(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:02 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  He played hot potato with guys until he got a lead, then didn't substitute at all

So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

macgar, just put a sock in it.

(01-15-2015 11:45 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

So according to this you cannot substitute based on who is or isn't "on" or "off" on a given night? Shaq came in in the first half and made some mistakes, pulled quickly, and never saw much of the game after that.

Woodson had some breakdowns on defense but was killing it in the field on offnese, and was left in almost the whole game.

Nicholls needed a rest in the first half and was back off the bench in less than 2 minutes.

And on and on and on.

This is called COACHING DECISION MAKING.

(01-15-2015 11:45 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

IF Pastner leaves the players in and Houston stretches it to 12-0; guess what macgar the genius would have done? He would have complained about Pastner not subbing when we were down 8-0.

Coach K and Larranaga both played 8 players in the first 4:39 of yesterday's game. You don't have a clue what you are talking about, as usual. Always complaining, always wrong, and crappy instincts.

Btw, what happened when Pastner subbed when Houston was up 8-0? We went on a 13-5 run to tie the game. Typical macgar; wrong about everything.

(01-15-2015 11:42 PM)Chi-TownTiger Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:22 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:21 PM)Chi-TownTiger Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:16 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:10 PM)Chi-TownTiger Wrote:  C'mon Chi, don't go Mimi on us. We're all happy. It was a good win. Enjoy.

Oh, I enjoyed the hell out of it. Our Tigers grew a little bit tonight, and that growth after the last game was discounted because of the quality of the opponent. That can't happen tonight and it is killing some of the fire Pastner crowd as they were so hoping to say I told you so.

That is 2 games now that perceptible growth has been palpable. I am happy, some would say happy with mediocrity, but I say happy with improvement with a young crew on the floor.

Everybody is happy when we win, which is an asinine stance.

Ok going there huh? Let her rip.

Going where? Optimism?

A stance? WTF are you talking about. What is this? A fkngg contest? Give it up.

I didn't understand your question. Give what up? Where did you suppose I was going? (note there are 2 questions there, I will be happy to answer if you can clarify what you meant).

(01-16-2015 12:07 AM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:45 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

So according to this you cannot substitute based on who is or isn't "on" or "off" on a given night? Shaq came in in the first half and made some mistakes, pulled quickly, and never saw much of the game after that.

Woodson had some breakdowns on defense but was killing it in the field on offnese, and was left in almost the whole game.

Nicholls needed a rest in the first half and was back off the bench in less than 2 minutes.

And on and on and on.

This is called COACHING DECISION MAKING.

He's too thick to understand that. You really shouldn't bother.

(01-15-2015 11:45 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

Quote:the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go

Pastner should decide a few days in advance who is going to play, no matter what. Good strategy. Macgar must be a star at Playstation.

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:02 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:58 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:56 PM)mairving Wrote:  it's easy to shorten when you have some guys playing well.

But the assertion this year has been that Pastner was reluctant to stick with a group in order to gain cohesion instead of yanking guys at the first mistake.

He played hot potato with guys until he got a lead, then didn't substitute at all

So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

Another way of looking at that kind of variability is that it makes prepping for Memphis kind of difficult. Can you dig it?

(01-16-2015 12:16 AM)DoomHaynesJr Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:02 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:58 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  But the assertion this year has been that Pastner was reluctant to stick with a group in order to gain cohesion instead of yanking guys at the first mistake.

He played hot potato with guys until he got a lead, then didn't substitute at all

So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

Another way of looking at that kind of variability is that it makes prepping for Memphis kind of difficult. Can you dig it?

Nice. But not popular.

I'm just tired of people who can't sit back for a few minutes and enjoy a well earned victory.

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:02 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:58 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:56 PM)mairving Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:51 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  ...shortened the rotation in each half until we found out what worked and stuck with it....made shots when they mattered....coach gets credit for one of the best defenses in the conference.

Oh and a top 40 RPI win, what is the next complaint, it was at home? I know, they didn't have their coach....but wait, they have been 4-2 without him, and had a 4 game winning streak before losing by ONLY SIX at UCONN the last game.

Nicely done Tigers! Slow to get started but finished strong!

it's easy to shorten when you have some guys playing well.

But the assertion this year has been that Pastner was reluctant to stick with a group in order to gain cohesion instead of yanking guys at the first mistake.

He played hot potato with guys until he got a lead, then didn't substitute at all

So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

No silly; it was the hot potato. Macgar learned it from Coach K.

(01-15-2015 11:45 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:39 PM)Stammers Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:18 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

When they get the needed rest the fire Pastner crowd says he is yanking them too quickly. Now they need rest? The FP crowd can't have it both ways.

Magcar made 27 posts about substitution patterns and then got real quiet...then had to come up with SOMETHING; so now it was the players staying in too long.

My favourite macgar substitution moment was when he bashed Pastner for subbing when Houston went up 8-0 on us.

I got quiet because he essentially never really subbed again... the bottom line is to know w u on you have and what they offer, not wait until gameday to get a feel for how things go. No one else subs in that ,anner, I wonder why.

If you have a set of starters and a team opens on a 8-0 run you don't pull your supposed best players do you....unless you have no confidence in them being your best players or unless they aren't trying and that wasn't the case in the Houston game.

Like I have always said about Stammers appears to never have set foot on a football or basketball field in an organized setting in a coaching or competing capacity in his entire life. Keep on stammering along with no real experience to fall back on

You haven't got a clue.

