04-14-2015 07:25 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(04-14-2015 07:03 PM)tigers0830 Wrote:  

(04-14-2015 06:07 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(04-14-2015 05:13 PM)tigers0830 Wrote:  

(04-14-2015 04:44 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  Marc needs to be shut up and play. The only players that have been playing consistently hard since the ASB have been ZBo, TA and Green. All I hear from Marc is talk, and not much aggression on the court on a consistent basis.

Dude Marc has been aggressive as hell the last two weeks. Marc has really stepped it up in that department. Need you be reminded if it wasn't for Marc, Utah was about to put that game away on Friday.

If you really paid attention to the games you would see what Marc said is 100% true. We aren't communicating on the floor, we aren't playing as a team, and change haven't really been made to fix it.

Again look at last night, as much as I hate to use that game, Marc had Draymond Green on him. Draymond Green had has a great year, but come on now he can't guard Marc straight up. So what should we have done every time down the court? We should've posted Marc up and let him create a double team for an open look. Did we do that, no we didn't. Instead Beno and Lee settled for jumpers.

That isn't our game. We tried to beat GS at their hands with Beno and Lee. Give me a break.

Yet you want to come on here and say Marc needs to shut up.

You want to know why Marc hasn't been nearly as aggressive its real simple. 1) his shots aren't falling like they were the first half of the season and 2) when he is on the court with Green he is deferring to Green because he knows Green can go get his own shot. Zach sure the exact same thing.

That's why I was calling for the change in the lineup because it was killing our big men to have Green play with them.

Marc is dead on in his comments. Just like Zach was dead on in his after the Detroit loss.

I do watch the games. He has had a few good games since the ASB. I still stand by my comments that the 3 guys I mentioned have been more consistently aggressive although they are not as talented as Marc. Marc's comments are correct about the Warriors game but he has been speaking a lot of what we have been doing wrong after every loss. He is one of the reasons why we have been lackadaisical. Instead of analyzing every aspect, go out there and be the All Star that he is and the team's best player. One good game recently does not excuse his lack of effort in so many other games since the ASB. No more talk from Marc...shut up and bring forth a consistent effort.

Wouldn't you be surprised to know that Zach has had more games than Marc where he shot less than 10 shots.

Like I said if Marc was making his shots at a more efficient rate then none if this would be said. Marc is attaching and shooting as much as he was the difference is his shots aren't falling. Zach on the other hand is making his shots that is the difference.

For example, the third game after the break against Sacramento. Zach was 7/10 for 20 points and nobody said a word about Zach needing to be more aggressive. Marc with the same amount of attempts but was only 4/10 and finished with 14. That has nothing to do so with aggressiveness, but more to do with efficiency. I guarantee you that if Marc went 7/10 with 20 points in that have nobody would've said a word

Zach has given more ole efforts since the all start break than Marc. The difference being when Zach is aggressive his shots are falling Marc's aren't.

Seriously watch the spurs Marc took in the first half of the year and see how often they went in compared to the same shots he's taking now and not making them.

It's all about efficiency. The effort has been there for more than just a few games. See I don't look at his points to tell me if he is being aggressive. I at his shot attempts. Anything over 10 he is giving the effort.

Some may want to look at aggressiveness by getting to the free throw line, but that is not really an accurate look because Marc and Zach get fouled more than any big men in the league and rarely get the call.

Marc is get the shoot attempts, but for whatever reason they aren't falling like they did the first half of the year. Could that be a sign of him getting tired I don't know.

To tell him to just shut up and play ball is just dumb. He is telling the truth whether you like it or not.

Man...I know you are a great fan. But please don't assume that the rest of us don't watch games and are naive about what has been happening. IMO, Marc needs to shut up and ball. Where you see him taking an equal number of shots, all I see are mostly jump shots since the ASB. I've watched every single Grizz game this season and IMO his effort level is not even close to what it was earlier in the season. Zac has had bad games too but I don't question his effort. Marc is the most talented player on the team but he has been playing "soft" IMO. And he has been complaining for more than a month. IMO, he just needs to shut up and ball. There's nothing dumb about it. You just disagree with my opinion.

My hope is the guys can somehow turn on the switch, and Marc and Conley can lead this team the way they were in the early part of the season.

We'll just agree to disagree.

Marc has gone from 18 & 8 before the All-Star break to 15 & 7 after.

There's no doubt he's not the same guy for whatever reason - at least that's what I've noticed.

That could change in the playoffs... we need it to or we'll get bounced early.

