Why is UTEP not even in the conversation for an at large bid from CUSA if they are the second best team in the conference? Why is ODU better?

ODU is not "better" than UTEP. 40 minutes on Valentine's Day established that fairly definitively. We are more deserving.

It is one of the many reasons that I've developed a real dislike for the rpi, which creates a perverse assessment of comparative team strengths and weaknesses.

That ODU's at-large fate is even remotely dependent upon the performance of an otherwise near-irrelevant Illinois State team is absurd. I suspect that UTEP's rpi resume includes similar absurdities.

I suppose the only thing that you can say for rpi is that there is no consensus for what would work better.

UTEP's 3 extra losses, losses to Marshall and Southern Miss, and ODU's wins against VCU and LSU are what's putting ODU in the at large discussion and keeping UTEP out. ODU took care of business OOC. That's something nobody else in the conference can say, so they're at least in the discussion for an at-large.

Are you guys really taking the time to explain this to Fitbud?

Well, when you lose to Marshall and Southern Miss, you're not going to be in the at-large discussion. And you can add to that the close-but-no-cigar losses out of conference. Which does kind of suck because, assuming we beat ODU in the semis (well also assuming we get to the semis), we'd have 3 top-50 wins (Xavier and ODU x2), which is something not a lot of bubble teams have right now. But, I'm definitely not complaining. We simply didn't get it done.

I respect the UTEP Mbb program it's history, and have said that before, so this is just an attempt to answer the question.

Rpi is used to a degree because I suppose it is the most accurate barometer that has been developed thus far. Although it is by no means the only factor, I do think it is leaned on fairly heavily by the committee. Currently UTEP'S Rpi is at 73, and ODU'S is at 36. ODU'S record vs. Top 50 Rpi teams is 1-0 (VCU) and vs. Top 100 Rpi teams is 6-2 (w's Richmond, W&M, GA. St., LSU, LA Tech, and VCU L's vs IL. St., and UTEP) UTEP'S record vs. Top 50 Rpi teams is 0-2 (Arizona, Colorado St.) and vs. Top 100 Rpi teams is 1-4 (w ODU, L's vs. AZ., CO. St, and LA TECH x2.)

Although the Miners beat the Monarchs in our sole head-to-head matchup, our NCAA resume is significantly stronger. This is not to say ODU is a lock for an at large, but I believe we are squarely on the bubble and will get an NCAA at large wit a CUSA Final appearance.

Good luck in the CUSA Tournament, of course that is unless our teams should meet there.

I have a different theory. It's because ODU is on the east coast and UTEP isn't because UTEP is clearly the better team.

(03-08-2015 12:40 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  I have a different theory. It's because ODU is on the east coast and UTEP isn't because UTEP is clearly the better team.

There are lots of sensible arguments that can be made in this thread, but this isn't one of them.

I guess I now understand a bit better BamaScorpion69's dismissive response earlier in this thread.

(03-08-2015 12:40 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  I have a different theory. It's because ODU is on the east coast and UTEP isn't because UTEP is clearly the better team.

The current at-large lock quality schools from mid majors include Gonzaga, UNI, Wichita St, SMU, BYU, SDSt, Colorado St, Boise, VCU, Dayton, and Davidson. I really don't think that's an east coast bias. UTEP won the H2H between them and ODU. But Marshall beat UTEP. Does that mean we're better too? With a sample size as large as a full 31 game season, H2H is not a good barometer of which team is better. If you want a tourney bid, go win 3 in Birmingham.

It's a moot point anyway. Illinois St. Basically took our last spot yesterday.

If you don't think geography plays a part on selection Sunday, then you are naive.

I think we all agree that there are a number of teams capable of winning the tourney, but at this point in time, I genuinely like the Monarchs' chances.

ODU is really on a hot streak. The Monarchs have won their last six games by an average of about 17 points. This includes wins over LA Tech and Western Kentucky. The team is playing a stifling defense and scoring in transition. They are going to be a tough opponent for whoever they play.

Now, I freely acknowledge that I am more than a little biased, but it seems to me that ODU is clearly one of the top two favorites to win the tourney, if not the absolute favorite. Good luck to all -- unless you are playing the Monarchs.

(03-08-2015 12:47 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  If you don't think geography plays a part on selection Sunday, then you are naive.

It has everything to do with where high seeds are playing. But nothing to do with who gets in.

(03-08-2015 12:37 PM)paintedblue2 Wrote:  UTEP'S record vs. Top 50 Rpi teams is 0-2 (Arizona, Colorado St.) and vs. Top 100 Rpi teams is 1-4 (w ODU, L's vs. AZ., CO. St, and LA TECH x2.)

Not that it really matters at this point, but UTEP's record vs. the RPI top 50 is 2-2 (ODU (37) and Xavier (39)) and vs. the top 100 is 3-4 (Kent St. (87))

(03-08-2015 12:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  It's a moot point anyway. Illinois St. Basically took our last spot yesterday.

Really? How do you figure that?

(03-08-2015 01:20 PM)STexMiner Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 12:37 PM)paintedblue2 Wrote:  UTEP'S record vs. Top 50 Rpi teams is 0-2 (Arizona, Colorado St.) and vs. Top 100 Rpi teams is 1-4 (w ODU, L's vs. AZ., CO. St, and LA TECH x2.)

Not that it really matters at this point, but UTEP's record vs. the RPI top 50 is 2-2 (ODU (37) and Xavier (39)) and vs. the top 100 is 3-4 (Kent St. (87))

Thank you for the correction, sorry about that. My point however, stands.

(03-08-2015 01:05 PM)herdfan2013 Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 12:47 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  If you don't think geography plays a part on selection Sunday, then you are naive.

It has everything to do with where high seeds are playing. But nothing to do with who gets in.

even though it is not possible to 0/1 'prove', there is easily bias when it comes to selection....while it may not be geography regarding the team(s), it is fair to assume that the media plays a large role regarding how the 'bubble teams' develop over the course of the year....

....and where is the bulk of the media located????

he's right about this one, IMO....

edit: there are too many undeserving teams in the tourney.......that's the real issue that nobody will address....it's why all conferences will never get a place at the table with the football playoff when it all plays out (and I'm a proponent of 16)

(03-08-2015 01:20 PM)STexMiner Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 12:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  It's a moot point anyway. Illinois St. Basically took our last spot yesterday.

Really? How do you figure that?

Illinois St. beat Wichita St. last night. So now an at large bid will have to go to Wichita St. this means that there is one less at large bid to give.

That doesn't help ODU's chances who are currently in the "last four out" category.

(03-08-2015 01:29 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 01:20 PM)STexMiner Wrote:  

(03-08-2015 12:46 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  It's a moot point anyway. Illinois St. Basically took our last spot yesterday.

Really? How do you figure that?

Illinois St. beat Wichita St. last night. So now an at large bid will have to go to Wichita St. this means that there is one less at large bid to give.

That doesn't help ODU's chances who are currently in the "last four out" category.

Either UNI or Wichita would have been an at-large anyway. An Illinois St win today steals a bid. We need UNI to win.

I think UTEP is a match up problem for ODU and I think LaTech is a match up problem for UTEP. I can easily see UTEP beating ODU in the semis and losing to La. Tech and CUSA will once again be a one bid league. I don't see ODU getting an at large bid if they lose in the semifinals just like USM last year.