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(03-13-2015 08:25 AM)BroncoFever Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 06:54 AM)brovol Wrote:  Well, as I said a couple years ago, time will tell who is right; and I hope my prognostications are inaccurate. Unfortunately, the past two seasons have suggested otherwise. We were very much an upwardly mobile hockey program two or three years ago, with high optimism that we would even be challenging for a national championship by now if we stayed on the same course. I was worried that, despite the great optimism and excitement of being in the new elite conference, the very high level of competition each week, without any patsies, as well as the more difficult travel (which it is regardless of what others may suggest), we would find the sledding much tougher, and real solid won/loss records would be hard to come by. I said this would take its toll. It seems so far what has happened has not been too inconsistent with those predictions.

We shall see what happens next year and beyond. I hope fever is right, and we will be great next year because of all the terrific players we will have. If you all want, I will even hold my breath. I just have never liked the situation, conditions or circumstances of this conference. If it works out and we challenge for championships, then my smile will grow large. If we stagnate though, I may say I told you so again.

Playing in the old CCHA, Bronco’s were an upwardly mobile hockey program, challenging for a national title ???

BUT

Playing in the new NCHC, Bronco’s program the past two years is a failure ??

You are clueless Brovol…….

I am? Really? LOL. Ok; perhaps I am. But "clueless" as I am, My predictions thus far have proved accurate, no?

You must not have felt that Blashil took WMU hockey from one that had been quite down for several years, to one which competed for CCHA titles, and gained entrance into the NCAA Tourney (one of only 16 teams in the country), which continued with BM, until our tenure in the NCHC began? And you disagree that our outlook was bright, and yes, "upwardly mobile"? (Frankly, it was the bright outlook of WMU hockey which made us attractive to the NCHC). And if you read my post I said that based on what we had done up to that point the expectations by most of us were that by now we should be competing for national championships.

And, please Fever, highlight the part of my post where I said the past two years has been a "failure". I just don't paint the past two seasons as glowingly successful as you apparently think they have been. You have a better gift for "polishing a turd" than I do. LOL. Keep up the fight brother.

PS; Do the rest of you enjoy Fever as much as I do? He should have his own thread.

(03-13-2015 10:29 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 08:25 AM)BroncoFever Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 06:54 AM)brovol Wrote:  Well, as I said a couple years ago, time will tell who is right; and I hope my prognostications are inaccurate. Unfortunately, the past two seasons have suggested otherwise. We were very much an upwardly mobile hockey program two or three years ago, with high optimism that we would even be challenging for a national championship by now if we stayed on the same course. I was worried that, despite the great optimism and excitement of being in the new elite conference, the very high level of competition each week, without any patsies, as well as the more difficult travel (which it is regardless of what others may suggest), we would find the sledding much tougher, and real solid won/loss records would be hard to come by. I said this would take its toll. It seems so far what has happened has not been too inconsistent with those predictions.

We shall see what happens next year and beyond. I hope fever is right, and we will be great next year because of all the terrific players we will have. If you all want, I will even hold my breath. I just have never liked the situation, conditions or circumstances of this conference. If it works out and we challenge for championships, then my smile will grow large. If we stagnate though, I may say I told you so again.

Playing in the old CCHA, Bronco’s were an upwardly mobile hockey program, challenging for a national title ???

BUT

Playing in the new NCHC, Bronco’s program the past two years is a failure ??

You are clueless Brovol…….

You must not have felt that Blashil took WMU hockey from one that had been quite down for several years, to one which competed for CCHA titles, and gained entrance into the NCAA Tourney (one of only 16 teams in the country), which continued with BM, until our tenure in the NCHC began? And you disagree that our outlook was bright, and yes, "upwardly mobile"? (Frankly, it was the bright outlook of WMU hockey which made us attractive to the NCHC). And if you read my post I said that based on what we had done up to that point the expectations by most of us were that by now we should be competing for national championships.

If the goal is to win National Championships, a team must:

1) Win a regional, the Broncos must beat a top four seed and top eight seed team to get to the frozen four

2) Win the final four, the Broncos must beat another top four seeded-regional champion, twice!!!

So how does one best prepare our Bronco team to do this?

Option A-WCHA
Play 4 games vs a top four seed team (#2 Mankato)
Play 4 games vs a top eight seed Tech (#5 Tech)

Option B-NCHC
Play 10 games vs top four seed teams (#1 ND, #3 UMD & #4 Miami)
Play 6 games vs top eight seed teams (#7 UNO & #8 DU)

Which option does everyone think would best prepare this Bronco team to win a National Championship this year?