FWIW - I'd have a hard time giving max money ($18M+ per) to a 30 year old center who averages between 17 & 7 and 18 & 8 per night. Especially if we don't advance past the 1st round with said 30 year old. I love Marc, but dang ...

(04-15-2015 02:10 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  Marc has gone from 18 & 8 before the All-Star break to 15 & 7 after.

There's no doubt he's not the same guy for whatever reason - at least that's what I've noticed.

That could change in the playoffs... we need it to or we'll get bounced early.

FWIW - I'd have a hard time giving max money ($18M+ per) to a 30 year old center who averages between 17 & 7 and 18 & 8 per night. Especially if we don't advance past the 1st round with said 30 year old. I love Marc, but dang ...

What's his shooting percentage before and after?

You offer him max because of what else he brings. Passing ability and defense ability

(04-15-2015 04:00 PM)tigers0830 Wrote:  

(04-15-2015 02:10 PM)HometownTiger Wrote:  Marc has gone from 18 & 8 before the All-Star break to 15 & 7 after.

There's no doubt he's not the same guy for whatever reason - at least that's what I've noticed.

That could change in the playoffs... we need it to or we'll get bounced early.

FWIW - I'd have a hard time giving max money ($18M+ per) to a 30 year old center who averages between 17 & 7 and 18 & 8 per night. Especially if we don't advance past the 1st round with said 30 year old. I love Marc, but dang ...

What's his shooting percentage before and after?

You offer him max because of what else he brings. Passing ability and defense ability

About the same.

What we saw last night is what Marc can be & needs to be .... maybe not 30 every night, but he could have 20+ and still make plays with his passing, etc.

He has to be more assertive IMO.

As far as giving him the max, it's happening so no sense in debating if it will happen. I think he's PROBABLY worth it, but there are some concerns IMO.

(04-14-2015 07:13 PM)tigers0830 Wrote:  

(04-14-2015 06:16 PM)tmoneyinmphs Wrote:  I agree with tiger 1016. Marc has not been very aggressive since all star break. Imo, it's one of our main issues on this team. Yes, he has picked a few games or halves where he will show up, but overall, he isn't producing like he was earlier in the year. Last night like so many other nights recently, you have an all star's production being the same or less than whoever is his individual matchup. The way gasol is playing right now, we aren't going anywhere.

Funny part is this is why his brother got grilled here. Whenever pau would put up 15 and 6 in big games, he got grilled for not showing up or not being tough enough, yet hardly anyone is questioning gasol's toughness in the media (at least not as far as i've heard).

I'll add i won't ever give marc gasol another all star vote until he plays like he has a set. I'm tired of seeing him being outrebounded by guards all year long. There is no reason he can't get more double digit rebounding games. I'm tired of him passing up what should be his shot. Produce like an all star or shut the hell up about what should be happening. I have no doubt he can produce more.

Tell me how many times did Marc touch the ball last night in the post with Green guarding him. You can count it on one hand. If in Beno, Lee, or Green and I saw that, Marc is getting that back every time down the cost until GS makes a switch.

You say Marc has disappeared in big games OK. Have against the wizards a few weeks ago Marc had 18 the only guy that came to play. That not good enough. Against the Cavs only guy who came to play. Still not good enough okc, new orleans, Houston, Utah just to name some more big games over the last month where Marc was huge. Some of those games he was the only guy.


The effort is there from Marc, the efficiency on the other hand isn't. If he was making skis like he did in the first half of the year nobody would be saying jack. Heck Mike isn't even making the same amount of shots he did and has had far more less impressive games than Marc since the break.

Couple of those games you listed were not necessarily "big" games by all star marc gasol. One example would be the okc game where kanter had 24 and 17.

I wasn't really complaining about the golden state effort, because gasol was coming off an ankle injury, but it was kind of obvious he wasn't really trying which was a little aggravating.

I'm not the only one saying marc has not been aggressive enough since all star break. Lots of people see it. You can see it in his dwindling stat line month to month. I watched the replay on tv after the game and one of the announcers was saying gasol had been too passive lately while he was also praising the effort last night.

I will praise last night's effort too, because that is the all star marc gasol that the grizzlies need in the playoffs. He put up big numbers and dominated his matchup. Yeah, he might not get 30 every night, but 20 is reachable and double digit rebounds is what big players do in big games.

Let me add when gasol airballed that shot late in the 1st quarter/early 2nd quarter, i was clapping, because he was taking that shot. My buddies thought i was crazy for a second there until i told them i want him to keep shooting.

And he did. And if he continues that effort, the grizz could make some serious noise in the playoffs.