Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

      
Post Reply 
For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
Cat-Man Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,506
Joined: Sep 2004
Reputation: 116
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #21
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-13-2015 09:50 AM)Dannyboy Wrote:  
(02-13-2015 09:37 AM)Cat-Man Wrote:  
(02-12-2015 09:50 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  Mick can coach guys up, he's been doing it for years.


01-wingedeagle

His teams are filled with plucky overachievers. He gets guys to hustle and play D like their life depends on it. It's the definition of coaching guys up.

Who exactly is "overachieving"?

One could argue that almost every player on that roster was recruited because they hustle and play good defense. So that is what is already expected of them. Actually, that is the common knock on Mick, is that he recruits too many of those types of guys and not enough scorers.
 
02-13-2015 10:23 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
HoopsJunky Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,718
Joined: Mar 2004
Reputation: 57
I Root For: UC
Location: Nati

Donators
Post: #22
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
Cronin will have his best team next year and a deep run wouldn't surprise me.

If Quadri Moore can get stronger and quicker in the off season I think he could be a nice replacement for Ellis in 2 years.

He will never be the shot blocker or defender Ellis is but he has much more upside as a scorer.

Would love to see UC pickup a big man transfer who can step in 2 years
 
02-13-2015 10:31 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Overrated Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,706
Joined: Jan 2010
Reputation: 49
I Root For: UC
Location:
Post: #23
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-13-2015 10:21 AM)indycat Wrote:  As much as I'd hope to see it, I'm skeptical. This is not an indictment of Coach Cronin either. He's done a fine job building teams that can grind out enough wins with their lock down defense to earn consecutive NCAA bids. I just don't think these are the kind of teams built for long runs in March.

Pitt's very best teams this past decade followed a similar course--tough (and in their case), often highly ranked in the regular season that struggled to make a splash in the NCAA tournament. Most teams step it up defensively come tournament time; to have a competitive advantage there ultimately must be several reliable scorers on the floor who can deliver double digit performances nightly.

I don't know why, but this is a common misconception about Pitt. They have generally been a much better offensive team under Dixon.

Here are Pitt's adjusted offensive efficiency rankings going backward in chronological order under Dixon: 38, 19, 17, 31, 4, 45, 2, 12, 14, 25, 12, 25.

I only counted 3 years where his teams had better defensive rankings than offensive rankings, and 2 of those were in his first 3 years where he was taking over for Ben Howland, who is a very defensively oriented coach. Maybe that's why most people just assume Dixon is a defensive coach, now that I think about it.
 
02-13-2015 10:40 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bearcat54 Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,824
Joined: Mar 2004
Reputation: 52
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #24
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-13-2015 09:04 AM)Ash_UC_Tix Wrote:  I am very high on next year's team. Most everyone back from this year. Troy and Gary should be really good with that extra year under their belts. Plus, Evans has a reputation as a good outside shooter something this year's team could use. I can't wait.

don't forget that next season, we'll have a true point guard in Justin Jenifer.
 
02-13-2015 07:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
UCGrad1992 Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 31,770
Joined: Sep 2013
Reputation: 2265
I Root For: Bearcats U
Location: North Carolina
Post: #25
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
Love Mick but a final four? As many tournament outs during the first two rounds that the Cats have had under Huggins and Mick I would be excited just to make another Sweet 16. Huggs made one FF in 16 seasons so Mick has time to try to get one. Outside of the luck of the tournament draw, a FF berth not impossible but most likely improbable until recruiting and overall team talent level vastly improve.
 
02-13-2015 07:47 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
loyalcat77 Offline
Water Engineer
*

Posts: 73
Joined: Dec 2014
Reputation: 3
I Root For: Cincinnati
Location:
Post: #26
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-13-2015 10:21 AM)indycat Wrote:  As much as I'd hope to see it, I'm skeptical. This is not an indictment of Coach Cronin either. He's done a fine job building teams that can grind out enough wins with their lock down defense to earn consecutive NCAA bids. I just don't think these are the kind of teams built for long runs in March.

Pitt's very best teams this past decade followed a similar course--tough (and in their case), often highly ranked in the regular season that struggled to make a splash in the NCAA tournament. Most teams step it up defensively come tournament time; to have a competitive advantage there ultimately must be several reliable scorers on the floor who can deliver double digit performances nightly.
Agreed...you need some scorers come March.
 
02-14-2015 12:22 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Bearcats#1 Offline
Ad nauseam King
*

Posts: 45,310
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 1224
I Root For: Pony94
Location: In your head.
Post: #27
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
I see Clark in the teens next year for ppg....13ppg/8rbg range
What would really set the team off is if a guy like Cobb next year could ave 17+ppg. That would be huge. The good news is most juco's, even the good ones struggle a bit their first year and then have a big upside their sr. year. We'll see.
 