After playing 16 games this year vs. 5 top 8 seeded NCHC teams, this years Bronco team has combined record is 4-10-2 that includes SIX-1 goal losses, a couple of those loses in OT.

Going into the playoffs, don’t you think this Bronco team “believes” they can beat any team in the country, any time, anywhere (but in CO and on Olympic Sheet) and they believe can win a National title this year???

Brovol sol focus is finding the easiest route to a NCAA tournament, which with his logic, we should be playing the Alantic and every year hanging a NCAA National Tournament Particapant Banner from the ceiling

And Brovol, newsflash, the CCHA was a dead option. WMU made the right choice with the NCHC (for lots of reasons), but none you are able to see though

(03-12-2015 06:38 PM)BroncoFever Wrote:  

(03-12-2015 03:00 PM)The Colonel Wrote:  

(03-12-2015 02:34 PM)bronconick Wrote:  Heck, we play Sparty, Ferris and Notre Dame noncon next year. There's your local games.

And BG, too...

Not a big fan of scheduling both Ferris and BG in the same year, would prefer alternating them every other year.

Need some "road series" vs Atlantic and ECAC

Would also like to see the NDTP on our schedule in some "timely" spots, ie right after the Christmas break, as a tune up game

Not a big fan of the tournaments and would prefer to see non conf series schedule instead, on the road.

No more outdoor games either

I didn't like this year's schedule with zero games against any of the other 6 hockey playing universities from the state of Michigan. That can't ever happen again. Next year is clearly better.

(03-13-2015 11:21 AM)BroncoFever Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 10:29 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 08:25 AM)BroncoFever Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 06:54 AM)brovol Wrote:  Well, as I said a couple years ago, time will tell who is right; and I hope my prognostications are inaccurate. Unfortunately, the past two seasons have suggested otherwise. We were very much an upwardly mobile hockey program two or three years ago, with high optimism that we would even be challenging for a national championship by now if we stayed on the same course. I was worried that, despite the great optimism and excitement of being in the new elite conference, the very high level of competition each week, without any patsies, as well as the more difficult travel (which it is regardless of what others may suggest), we would find the sledding much tougher, and real solid won/loss records would be hard to come by. I said this would take its toll. It seems so far what has happened has not been too inconsistent with those predictions.

We shall see what happens next year and beyond. I hope fever is right, and we will be great next year because of all the terrific players we will have. If you all want, I will even hold my breath. I just have never liked the situation, conditions or circumstances of this conference. If it works out and we challenge for championships, then my smile will grow large. If we stagnate though, I may say I told you so again.

Playing in the old CCHA, Bronco’s were an upwardly mobile hockey program, challenging for a national title ???

BUT

Playing in the new NCHC, Bronco’s program the past two years is a failure ??

You are clueless Brovol…….

You must not have felt that Blashil took WMU hockey from one that had been quite down for several years, to one which competed for CCHA titles, and gained entrance into the NCAA Tourney (one of only 16 teams in the country), which continued with BM, until our tenure in the NCHC began? And you disagree that our outlook was bright, and yes, "upwardly mobile"? (Frankly, it was the bright outlook of WMU hockey which made us attractive to the NCHC). And if you read my post I said that based on what we had done up to that point the expectations by most of us were that by now we should be competing for national championships.

If the goal is to win National Championships, a team must:

1) Win a regional, the Broncos must beat a top four seed and top eight seed team to get to the frozen four

2) Win the final four, the Broncos must beat another top four seeded-regional champion, twice!!!

So how does one best prepare our Bronco team to do this?

Option A-WCHA
Play 4 games vs a top four seed team (#2 Mankato)
Play 4 games vs a top eight seed Tech (#5 Tech)

Option B-NCHC
Play 10 games vs top four seed teams (#1 ND, #3 UMD & #4 Miami)
Play 6 games vs top eight seed teams (#7 UNO & #8 DU)

Which option does everyone think would best prepare this Bronco team to win a National Championship this year?

After playing 16 games this year vs. 5 top 8 seeded NCHC teams, this years Bronco team has combined record is 4-10-2 that includes SIX-1 goal losses, a couple of those loses in OT.

Going into the playoffs, don’t you think this Bronco team “believes” they can beat any team in the country, any time, anywhere (but in CO and on Olympic Sheet) and they believe can win a National title this year???

