To put things in perspective for the folks that say "back in my day" JMU MBB was relevant- you know back when the convo was full all the time and the team and program were light years ahead of where they are today. They started tracking RPI in 90-91 (in fairness there were approx. 300 teams in D1 there are now over 350)

88-89 16-14 Win Loss (1st round exit from CAA tourny)
89-90 20-11 Win Loss (Lost in CAA Title Game, Lost in First Round of NIT)
90-91 19-10 Win Loss (1st Round exit from CAA tourny) Lost in First Round of NIT
Final RPI
1991-92- 99
1992-93- 110
1993-94- 71
1994-95 82
1995-96 171
1996-97 201

We've been conditioned to think that JMU was once a top 50 program- top 100 is more like it. You'd have to go back to Lou Campanelli when JMU was in the top 50 and that was before a 45 second shot clock was introduced and before the 3 point shot. We've been conditioned to think that JMU had been basketball peers with programs like VCU or ODU- again those programs had been consistently better than JMU from the post Campanelli era (even before VCU's final four run). To me a random equivalent to JMU from a hoops perspective and even an overall sports perspective is Tennessee Chattanooga- some success in the 80s some success in the 90s- larger basketball facility than the Convo and they don't avg 5,000 attendance either.

The reason I bring this up- there are different ways of supporting the team. If you are waiting for JMU to return to where you think they were when they weren't even there when you thought they were there you are basically looking for an excuse to not support the program. We all romanticize the past but the team in the present plays in the highest level of competition (Division 1) and an average conference and is decent and improving. We all aspire to be Iona, Richmond, Butler, Gonzaga, VCU etc. programs with richer history than JMU even before the post Lefty decline and the baby steps can be frustrating but let's keep things in perspective.

Well, my time was when Lou was running the show, so I guess that I'm allowed.

Certainly- wish I could have been around for it and also the early Lefty years but it was 30+ years ago-not saying this is you but it's probably not fair to compare the current program with the success of that program- the landscape was completely different back then.

We all aspire to be Iona, Richmond, Butler, Gonzaga, VCU etc. programs with richer history than JMU even before the post Lefty decline and the baby steps can be frustrating but let's keep things in perspective.

More like 3 steps forward and 2 back! Let's face it, there are a lot of dreamers about our basketball program on here. They want it to good. In fact, they are so desperate for it to be good/relevant that they have cloudy vision.

Our MBB is as mediocre as it can get. The trip to the NCAA tourney a couple of years ago was an anomaly. It was the result of a lucky perfect storm.

I have resigned myself to accept that I may not see another basketball run in my lifetime to rival what we had in the '80-'83 era.

Defend the program all you want. Baby steps? Screw baby steps.

"If you are waiting for JMU to return to where you think they were when they weren't even there when you thought they were there you are basically looking for an excuse to not support the program."

I expect JMU to be able to put a team on the court that can compete with Richmond, VCU, George Mason and ODU. My support and several of my friends have supported the basketball program for over 30 years, so your statement is not based on merit.

My perspective and the goals of my friends are to be excited about our future and optimistic about returning to the days when we WERE "peers with programs like VCU or ODU- again those programs (had been consistently better than) equal to JMU. "

Obviously, you were not around or attended any of the games, home or away, when JMU was on the same footing. You have no idea of the excitement in the electric zoo that we long for. Unlike you, I remain optimistic and know these days can again be a regular occurrence.

Do not make the mistake to underestimate the long term donors, alumni and fans our desire to return to being competitive with our in state peers.

(12-14-2014 09:09 PM)BSKB 24 Wrote:  We all aspire to be Iona, Richmond, Butler, Gonzaga, VCU etc. programs with richer history than JMU even before the post Lefty decline and the baby steps can be frustrating but let's keep things in perspective.

More like 3 steps forward and 2 back! Let's face it, there are a lot of dreamers about our basketball program on here. They want it to good. In fact, they are so desperate for it to be good/relevant that they have cloudy vision.

Our MBB is as mediocre as it can get. The trip to the NCAA tourney a couple of years ago was an anomaly. It was the result of a lucky perfect storm.

I have resigned myself to accept that I may not see another basketball run in my lifetime to rival what we had in the '80-'83 era.

Defend the program all you want. Baby steps? Screw baby steps.

Hear, hear!

