(02-07-2015 05:06 AM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-06-2015 10:01 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  What fools. Who in their right mind would want Fleck fired? The guy is a great coach and an amazing recruiter! I bet you anything that Fleck could get way more than 3 Michigan high school kids to want to come to EMU and play football.

Bob, I'm not sure of the 'value' of this post:

You are posting this after a great WMU turn around season.

The gist of this thread and my posts was SIX MONTHS ago, coming off a 1 - 11 record, Bronco 'fans' were trying to run P.J. out of town.

They are not trying to run him out of town NOW. Bob, need to go back six months in time.

The whole thread, lawsuit, etc. etc. was about the boorish, slanderous behavior of posters, last August, who did not like a head coach because the team had lost very badly the previous season.

Boorish behavior isn't just a Bronco board phenomena. Fans routinely try to run head coaches, athletic directors, university presidents, etc. out of town. (and, of course, when the coach starts to win, they love him. Fans can be so utterly SMH in their behavior).

This is a wake up call, to all posters on all boards to avoid slanderous comments.

No, I realize that Steve, but I have a different perspective. I watched Fleck's very first game on TV--vs MSU. Western was very competitive and even had a very confident swagger. The wins didn't follow, but for me, I could see that his team was competitive and played hard. What I absolutely LOVE about Fleck is that he is 100% committed to building WMU by OWNING the state of Michigan. He has put down the gauntlet and is basically saying, "CMU and EMU the state of Michigan is Mine!" In college football, you have to have a strong recruiting base and then you move outward. Fleck owns the Michigan MAC and he is also brazenly raiding other areas of the country...Creighton is kind of piece mealing together a class, Herb Haygood has some Florida ties so he was able to grab kids there, but got nobody of any note from his own backyard. That doesn't bode well.

Again, those who wanted to run Fleck out of town were probably those who don't understand the game, but can read the standings in their Sunday sports section. And for those who want to compare Creighton to Fleck, I say you are way off. What is the excuse going to be after Creighton wins 2-3 games this coming season? Uhhh, he needs more time, it's all English's fault, Waaaaaa excuse, excuse, excuse!!!!

I don't even require Creighton to win this year, just don't get blown out every game. If he does that, I'd be happy. The bar is LOW.

As for the lawsuit itself, numbskulls using locker room talk on a message board while dumb, it certainly doesn't require a lawsuit. It doesn't damage anyone's reputation because no one in their right mind would give it a second thought. Frivolous. FREE CHIP DIP!

Dear Bob,
You certainly are sold on Fleck, but I am not. He's had some good recruiting classes, and Western had a decent season last year. This year they will have a good chance of losing the three out of conference games they have scheduled, and could come out physically beaten up as well. Many other teams in our league are also trying to be better this year including Eastern. That's why I see Western losing another couple of games in the league, maybe more. To my way of thinking they could easily be 6-6. I think you have jumped on the Western bandwagon a bit early. Personally I think he's (Fleck) more show than coach. Time will tell.

(02-07-2015 09:28 AM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Bob,
You certainly are sold on Fleck, but I am not. He's had some good recruiting classes, and Western had a decent season last year. This year they will have a good chance of losing the three out of conference games they have scheduled, and could come out physically beaten up as well. Many other teams in our league are also trying to be better this year including Eastern. That's why I see Western losing another couple of games in the league, maybe more. To my way of thinking they could easily be 6-6. I think you have jumped on the Western bandwagon a bit early. Personally I think he's (Fleck) more show than coach. Time will tell.

Ken, I disagree. Fleck has changed the culture. He did not just apply a band aid. WMU has committed long term to the guy--they have ponied up the ca$h, so he is in for the long haul. I fear he is just getting started.

Desert Bronco is (or WAS) the biggest internet bully I've ever seen, and that's going back 15 years or so when he was pushing people around on Mlive.

Pure karma.

I like Fleck. He turned that team around in a hurry, but you're lying to yourself if you saw this coming after his first season. He took a team that was competitive every year under Cubit and went 1-11, with a loss to an FCS team that couldn't even beat other FCS teams, as well as to us when we didn't have a head coach. WMU fans were furious. Hence the "Fire Fleck" thread.

But that's why you give coaches more than one year. Wickersham is massive hypocrite, as he overlooks the fact that WMU got blown out several times that year, including several at home. 59-3 at Iowa, 33-0 vs. Buffalo, 38-17 vs Ball State, 32-14 vs Kent State. But Bob claims to have seen this coming because they didn't get run off the field by a Michigan State team that was struggling mightily offensively.

(02-07-2015 11:07 AM)holybovine Wrote:  Desert Bronco is (or WAS) the biggest internet bully I've ever seen, and that's going back 15 years or so when he was pushing people around on Mlive.

Pure karma.

I think he got banned here too. Well deserved. The other two in the lawsuit are still posting. Chipdip is a tool, but at least he supports his school. DesertBronco is s**t stirrer like Bob, only 5 times worse. I'm happy for the good WMU fans over there that don't have to deal with his nonsense anymore.

(02-07-2015 11:16 AM)EagleSam Wrote:  I like Fleck. He turned that team around in a hurry, but you're lying to yourself if you saw this coming after his first season. He took a team that was competitive every year under Cubit and went 1-11, with a loss to an FCS team that couldn't even beat other FCS teams, as well as to us when we didn't have a head coach. WMU fans were furious. Hence the "Fire Fleck" thread.

But that's why you give coaches more than one year. Wickersham is massive hypocrite, as he overlooks the fact that WMU got blown out several times that year, including several at home. 59-3 at Iowa, 33-0 vs. Buffalo, 38-17 vs Ball State, 32-14 vs Kent State. But Bob claims to have seen this coming because they didn't get run off the field by a Michigan State team that was struggling mightily offensively.