Brovol sol focus is finding the easiest route to a NCAA tournament, which with his logic, we should be playing the Alantic and every year hanging a NCAA National Tournament Particapant Banner from the ceiling

And Brovol, newsflash, the CCHA was a dead option. WMU made the right choice with the NCHC (for lots of reasons), but none you are able to see though

You are hilarious. Seriously.

Of course the CCHA was a dead option. The league was done. Why do you mention that?

The question at issue is which would be the best option for Western; NCHC or WCHA? And this is not a question about any particular year, but rather for the future of the program.

I wont restate what I believe the pros and cons are for each league, as I have already done many times before, because it is conspicuous that you don't read what I actually have write, and instead disparage me in general based on the fact that I disagree with your position in favor of the NCHC. If you don't care to participate in thoughtful dialog, fine. In my line of work there is a saying about how to argue a legal case to a court: If the facts are in your favor, argue the facts; if the law is in your favor, argue the law; if neither are in your favor, pound your fist on the podium. Respectfully Fever, you appear to be taking the later approach. You make silly points too often.

If the goal of the WMU hockey program is to consistently compete for league and national championships, we need to win enough games most years to keep fans in seats, keep recruits impressed that we are a good winning program, and keep players motivated. If we finish towards the bottom of ANY league regularly that will cripple the program. There is a reason you love the NCHC so much: it is loaded with very successful hockey schools, who have nice hockey budgets, with nice and big hockey arenas, and lots of fans in those arenas, which leads to good recruiting, more wins, and consistent strength. In order for us to win consistently in the NCHC we need to at least match that. Nothing so far has suggested we will anytime real soon. If not, we will end up as a bottom dweller in a really good conference. But even in really good conferences, bottom dwellers don't make the NCAA tourney.

The first step to competing for national championships is getting into the tournament. Once in, anyone can pull it off in hockey. Some of the least likely schools have won it before, or at least gotten to the championship game. The question is which league would put us in the best position to maintain a solid winning program, and get to the NCAA as often as possible. I believe, for reasons already articulated, that the WCHA is the best, based upon that criteria. Others disagree. That's fine. That's what we do . . . . disagree and discuss. You don't need to be a jerk Fever. I doubt anyone is more impressed with you when you are.

To those on both sides of the argument: shouldn't we first win at least one NCAA tournament game before we start talking and/or acting like winning a national championship is a realistic goal?

(03-13-2015 02:50 PM)The Colonel Wrote:  To those on both sides of the argument: shouldn't we first win at least one NCAA tournament game before we start talking and/or acting like winning a national championship is a realistic goal?

Yes we should. Need to get to tournament though. Onward and forward. Whatever road we take. Go Broncos!!!

(03-13-2015 03:14 PM)brovol Wrote:  

(03-13-2015 02:50 PM)The Colonel Wrote:  To those on both sides of the argument: shouldn't we first win at least one NCAA tournament game before we start talking and/or acting like winning a national championship is a realistic goal?

Yes we should. Need to get to tournament though. Onward and forward. Whatever road we take. Go Broncos!!!

brovol you know by now on here if you disagree with certain people they will wear you out,fight the good fight...Go Broncos!!!

(03-13-2015 01:15 PM)bronconick Wrote:  I didn't like this year's schedule with zero games against any of the other 6 hockey playing universities from the state of Michigan. That can't ever happen again. Next year is clearly better.

The non-conference slate two years ago was certainly a bit more enjoyable, with the home and home with Michigan State, the homestand against Northern Michigan, and the Great Lakes Invitational. Also noteworthy, we played two fewer non-conference games this year because we didn't make the trip to Alaska (but still played Alaska at home). Simply fewer opportunities to schedule in-state opponents.

It's great to have Ferris State back on the schedule, and I'm sure WMU is intent on scheduling the other Michigan programs, just don't expect any games against the team from Ann Arbor anytime soon.

After SCSU swept Omaha this weekend, the NCHC now has six team in the top 13 of the Pairwise.

It won't happen every season, but the fact that 75% of the league could end up in the NCAA tournament speaks volumes.

(03-15-2015 01:26 PM)The Colonel Wrote:  After SCSU swept Omaha this weekend, the NCHC now has six team in the top 13 of the Pairwise.

It won't happen every season, but the fact that 75% of the league could end up in the NCAA tournament speaks volumes.