(12-14-2014 09:11 PM)HMK Wrote:  I expect JMU to be able to put a team on the court that can compete with Richmond, VCU, George Mason and ODU.

If you compare the success of our program with other state peer institutions (excluding VT and UVA) over the last 20 years since our NCAA tourney appearance in '94, the ranking would look something like this:
1. VCU
2. ODU
3. GMU
4. UR
5. JMU
6. Radford
7. W&M
You can debate the order or to what degree they are or are not our peers, but you can't debate that we are no higher than 5th on that list. And THAT is what we cannot accept. It's not that "we were once great, so we should be great now". It's that we believe we are better academically, have excellent facilities, have a better student experience, etc than any other school on that list. Aside from the disadvantages of not being a metro school and have a small endowment, we have every reason to expect to start moving up that list.

(12-14-2014 09:09 PM)BSKB 24 Wrote:  We all aspire to be Iona, Richmond, Butler, Gonzaga, VCU etc. programs with richer history than JMU even before the post Lefty decline and the baby steps can be frustrating but let's keep things in perspective.

More like 3 steps forward and 2 back! Let's face it, there are a lot of dreamers about our basketball program on here. They want it to good. In fact, they are so desperate for it to be good/relevant that they have cloudy vision.

Our MBB is as mediocre as it can get. The trip to the NCAA tourney a couple of years ago was an anomaly. It was the result of a lucky perfect storm.

I have resigned myself to accept that I may not see another basketball run in my lifetime to rival what we had in the '80-'83 era.

Defend the program all you want. Baby steps? Screw baby steps.



This! Fell in love with JMU MBB in the early eightie's, of course I expect the same level of success! Admin needs to give same focus to MMB that Football has so successfully received. Love JMU Football, but MBB was first to put us on National stage!

(12-15-2014 10:29 AM)capn kitt Wrote:  

(12-14-2014 09:11 PM)HMK Wrote:  I expect JMU to be able to put a team on the court that can compete with Richmond, VCU, George Mason and ODU.

If you compare the success of our program with other state peer institutions (excluding VT and UVA) over the last 20 years since our NCAA tourney appearance in '94, the ranking would look something like this:
1. VCU
2. ODU
3. GMU
4. UR
5. JMU
6. Radford
7. W&M
You can debate the order or to what degree they are or are not our peers, but you can't debate that we are no higher than 5th on that list. And THAT is what we cannot accept. It's not that "we were once great, so we should be great now". It's that we believe we are better academically, have excellent facilities, have a better student experience, etc than any other school on that list. Aside from the disadvantages of not being a metro school and have a small endowment, we have every reason to expect to start moving up that list.

I would say that VCU, ODU and Mason (pre Hewitt) were also ahead of VT, with Richmond being right around them. That program has not been good especially if you consider their advantage of being in the ACC.

(12-14-2014 09:11 PM)HMK Wrote:  "If you are waiting for JMU to return to where you think they were when they weren't even there when you thought they were there you are basically looking for an excuse to not support the program."

I expect JMU to be able to put a team on the court that can compete with Richmond, VCU, George Mason and ODU. My support and several of my friends have supported the basketball program for over 30 years, so your statement is not based on merit.

My perspective and the goals of my friends are to be excited about our future and optimistic about returning to the days when we WERE "peers with programs like VCU or ODU- again those programs (had been consistently better than) equal to JMU. "

Obviously, you were not around or attended any of the games, home or away, when JMU was on the same footing. You have no idea of the excitement in the electric zoo that we long for. Unlike you, I remain optimistic and know these days can again be a regular occurrence.

Do not make the mistake to underestimate the long term donors, alumni and fans our desire to return to being competitive with our in state peers.

Yep

Our mens team needs to be more consistent. I feel like the next three years are the time that can happen. No Seniors on this years squad. A very good Freshman and Sophmore class too. If Nation can turn himself around, this team should win 20 games this year and next.

Skeptical Nation will make it through this year let alone next but I am hoping he pulls an AJ and doesn't wait until there are 10 games left in his college career to do so.

Don't get me wrong Nation is an important player and makes an impact on both sides when he's on the floor but with McLean, Curry, Grays, Morgan and Roland Brady has as much depth in the backcourt as he probably ever has in his time with JMU. I really think Nation is a 3 more than a 2 and can play with those other guys as part of a quick pressing unit but the team's success isn't as dependent on Nation as it was last year or even before this season began.