Kedren Johnson made a huge difference tonight. I thought he ran the team well and seems to be under a lot more control than Pookie. If we can get a consistent Kedren the rest of the way that will make us a much better team. I really like Markel too. Kid plays hard, a great perimeter defender and has high basketball IQ. I'm still not sure what to think of Shaq. He is disinterested it seems out there. Godfrey has nowhere near the skill level but he plays with toughness and heart. Overall it's one win but Kedren could salvage the season if he can get back to that all SEC level type of player.

(01-15-2015 10:55 PM)Pastner4Prez Wrote:  It was a good win. Hopefully we can save the season and get to the NCAAs and make some noise.

(01-15-2015 11:12 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:05 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 11:02 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:58 PM)Chi-Town Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 10:56 PM)mairving Wrote:  it's easy to shorten when you have some guys playing well.

But the assertion this year has been that Pastner was reluctant to stick with a group in order to gain cohesion instead of yanking guys at the first mistake.

He played hot potato with guys until he got a lead, then didn't substitute at all

So he juggled a bit until he found the right combo then stuck with them?

Kids cant/won't play hard when they don't get any rest. He needs to get to a point where he understands who gives him the best opportunity to win and stick with them with a set rotation until someone proves they deserve more or less time. Right now a starter can go from playing 25 minutes a game to 5 at the drop of a hat

As long as humans are playing college hoops (or any other sport), players will have hot/cold nights....plus, opposing match-ups could favor non-starters.

Same way a Cy Young pitcher can be yanked in the 4th inning during a bad performance...while the game prior he pitched a complete game.

Same thing with college kids...some kids are going to have bad nights...and if a player off the bench is performing better and/or the match-up favors another player, smart coach will go with the hot hand when they can. (Not saying totally bench starting player...but like last night, Johnson, who came in averaging just 14 mins per game played 34 mins because he was a good match-up and was producing).

That's why you have a bench...they can help you win games...as your starters are never always perfect.

Just weird stuff.

Even my followers taking posts at the bashers.

Win win.

Good win. Happy for the team and the Coach. But no, it did not change my mind on Pastner's ceiling nor his future. Same reason that those who feel we should retain Pastner have had after the bad losses. One game is not make or break, for either good or bad. It is a body of work question. Those who wish to retain Pastner see the NCAA streak, his win % and argue that he has done a good job. Those who wish for a new coach see, a team that has gotten destroyed way more often than not when playing above average competition and a lack of player development and control. Again neither a good nor a bad game is going to be determinative. But even if we were to make the tournament (still unlikely) I think we would be treated to the same exit we have in the previous two years (probably just a round earlier).ANYWAY...congrats to the team and the coach and his message board supporters, this day is yours, hope you have many, many more like it...just don't believe that to be true.

(01-16-2015 10:25 AM)George CantStandYa Wrote:  Good win. Happy for the team and the Coach. But no, it did not change my mind on Pastner's ceiling nor his future. Same reason that those who feel we should retain Pastner have had after the bad losses. One game is not make or break, for either good or bad. It is a body of work question. Those who wish to retain Pastner see the NCAA streak, his win % and argue that he has done a good job. Those who wish for a new coach see, a team that has gotten destroyed way more often than not when playing above average competition and a lack of player development and control. Again neither a good nor a bad game is going to be determinative. But even if we were to make the tournament (still unlikely) I think we would be treated to the same exit we have in the previous two years (probably just a round earlier).ANYWAY...congrats to the team and the coach and his message board supporters, this day is yours, hope you have many, many more like it...just don't believe that to be true.

Look out George, you'll most likely be labeled a hater, a basher or whatever the hell else some on here like to label people who only want the best for the Tiger basketball program. Don't agree with them and you'll be banished for life as a bad fan.

(01-16-2015 11:25 AM)wylioats Wrote:  

(01-16-2015 10:25 AM)George CantStandYa Wrote:  Good win. Happy for the team and the Coach. But no, it did not change my mind on Pastner's ceiling nor his future. Same reason that those who feel we should retain Pastner have had after the bad losses. One game is not make or break, for either good or bad. It is a body of work question. Those who wish to retain Pastner see the NCAA streak, his win % and argue that he has done a good job. Those who wish for a new coach see, a team that has gotten destroyed way more often than not when playing above average competition and a lack of player development and control. Again neither a good nor a bad game is going to be determinative. But even if we were to make the tournament (still unlikely) I think we would be treated to the same exit we have in the previous two years (probably just a round earlier).ANYWAY...congrats to the team and the coach and his message board supporters, this day is yours, hope you have many, many more like it...just don't believe that to be true.

Look out George, you'll most likely be labeled a hater, a basher or whatever the hell else some on here like to label people who only want the best for the Tiger basketball program. Don't agree with them and you'll be banished for life as a bad fan.

I am of the 'body of work' crowd. This is undoubtedly a good win and comes off of a road win, to boot. In my mind, the body of work requirements to retain CJP is a Sweet Sixteen ONCE in 6 years. He has this year to do it. Last year after the Virginia Tourney blowout, I said 'give CJP another year, that way I will still hold the bar at the same level: once every six years a program like ours SHOULD be making the second weekend of the dance.'

Our program needs excitement and enthusiasm. Last night is an indication of what our program CAN be and has been. Good (not great crowd), great arena, fan support, etc.. It needs to be sustained and Sweet 16 helps that in a big way.

Gotten destroyed.

Winning last night means that day was yours? Thought that day was ours. Memphis.

Tepid acknowledgment of winning, stressing the idea of getting destroyed.

Others who cannot even get that far but do nothing but mock.

Then the obligatory gee we love the program but are labeled as haters just because we express a lot of hateful sentiment.

Your right. Works both ways.

And the so called sunshine oumpers actually recognize a down season, and recognize that while teams have been good they have fallen short of great but that scenario alone does not seem to add up to the over the top snark constantly entertained here.