Had WMU defeated Cansius & Alaska, Broncos would be sitting at #17 and with a win tonight bumping them up to #14

BG likely out of the NCAA tournament with 23 wins.... ouch..... one reason why an easy conference isn't necessarily a good thing.

(03-20-2015 10:42 PM)Ubish Wrote:  BG likely out of the NCAA tournament with 23 wins.... ouch..... one reason why an easy conference isn't necessarily a good thing.

The NCHC has 6 of 8 member teams in the tourny. I'm perfectly happy with our conference choice.

I wasn't a big supporter of the move to the NCHC and argued against it at the time-primarily due to the travel costs. I felt the WCHA was a better fit.

But, I've warmed to the NCHC. I want to skate with the best, week in and week out. That'd be the same conference that stuck 6 teams in the Tourny.

As long as we play our OOC games with local teams to reduce the travel expenditures, stick with the NCHC. If we're going to take our game up a few levels you want to be playing with teams that pose a real challenge, not teams at your same level.

With all due respect, the analysis needs to go deeper than which conference put more teams in. And indeed last year the nchc wasn't as well represented. But instead, the question should be in which conference would wmu have the best chance making the NCAA. I still think it is the wcha. In fact, I think if we were in the wcha we would have made it this year.

If we are not consistently in the top half of this league our program will falter in the long run; and it may not be that long of a run. Interest in the program will evaporate.

This year is an anomaly for nchc schools though. But actually having that many teams in the ncaa furthers my argument against being in this league. Do we want to win, or would we rather be proud of the other schools in our league?

I love the MAC, and enjoy being the underdog. I have never disputed how strong the programs are in the nchc. My point is that until we become as strong as a program we are vulnerable to becoming a bottom feeder.

I know I have always been the sole decenter on this, but TIME WILL TELL!!

If Miami can be competitive with the very best teams in the NCHC why can't we, brovol? Absolutely no reason. We underperformed this season and Murray admits it. That needs to be corrected, but why concede after one disappointing season that we can't cut-it in the NCHC?

Now, if we have TWO bad seasons in a row, I might be willing to listen to your arguments. Let's give Murray his Mulligan-as long as he knows it's a Mulligan.

(03-23-2015 07:57 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  If Miami can be competitive with the very best teams in the NCHC why can't we, brovol? Absolutely no reason. We underperformed this season and Murray admits it. That needs to be corrected, but why concede after one disappointing season that we can't cut-it in the NCHC?

Now, if we have TWO bad seasons in a row, I might be willing to listen to your arguments. Let's give Murray his Mulligan-as long as he knows it's a Mulligan.

I don't disagree entirely Philly. However, Miami has been all in with their hockey program for quite a while. Their arena is real nice, and they have had excellent success for a few years before wmu got out of its hockey funk during the culhane years. Frankly though, I think Miami will struggle to consistently maintain success i n this league. But Miami's foundation is stronger than ours going in, as is the hockey foundation of virtually all of the other schools in the nchc. Westerns hockey program was just starting to get strong as the ccha folded. My concern is that the strength of this league, as well as the travel issue to some extent, will make it hard to succeed. And unless we succeed we will lose momentum as a program, which I already see happening a little. Another year at the bottom and it will be tough to dig out in a league loaded with perennial powerhouse programs.

This past year was a bad year, but last year wasn't terrific either. Like I said before, I truly hope my prognostication is inaccurate, and we do great in this league. But my opinion is that the whca would have been a better fit, and would give us a better chance most years at making the NCAA tourney.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Lol

(03-24-2015 05:43 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(03-23-2015 07:57 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  If Miami can be competitive with the very best teams in the NCHC why can't we, brovol? Absolutely no reason. We underperformed this season and Murray admits it. That needs to be corrected, but why concede after one disappointing season that we can't cut-it in the NCHC?

Now, if we have TWO bad seasons in a row, I might be willing to listen to your arguments. Let's give Murray his Mulligan-as long as he knows it's a Mulligan.

I don't disagree entirely Philly. However, Miami has been all in with their hockey program for quite a while. Their arena is real nice, and they have had excellent success for a few years before wmu got out of its hockey funk during the culhane years. Frankly though, I think Miami will struggle to consistently maintain success i n this league. But Miami's foundation is stronger than ours going in, as is the hockey foundation of virtually all of the other schools in the nchc. Westerns hockey program was just starting to get strong as the ccha folded. My concern is that the strength of this league, as well as the travel issue to some extent, will make it hard to succeed. And unless we succeed we will lose momentum as a program, which I already see happening a little. Another year at the bottom and it will be tough to dig out in a league loaded with perennial powerhouse programs.