Sam, some of those scores don't look so bad compared to the "over midway through the first quarter butt kickings" that Creighton served up all season. Again, if you watched the games, WMU played tough. If you watched EMU, Creighton looked lost...especially against a bad Florida team. He looked disoriented.

Let's face it also, Creighton's first game against Morgan State we had 1. The ESPN sports follies highlight of EMU not being able to knock down that stupid cinder block wall--complete with clown music and 2. Morgan State outplaying Eastern for a good portion of the game and probably winning had they not had a crucial late game fumble. We can all agree that Creighton's first season went as bad as anyone could have expected. That is the unvarnished truth and you can spin it anyway you want.

(02-07-2015 11:24 AM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-07-2015 11:16 AM)EagleSam Wrote:  I like Fleck. He turned that team around in a hurry, but you're lying to yourself if you saw this coming after his first season. He took a team that was competitive every year under Cubit and went 1-11, with a loss to an FCS team that couldn't even beat other FCS teams, as well as to us when we didn't have a head coach. WMU fans were furious. Hence the "Fire Fleck" thread.

But that's why you give coaches more than one year. Wickersham is massive hypocrite, as he overlooks the fact that WMU got blown out several times that year, including several at home. 59-3 at Iowa, 33-0 vs. Buffalo, 38-17 vs Ball State, 32-14 vs Kent State. But Bob claims to have seen this coming because they didn't get run off the field by a Michigan State team that was struggling mightily offensively.

Sam, some of those scores don't look so bad compared to the "over midway through the first quarter butt kickings" that Creighton served up all season. Again, if you watched the games, WMU played tough. If you watched EMU, Creighton looked lost...especially against a bad Florida team. He looked disoriented.

THEY LOST TO NICHOLLS STATE! That is far more embarrassing than getting blown out by Florida. WMU was terrible, and WMU fans were all over it. Their one win was by 1 point at UMass because the Minutemen went for two instead of kicking an extra point to go to OT. Hell, at least Creighton had a solid win amidst all of his massacres.

You would've been the leader of the anti-Fleck march if he was here and he did that. Sorry, there is just no way you would've bought into all of his nonsense after a 1-11 season if it was at EMU.

Revisionist history. EMU was well on their way to losing to Buffalo until Reggie Bell was put in the game...not because it was Creighton's great idea but because Rob Bolden GOT HURT. Prior to Bell playing, a blowout was brewing. Couple that with the somewhat lucky win over that world beater Morgan State and EMU was dangerously close to going Ofer for the season. Pour over the defensive stats and make a compelling argument about how the D-coordinator can accept his paycheck in good conscience. EMU football is not even close to being COMPETITIVE, let alone WINNING.

Revisionist history? So we didn't win that game by more than one possession? Gotcha.

Again, this thread isn't about us. It's about WMU. I get that you go out of your way to defend schools that you didn't go to, and take every chance you can to trash ours, but maybe not hijacking the thread with anti-EMU rhetoric would be a great start.

EagleSam I hope this nonsense hasn't affected your blood pressure.

(02-07-2015 12:00 PM)masttg Wrote:  EagleSam I hope this nonsense hasn't affected your blood pressure.

Not at all. Happy and healthy...until our basketball game starts at least.

(02-07-2015 12:04 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  

(02-07-2015 12:00 PM)masttg Wrote:  EagleSam I hope this nonsense hasn't affected your blood pressure.

Not at all. Happy and healthy...until our basketball game starts at least.

Dear Bob,
You need to step back and be a bit more objective of the Buffalo game last season. Bell came into the game in the second quarter, and the score at half-time was 10-3 Buffalo. How is that a blowout brewing? It was 16-13 in Eastern's favor after three quarters.

As far as Morgan State is concerned, they ended up with a winning record. Not that Eastern still should win, at least we didn't lose to Nicholls State. You either have selective memories, or are unwilling to give any credit to what is going on at Eastern.

(02-07-2015 12:09 PM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Bob,
You need to step back and be a bit more objective of the Buffalo game last season. Bell came into the game in the second quarter, and the score at half-time was 10-3 Buffalo. How is that a blowout brewing? It was 16-13 in Eastern's favor after three quarters.

As far as Morgan State is concerned, they ended up with a winning record. Not that Eastern still should win, at least we didn't lose to Nicholls State. You either have selective memories, or are unwilling to give any credit to what is going on at Eastern.

Ken, I can no longer root for EMU football until they prove to me that they can have a winning record. I was in my mid 20's when they went 6-5, I have wasted 20 football seasons rooting for them. They will have to win me back. Truly, only a loser would root for a team that has been a loser for 20 straight seasons and I am no loser. If they become winners again, which I doubt, I will root for them again. Until then, I am done. 20 years was my max.

Does that mean you won't post here anymore?

(02-07-2015 02:24 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  Does that mean you won't post here anymore?

No, it means I won't root for EMU football until they prove they can win. If you could make it to 20 years of not winning, I would be impressed, but you would bail well before then. You'll never top my record.

It also means that Sam has never rooted for a winning EMU football team. That in itself is kinda funny.

(02-07-2015 02:50 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-07-2015 02:24 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  Does that mean you won't post here anymore?

No, it means I won't root for EMU football until they prove they can win. If you could make it to 20 years of not winning, I would be impressed, but you would bail well before then. You'll never top my record.

So you're a fair-weather fan. That's fine...no one is forced to watch sports, or even support them. I won't bail because I'm proud of my school. It's a shame you aren't. Hopefully more fair-weather fans like you come back when (if?) this program becomes good. We sure could use the support.