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2015 09:07 AM by Bearcats#1.)
02-14-2015 09:07 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
FenderCat Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,963
Joined: Sep 2014
Reputation: 15
I Root For: UC, Hillsdale
Location:
Post: #28
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
Perhaps I am overindulging the positives, but if not here and now then when? I just see the foundations being laid to where at least your bottom is much higher than it was with these last few recruiting classes. This should also mean that your ceiling is higher and the state of the program is strong. If this program can't start putting things like FF chances on their expectations list again, then they need to make adjustments or we need to recalibrate our expectations at some point.
 
02-14-2015 09:19 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Overrated Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,706
Joined: Jan 2010
Reputation: 49
I Root For: UC
Location:
Post: #29
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:07 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  I see Clark in the teens next year for ppg....13ppg/8rbg range
What would really set the team off is if a guy like Cobb next year could ave 17+ppg. That would be huge. The good news is most juco's, even the good ones struggle a bit their first year and then have a big upside their sr. year. We'll see.

I see Caupain taking a bigger step than Cobb. The fact that his shooting is coming along so much is huge. As he gets more confident and plays more and more like the guy we saw against UConn, I think he is the guard that is consistently really good.

Anybody who watches the NBA will probably know that about the 50/40/90 club where you have a 50% FG%, 40% 3pt FG% and 90% FT%. It's incredibly rare. Troy as a sophomore is like 50/40/84. I have no idea how rare 50/40/90 is in college, but I could see him doing it next year.

He just needs to be more assertive (you could say this about Clark as well). But I think that's coming.

I think Cobb will continue to be streaky.
 
02-14-2015 09:47 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
mikecat Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 581
Joined: Dec 2007
Reputation: 10
I Root For: uc bearcats
Location:
Post: #30
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
while I think the future is bright,we HAVE to as a whole get better offensively if not we will never get to a final four.I dont care how good defensively you are you are not going to hold elite team under 60 points so you're going to have to at a minimum average in the mid 60's maybe 70 points a game.With our current philosophy I have a hard time seeing that happening,with that being said it just takes one offensive stud to come in and elevate the rest of the offensive,the question is can Mick reel that player in.
 
02-14-2015 09:47 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Overrated Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,706
Joined: Jan 2010
Reputation: 49
I Root For: UC
Location:
Post: #31
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:19 AM)FenderCat Wrote:  Perhaps I am overindulging the positives, but if not here and now then when? I just see the foundations being laid to where at least your bottom is much higher than it was with these last few recruiting classes. This should also mean that your ceiling is higher and the state of the program is strong. If this program can't start putting things like FF chances on their expectations list again, then they need to make adjustments or we need to recalibrate our expectations at some point.

Mick has said that Jacob Evans is the best player he has ever recruited. It's not an incredibly high bar. Right now that is probably Lance, followed by Cash (really good, would have been great without all the knee problems), Gary Clark and Yancy. But still, it's nice to have a guy coming into the program like that next year.

I do think our recruiting has really picked up the last couple of classes, even including the horrible bust that Lawrence was (I have no idea how that guy was a 5* recruit, he is simply bad at basketball).
 
02-14-2015 09:51 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Bearcats#1 Offline
Ad nauseam King
*

Posts: 45,310
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 1224
I Root For: Pony94
Location: In your head.
Post: #32
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:51 AM)Overrated Wrote:  
(02-14-2015 09:19 AM)FenderCat Wrote:  Perhaps I am overindulging the positives, but if not here and now then when? I just see the foundations being laid to where at least your bottom is much higher than it was with these last few recruiting classes. This should also mean that your ceiling is higher and the state of the program is strong. If this program can't start putting things like FF chances on their expectations list again, then they need to make adjustments or we need to recalibrate our expectations at some point.

Mick has said that Jacob Evans is the best player he has ever recruited. It's not an incredibly high bar. Right now that is probably Lance, followed by Cash (really good, would have been great without all the knee problems), Gary Clark and Yancy. But still, it's nice to have a guy coming into the program like that next year.

I do think our recruiting has really picked up the last couple of classes, even including the horrible bust that Lawrence was (I have no idea how that guy was a 5* recruit, he is simply bad at basketball).

Did he mean best player he's recruited to UC or recruited period? Big difference. Mick was instrumental in some of Pitino's big recruits when he was at UofL.
 
