(04-06-2015 08:29 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  This rap group has about 1/6th the amount of followers as a JMU home game. In other words, they aren't commanding big signing deals that will help Hall's family.

Unless you value canning Brady above all, it is in JMU MBB's best interest to claim to the contrary.

(04-06-2015 08:59 PM)HyperDuke Wrote:  

(04-06-2015 08:29 PM)JMU2004 Wrote:  This rap group has about 1/6th the amount of followers as a JMU home game. In other words, they aren't commanding big signing deals that will help Hall's family.

Unless you value canning Brady above all, it is in JMU MBB's best interest to claim to the contrary.

sure it is, which is why I have to believe Hall's father stating he has multiple D1 bball landing spots.

BTW, the tally now rests at 8 Brady recruits gone since 2012. A 50% attrition rate.

With that tweet from Sunderland about Hall's father saying there's several D1 offers out there, it makes me wonder... If Hall signed a professional recording deal but decides to go to another school this fall would he be immediately eligible to play or would he still have to sit out under transfer rules? I am thinking since he completely left school and THEN transferred he would be eligible but I have absolutely zero knowledge of transfer rules.

(04-06-2015 04:13 PM)Whitdragn Wrote:  

(04-06-2015 12:55 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(04-06-2015 11:58 AM)Whitdragn Wrote:  It will affect it now, UNLESS he's pursuing it due to financial hardship and even if that were true I have no idea if the NCAA would allow for an adjustment. Time will tell. If he enrolls/graduates down the road we could get the point back but it would be a bonus at that time.

That's effing ridiculous. So a kid realizes he's perhaps not cut out to to be a college student, or doesn't like the school for whatever reason, OR decides he/she wants to start a computer company (or rap label) in his folks garage with the help of a friend, and JMU Mbball gets punished?!?

What damn sense does that make? I transfered cause I hated school 1. Was the decision to ge there the Schools fault or mine?

Makes ZERO sense.

Dunk, I don't disagree with you. But I don't get to write the NCAA rules. We'll likely apply for an adjustment. While we shouldn't be held responsible that will be up the NCAA pending a review of the actual details.

If he left school ALREADY that's potentially going to be a double strike as I question a students academic standing if they're ditching with just a few weeks left in the semester. APR is there in part to force coaches to recruit players who are going to make the cut (or make it pro.....) which leaves struggling major and mid-major programs in a tough gray area.

Please know, 90% of what I post here isn't directed at any one individual. I quoted you to have some background to my response, not tho challenge your post in any way.

I think my overarching point is that the NCAA is about as stupid, archaic, and braindead operation as anyone could possibly conceive.

A kid leaves "college" to go pursue his real interest and that the school or some coaches problem... What?!?

I'd think most would agree we want students who want to be here, otherwise what on earth are they doing other than wasting everyone's, including their own, time?

Go sing, HH! I hope you make a gazillion dollars.

Whatever the case- music career, playing time, etc. Hall made the decision to leave the program. Whether he picks up hoops at some point closer to Atlanta where his music group is based remains to be seen. As Hot Rod stated you are dealing with kids and they are emotionally unpredictable. I think Brady is a solid recruiter and has an eye for talent- Hall scored 15 in the first half vs. UVA a top 5 program at the time- he was a talented player with upside. I think when you have an injury like a concussion and you are out a few weeks you probably get to thinking and that's what happened here. Either way his heart wasn't completely in it so he wasn't going to reach his potential as a basketball player at JMU anyway.

Hall leaving most likely won't cause Jmu any apr hit. Secondly Hall leaving will lead to a better on and off court product of JMU basketball. Next years team has a chance to be better than any that Brady has had here. Biggest question mark is the chemistry of Curry and Morgan and if they can coexist.

In Hall Sr.’s opinion – one the younger Hall later supported in a text-message exchange – his son is moving on from JMU because he didn’t feel his playing style was being utilized properly by Brady’s coaching staff.

“Let me qualify this by saying I think Coach Brady is a great coach. I love JMU. And I think it was a great opportunity for [my son],” Hall Sr. said. “Unfortunately, his playing style maybe didn’t mix with the coaching style. That was the catalyst, the impetus, for all of this to transpire.”