This past year was a bad year, but last year wasn't terrific either. Like I said before, I truly hope my prognostication is inaccurate, and we do great in this league. But my opinion is that the whca would have been a better fit, and would give us a better chance most years at making the NCAA tourney.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Lol

I think WMU can rise to the competition and will. I think WMU has suffered through the Culhan years while the administration had a passive wait and see attitude toward the hockey program. I believe with hire of Blashill it became apparent that the program can become something more than it was. With the hire of Murrary and the move to a league of " hockey schools" it signals that WMU does want more for its hockey program. Its going to take a bit more time and program development to catch up but I am of the opinion that WMU can and will as long as there is patience with the process.

(03-24-2015 07:36 AM)goldsworth Wrote:  

(03-24-2015 05:43 AM)brovol Wrote:  

(03-23-2015 07:57 PM)BroncoPhilly Wrote:  If Miami can be competitive with the very best teams in the NCHC why can't we, brovol? Absolutely no reason. We underperformed this season and Murray admits it. That needs to be corrected, but why concede after one disappointing season that we can't cut-it in the NCHC?

Now, if we have TWO bad seasons in a row, I might be willing to listen to your arguments. Let's give Murray his Mulligan-as long as he knows it's a Mulligan.

I don't disagree entirely Philly. However, Miami has been all in with their hockey program for quite a while. Their arena is real nice, and they have had excellent success for a few years before wmu got out of its hockey funk during the culhane years. Frankly though, I think Miami will struggle to consistently maintain success i n this league. But Miami's foundation is stronger than ours going in, as is the hockey foundation of virtually all of the other schools in the nchc. Westerns hockey program was just starting to get strong as the ccha folded. My concern is that the strength of this league, as well as the travel issue to some extent, will make it hard to succeed. And unless we succeed we will lose momentum as a program, which I already see happening a little. Another year at the bottom and it will be tough to dig out in a league loaded with perennial powerhouse programs.

This past year was a bad year, but last year wasn't terrific either. Like I said before, I truly hope my prognostication is inaccurate, and we do great in this league. But my opinion is that the whca would have been a better fit, and would give us a better chance most years at making the NCAA tourney.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Lol

I think WMU can rise to the competition and will. I think WMU has suffered through the Culhan years while the administration had a passive wait and see attitude toward the hockey program. I believe with hire of Blashill it became apparent that the program can become something more than it was. With the hire of Murrary and the move to a league of " hockey schools" it signals that WMU does want more for its hockey program. Its going to take a bit more time and program development to catch up but I am of the opinion that WMU can and will as long as there is patience with the process.

Its a fair debate, and hopefully I am wrong and everyone else is right on this. Next year should be telling. Let's see what our record and place in the league standings is at end of year, whether we make NCAA tourney, and what our attendance is. As those things falter, so goes enthusiasm for and within the program. But if we win a lot, that will do much for attendance and enthusiasm. So let's revisit the issue same time next year.

(03-24-2015 08:55 AM)brovol Wrote:  Its a fair debate, and hopefully I am wrong and everyone else is right on this. Next year should be telling. Let's see what our record and place in the league standings is at end of year, whether we make NCAA tourney, and what our attendance is. As those things falter, so goes enthusiasm for and within the program. But if we win a lot, that will do much for attendance and enthusiasm. So let's revisit the issue same time next year.

I've always appreciated your take, even if I don't totally agree with it; I was definitely in support of the NCHC from the beginning.

That said, I agree that next year is one where we can step very much in the right or wrong direction. It's hard to argue the strength of our conference in relation to the rest of college hockey, yet we also can't become the perennial doormat. Obviously the goal should always be to win the whole thing but I'd consider our program to be successful if we're regularly finishing Top 15 in the PairWise.

Where does everyone think we're up-to-standard compared to the rest of the NCHC, and where do we fall short?

My take...

Up-to-standard:
-Coach/program with a recent history of sending kids to the NHL level.
-Amazing locker rooms (although no one compares to NoDak)
-Fans, especially student section.

Needs Improvement:
-Overall facilities are out-dated.
-Lackluster offensive output last couple years.
-Lack of team discipline.