02-14-2015 09:53 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Overrated Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,706
Joined: Jan 2010
Reputation: 49
I Root For: UC
Location:
Post: #33
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:53 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  
(02-14-2015 09:51 AM)Overrated Wrote:  
(02-14-2015 09:19 AM)FenderCat Wrote:  Perhaps I am overindulging the positives, but if not here and now then when? I just see the foundations being laid to where at least your bottom is much higher than it was with these last few recruiting classes. This should also mean that your ceiling is higher and the state of the program is strong. If this program can't start putting things like FF chances on their expectations list again, then they need to make adjustments or we need to recalibrate our expectations at some point.

Mick has said that Jacob Evans is the best player he has ever recruited. It's not an incredibly high bar. Right now that is probably Lance, followed by Cash (really good, would have been great without all the knee problems), Gary Clark and Yancy. But still, it's nice to have a guy coming into the program like that next year.

I do think our recruiting has really picked up the last couple of classes, even including the horrible bust that Lawrence was (I have no idea how that guy was a 5* recruit, he is simply bad at basketball).

Did he mean best player he's recruited to UC or recruited period? Big difference. Mick was instrumental in some of Pitino's big recruits when he was at UofL.

To UC. Said Evans reminded him of Francisco Garcia. Great college player, not a ton of pro upside but I'm pretty sure Garcia is still in the NBA somewhere.
 
02-14-2015 09:59 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Overrated Offline
All American
*

Posts: 2,706
Joined: Jan 2010
Reputation: 49
I Root For: UC
Location:
Post: #34
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:47 AM)mikecat Wrote:  while I think the future is bright,we HAVE to as a whole get better offensively if not we will never get to a final four.I dont care how good defensively you are you are not going to hold elite team under 60 points so you're going to have to at a minimum average in the mid 60's maybe 70 points a game.With our current philosophy I have a hard time seeing that happening,with that being said it just takes one offensive stud to come in and elevate the rest of the offensive,the question is can Mick reel that player in.

The best teams are almost always going to be good at both offense and defense. But Louisville (the year before they won it all) got to a final four with an offense that ranked in the 100's. It's possible to be really, really good and specialize on one side of the ball. Creighton last year and Wisconsin this year are examples of that on offense, Louisville (this year and a few years ago) and UConn last year are examples of that on defense.

Also, we actually have a lot of strong aspects to our offense, especially now that our 3 point shooting has come around to be solid (35% in conference). We are the best we have ever been under Mick at shooting 2's, we offensive rebound really well, and we get to the free throw line (and make them) at a decent clip.

We just need to fix the turnovers. I don't know how that happens. That has been a problem all year, and while I think we have improved a ton since November, that is the one area that really hasn't shown an ounce of progress.

But if we fix that, we instantly become at least pretty good at offense (which would be a revelation based on the last couple of years).
 
02-14-2015 10:14 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
mikecat Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 581
Joined: Dec 2007
Reputation: 10
I Root For: uc bearcats
Location:
Post: #35
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 10:14 AM)Overrated Wrote:  
(02-14-2015 09:47 AM)mikecat Wrote:  while I think the future is bright,we HAVE to as a whole get better offensively if not we will never get to a final four.I dont care how good defensively you are you are not going to hold elite team under 60 points so you're going to have to at a minimum average in the mid 60's maybe 70 points a game.With our current philosophy I have a hard time seeing that happening,with that being said it just takes one offensive stud to come in and elevate the rest of the offensive,the question is can Mick reel that player in.

The best teams are almost always going to be good at both offense and defense. But Louisville (the year before they won it all) got to a final four with an offense that ranked in the 100's. It's possible to be really, really good and specialize on one side of the ball. Creighton last year and Wisconsin this year are examples of that on offense, Louisville (this year and a few years ago) and UConn last year are examples of that on defense.

Also, we actually have a lot of strong aspects to our offense, especially now that our 3 point shooting has come around to be solid (35% in conference). We are the best we have ever been under Mick at shooting 2's, we offensive rebound really well, and we get to the free throw line (and make them) at a decent clip.

We just need to fix the turnovers. I don't know how that happens. That has been a problem all year, and while I think we have improved a ton since November, that is the one area that really hasn't shown an ounce of progress.

But if we fix that, we instantly become at least pretty good at offense (which would be a revelation based on the last couple of years).
I hope,I am a bit more optimistic than I was 2 months ago. I would have said even thinking about a final 4 we need to get you a cup to pee in haha.Like everyone else on this board would love to see it happen.
 
02-14-2015 10:33 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
mikecat Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 581
Joined: Dec 2007
Reputation: 10
I Root For: uc bearcats
Location:
Post: #36
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 09:51 AM)Overrated Wrote:  
(02-14-2015 09:19 AM)FenderCat Wrote:  Perhaps I am overindulging the positives, but if not here and now then when? I just see the foundations being laid to where at least your bottom is much higher than it was with these last few recruiting classes. This should also mean that your ceiling is higher and the state of the program is strong. If this program can't start putting things like FF chances on their expectations list again, then they need to make adjustments or we need to recalibrate our expectations at some point.