Hall said he settled on his decision to pursue a music career when he did not appear in either of JMU’s final two games after being cleared, following his concussion, to return to practice one week before last month’s Colonial tournament.

“I don’t understand that, either. And that kind of helped me make my decision to go with music as well,” Hall said. “The way they went about handling things with me bringing up the music, I don’t understand why I was unable to [play] if I was cleared.”


He will be playing somewhere else. Music is just the excuse to get out of Dodge.

Hari Hall ‏@Pac_ButtonedUP Dec 16 2012 - So if i get this record deal, should i still accept a scholarship from Georgia Tech and Indiana?
https://twitter.com/Pac_ButtonedUP/statu...8109187072

and right on schedule, cue all of the same Brady apologists telling me why this incident is unique and different and not brady's fault.

here's the thing, i don't think its his fault specifically in this situation... but at this point, the toothpaste is out of the tube.

Part of running a program is retaining, developing, and graduating players... for whatever collection of reasons (some his fault/some not), Brady CANNOT do it and yes, it has been proven at this point.

but here we go, tell me why 18 year olds are unpredictable and I should be happy with last years results and this that and the other...

somebody fire this guy already.

playing ball for two schools + a record deal seems like a lot to do! sheesh and I thought I was a busy guy!

(04-07-2015 07:42 AM)DoubleDogDare Wrote:  Hari Hall ‏@Pac_ButtonedUP Dec 16 2012 - So if i get this record deal, should i still accept a scholarship from Georgia Tech and Indiana?
https://twitter.com/Pac_ButtonedUP/statu...8109187072

Thats beyond frustrating. Stuck up little b%$*

so the record deal isnt a done deal? I seriously doubt indiana AND georgia tech are calling for hall, but hell what do i know.

(04-06-2015 05:40 PM)Hotrod829 Wrote:  

(04-06-2015 04:43 PM)2Buck Wrote:  Players that leave or transfer are usually riding the bench and want more playing time. It's usually not the best players / starters. Note I'm stating usually. He may not be to blame for Hall but it's just a pattern of the majority of his top talent not staying around, whatever the reasons. A coach is responsible for not only evaluating a player's talent but their mindset, emotional state, ability to commit, work ethic, ability to fit in the system, ability to play nice with others, etc.

Doesn't matter what the reasons are, it's obvious we can't consistently field a team that's stable and committed to JMU, and that responsibility resides squarely with the head coach. I don't care if other schools tolerate losing almost half their players, doesn't mean we have to. William & Mary has lost ZERO players from their current team and we've now lost 10 and probably an 11th. How do you build a team and continuity with that? I can't believe there are some who think we just can't do better, and have conceded dominance to the likes of ODU, Mason, VCU... and soon to Liberty, Radford, Bridgewater Community College, Eastern Mennonite, and Rockingham County Poultry School of the Gifted.

He may be great at certain aspects of coaching and I'm sure he really is a nice guy. But how long do we (and by "we" I mean "you") make excuses? I wish I felt comfortable that he could turn things around given enough time but this is death by a thousand pricks. We need some passion and fire up in this here mother f***er and I don't see Matt bringing that if he hasn't already. If we're stuck in the CAA for the next year or for life, the least we can do is own it.

Your asking a Coach to be able to predict what teenagers are going to do with their athletic future. There are also other factors like family and social aspects that can impact a players decision. Shoot, I almost left JMU in the spring of my freshman year , didn't think I would be able to fit in. And comparing us to a school like W&M in terms of recruiting is not fair.

Coaches three main goals i think in recruiting are , Talent , grades , and will they stay out of trouble. All those other factors are not predictable when dealing with 18-21 year old athletes.

Yeah you are right, probably not fair to compare JMU to W&M in recruiting. It is tougher to get into W&M, have a smaller student body which is less diverse -- so it would be harder to fit in potentially, and the academic side is tougher at W&M. So JMU should have it easier recruiting than W&M.

(04-07-2015 08:15 AM)JMU13 Wrote:  

(04-07-2015 07:42 AM)DoubleDogDare Wrote:  Hari Hall ‏@Pac_ButtonedUP Dec 16 2012 - So if i get this record deal, should i still accept a scholarship from Georgia Tech and Indiana?
https://twitter.com/Pac_ButtonedUP/statu...8109187072

Thats beyond frustrating. Stuck up little b%$*

My fault. I should have emphasized the date from the beginning. I just wanted to show that he has been trying to decide between basketball and/or music for three years now.

(04-07-2015 07:37 AM)BSKB 24 Wrote:  In Hall Sr.’s opinion – one the younger Hall later supported in a text-message exchange – his son is moving on from JMU because he didn’t feel his playing style was being utilized properly by Brady’s coaching staff.

“Let me qualify this by saying I think Coach Brady is a great coach. I love JMU. And I think it was a great opportunity for [my son],” Hall Sr. said. “Unfortunately, his playing style maybe didn’t mix with the coaching style. That was the catalyst, the impetus, for all of this to transpire.”

Hall said he settled on his decision to pursue a music career when he did not appear in either of JMU’s final two games after being cleared, following his concussion, to return to practice one week before last month’s Colonial tournament.

“I don’t understand that, either. And that kind of helped me make my decision to go with music as well,” Hall said. “The way they went about handling things with me bringing up the music, I don’t understand why I was unable to [play] if I was cleared.”


He will be playing somewhere else. Music is just the excuse to get out of Dodge.

Agree 100%. All it takes is a little reading between the lines. But if Hall did not want to be part of the program --- good riddance.

Why is it surprising to anyone that kids would use JMU as a stepping stone the same way coaches use mid major programs as a stepping stone. There are tons of people in these kids ears telling them to go get theirs. Cleveland State for the second year in a row is losing a graduate transfer to a BCS school- last year it was Michigan State, this year its Louisville. I wrote about how Robert Morris with a good young coach is bleeding transfers. Bruiser Flint just lost Damion Lee. Brady is damned if he does damned if he doesn't- if he recruits Euro players or guys like Kent he is criticized for giving scholarships to kids that aren't talented enough to contribute right away, if he recruits talented kids like Hall or Cooke that ultimately leave when the opportunity arises he can't keep kids in his program. You don't think that back channels are worked by kids families, AAU coaches and bigger programs to use mid major programs as feeder systems for BCS programs? You don't think that BCS programs have found this to be a good way to have a minor league system for players? The bottom line is that recruiting today is not a perfect science- it's all about winning and Brady has fallen short there as well. If he wins (like the coach from Robert Morris, or Danny Hurley or any other coach who has a ton of transfers out) all is forgiven. If he doesn't win enough he gets scrutinized and this gets added to your laundry list of why he should be fired- it's fair game. Just don't be surprised (barring an NCAA rule change) if when the next coach comes in after the initial transfers if the transfers continue- it's the way it works.

(04-07-2015 07:26 AM)Jmubarkers Wrote:  Hall leaving most likely won't cause Jmu any apr hit. Secondly Hall leaving will lead to a better on and off court product of JMU basketball. Next years team has a chance to be better than any that Brady has had here. Biggest question mark is the chemistry of Curry and Morgan and if they can coexist.

Barkers, I'm of the opinion that McLean is a better talent than Curry....perhaps I'm wrong about that. When JMU played a box and one versus Drexel, it was McLean that guarded him. I think he's got tremendous upside if he gets stronger and works on his game. He makes some incredible passes, knows how to run a team and can really shoot it. I'm hopeful that your observation of Brady having his best team is accurate.

I'm mixing up your comparison Barkers...you were referring to Devontae Morgan. Have never seen him play.

(04-07-2015 07:37 AM)BSKB 24 Wrote:  In Hall Sr.’s opinion – one the younger Hall later supported in a text-message exchange – his son is moving on from JMU because he didn’t feel his playing style was being utilized properly by Brady’s coaching staff.