Mick has said that Jacob Evans is the best player he has ever recruited. It's not an incredibly high bar. Right now that is probably Lance, followed by Cash (really good, would have been great without all the knee problems), Gary Clark and Yancy. But still, it's nice to have a guy coming into the program like that next year.

I do think our recruiting has really picked up the last couple of classes, even including the horrible bust that Lawrence was (I have no idea how that guy was a 5* recruit, he is simply bad at basketball).
Yea I have been following Lawrence's box scores at Manhattan and I think he is averaging like 4pts a game,not very impressive from the 21st ranked recruit in the country.
 
02-14-2015 10:38 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Ring of Black Offline
Official Person to Blame
*

Posts: 28,421
Joined: Mar 2004
Reputation: 722
I Root For: Cincy Bearcats
Location: Wichita, KS
Post: #37
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
To Overrated's point, I would like to see Troy in the 15+ points range, as he is EASILY, our best guard (point, shooter, all-around). What I do think needs to happen with him is a DRASTIC improvement on the A-TO. Not too much greater than 1.0 (I think it is about 1.2, bue need to check) is not good at all, for a PG. But, if that is the only thing to complain about with a sophomore starter, then it's nothing but goodness.

I would like to see Gary and Octavious both ascend to the 12-14 point range. Realistically, only one would, but IMO it's a good goal. Either has the potential to do so, especially Octagon with about 15 extra added lbs. And Deberry has more than shown reliability as a reserve, even better defensively than most would credit him for. All three of those returning gets me pretty excited.

The 2/3 continues to be an albatross, and I see that as a reason many have panned Fender's enthusiasm. KJ shows high potential, but is not consistent enough to be starter quality just yet. My hope was, that one of KJ or Cobb would show up big on a particular night, but, there have been too many instances of neither one of them happening. Hopefully, continued reps will breed consistency in those two, but we'll see.

I wonder, if Troy gains some off-season weight, that we could do three guards? Troy would be the "point-forward" of sorts once he becomes strong enough to hold his own on the defensive end. KJ and Cobb certainly always show up defensively, and it may be a pretty good combination. If Evans can be "the next Gary Clark", from the standpoint of starting from day one, then that would be HUGE.

Again, to another of Overrated's posts above, this team has actually been shooting the ball very well of late. It is simply the stupid turnovers that are holding them back. It may still be lingering signs of the team still not playing together for too long. I hope that's it. Turnovers seem, to me, like one thing that should be completely correctable, and it drives me 03-banghead that it hasn't been yet.

I like Shaq much better as an undersized 4 off the bench, than a starting 3, and as he continues to add muscle, he will only get better at that next year. I am thinking a Darnell Wilks type role guy, and there is nothing wrong there.

Still won't be a perfect team next year, but there is more to like about it, than not to. I have controlled optimism that next year's team will make a big run.
 
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2015 12:00 PM by Ring of Black.)
02-14-2015 11:58 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BeerCat Offline
Terminally Chill
*

Posts: 8,109
Joined: Nov 2008
Reputation: 99
I Root For: Who's playin uk
Location: The Drunken Clam
Post: #38
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
It's funny that everyone wants to see Caupain score 3-4 more PPg and Clark and Ellis score 3-4 more PPG and Cobb and KJ score 3-4 more PPG . In other words, you'd like to see UC score about 70 points a game. If we score anywhere near that much screw the final four, we're taking the whole thing no problem.
 
02-14-2015 12:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Ring of Black Offline
Official Person to Blame
*

Posts: 28,421
Joined: Mar 2004
Reputation: 722
I Root For: Cincy Bearcats
Location: Wichita, KS
Post: #39
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
These players ARE good enough to score 70. But they are also bad enough, turnover-wise, to score only 48.
 
02-14-2015 12:08 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BeerCat Offline
Terminally Chill
*

Posts: 8,109
Joined: Nov 2008
Reputation: 99
I Root For: Who's playin uk
Location: The Drunken Clam
Post: #40
RE: For the first time I'm believing Mick will get the Cats to a FF
(02-14-2015 12:08 PM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  These players ARE good enough to score 70. But they are also bad enough, turnover-wise, to score only 48.

I know this is just beating a dead horse, but for UC to score 70 points a game I think they'd need to shoot about 75% every game. The pace that Mick seems to like just makes it almost impossible to score that high night in and night out. Maybe as the talent level increases Mick's offense will change too.
 
02-14-2015 12:51 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.