“Let me qualify this by saying I think Coach Brady is a great coach. I love JMU. And I think it was a great opportunity for [my son],” Hall Sr. said. “Unfortunately, his playing style maybe didn’t mix with the coaching style. That was the catalyst, the impetus, for all of this to transpire.”

Hall said he settled on his decision to pursue a music career when he did not appear in either of JMU’s final two games after being cleared, following his concussion, to return to practice one week before last month’s Colonial tournament.

“I don’t understand that, either. And that kind of helped me make my decision to go with music as well,” Hall said. “The way they went about handling things with me bringing up the music, I don’t understand why I was unable to [play] if I was cleared.”


He will be playing somewhere else. Music is just the excuse to get out of Dodge.

BSKB, I did not see this article in the sports page, but later found it on the front page. There's one other key piece of this that you didn't include:

While Hall – who characterized Brady as a “good person” and “good coach” – was sidelined, he said he informed the coaching staff he was considering making the jump to the music industry.

He said he was perplexed by the lack of playing time at the end of the season after he told the coaches he might leave.

Here's another key section to give it the proper context:

“I wasn’t unhappy,” Hall said in a phone interview. “... My family was kind of struggling. We were having issues with a couple things, and I guess I had to seize the opportunity and do it for my family. It was nothing against JMU. If the music wasn’t an option, I would have stayed.”

And lastly, I was happy to read this, if it's true:

According to Rivals.com, JMU recently offered Weatherford College forward Tonko Vuko, a native of Split, Croatia. Playing this past season for Weatherford — a junior college in Weatherford, Texas – the 6-8, 228-pounder averaged 16.5 points and 6.9 rebounds over 29 games while shooting 43.4 percent from 3-point range.

(04-07-2015 08:24 AM)NJDuke97 Wrote:  Why is it surprising to anyone that kids would use JMU as a stepping stone the same way coaches use mid major programs as a stepping stone. There are tons of people in these kids ears telling them to go get theirs. Cleveland State for the second year in a row is losing a graduate transfer to a BCS school- last year it was Michigan State, this year its Louisville. I wrote about how Robert Morris with a good young coach is bleeding transfers. Bruiser Flint just lost Damion Lee. Brady is damned if he does damned if he doesn't- if he recruits Euro players or guys like Kent he is criticized for giving scholarships to kids that aren't talented enough to contribute right away, if he recruits talented kids like Hall or Cooke that ultimately leave when the opportunity arises he can't keep kids in his program. You don't think that back channels are worked by kids families, AAU coaches and bigger programs to use mid major programs as feeder systems for BCS programs? You don't think that BCS programs have found this to be a good way to have a minor league system for players? The bottom line is that recruiting today is not a perfect science- it's all about winning and Brady has fallen short there as well. If he wins (like the coach from Robert Morris, or Danny Hurley or any other coach who has a ton of transfers out) all is forgiven. If he doesn't win enough he gets scrutinized and this gets added to your laundry list of why he should be fired- it's fair game. Just don't be surprised (barring an NCAA rule change) if when the next coach comes in after the initial transfers if the transfers continue- it's the way it works.

You've got an answer to get Matt out of any fault in every situation. No one would deny that a college recruit would use a mid-major as a stepping stone, but it's on brady to identify the players who maybe wont do that... who have good basketball IQs and love the game.

You can excuse your way out of every situation as to why Matt Brady is not to blame. Flores had family issues, White wasn't a "system-fit", Cooke (what's the excuse there again?), Nation had "his own" problems, etc etc etc...

You have publicly called me a "turd" on this board so i'm just gonna take it to you. Even though you could analyze and convince yourself that each situation is unique, the fault of an 18, 19 or 20 year old and not the coach... when it happens this often, it is a pattern. and it is up to the coach to adjust and identify a different type of student athlete. He has not done that... he has gotten worse.

But whatever i guess boys will be boys and we cant hold our guy accountbale and oh ya of course the next guy will have the same probem (as if we could even know that) and every other program has this issu (only they dont, and its irrelevant anyway)...

guy can do nothing wrong by you... and the irony is, with the hall issue i actually agree with you... that one IS on hall... but its too late... its too many... he shouldnt have brought that type of player in based on what has transpired here.