The unofficial online home for fans of the UAB Blazers. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

I guess none of the 28,000 people at the last UAB home game were students or alumni?

(12-03-2014 11:08 AM)BatesUAB Wrote:  

(12-03-2014 10:56 AM)braish Wrote:  What makes you think young alums weren't supporting the program?

I swear I am not just trying to be combative here, but what makes you think they are? I know some do, but not a great deal. Not nearly as many as there ought to be.

We're talking from our personal experiences, obviously, and I attended games since I graduated several years ago with the same group who attended as students.

Regardless, I certainly agree student support needs to increase, it's something I fought for years ago when I was on campus.

(12-03-2014 11:01 AM)BatesUAB Wrote:  

(12-03-2014 10:41 AM)blazers9911 Wrote:  You can say the support wasn't there, but I say they never gave us a reason to support it.

That is a crap argument. You should support it because it is your school and your team. I understand fairweather fans when it comes to the casual fans around the city. But students and alumni should support their school regardless. And I understand it is tough when you start having kids and pee wee, soccer, etc. get in the way, and I don't hold that against people. But to say "I don't blame people for not showing up because we lost games"..... That is a slap in the face of the guys we admire for standing up to Watts in that meeting yesterday.

I live an hour and a half away. If I was closer, I would attend more games. But i wasn't driving an hour and a half to watch calllaway and McGee embarrass our program every other Saturday. If that makes me a fair weather fan to you, you are entitled to my opinion. Had we opened the ocs, I would have been first in line for season tickets and made that drive because we were finally getting support for or program.

But I have always, and will always support UAB. Unless they actually invest in the program though, there is going to be limited support. That's just the way it is.

(12-03-2014 11:01 AM)BatesUAB Wrote:  

(12-03-2014 10:41 AM)blazers9911 Wrote:  You can say the support wasn't there, but I say they never gave us a reason to support it.

That is a crap argument. You should support it because it is your school and your team. I understand fairweather fans when it comes to the casual fans around the city. But students and alumni should support their school regardless. And I understand it is tough when you start having kids and pee wee, soccer, etc. get in the way, and I don't hold that against people. But to say "I don't blame people for not showing up because we lost games"..... That is a slap in the face of the guys we admire for standing up to Watts in that meeting yesterday.

Come back to reality. Your ideals are pure fantasy.

Granted, there weren't as many students at football games as there should have been. However, there are a number of factors at work.

First there is the fact most young people in this state grow up as Auburn and Alabama fans so we have that going against us from the start. However, that could have been over come.

Had we had the proper support from the beginning from the BOT, our football program would be thriving. With the freedom to select our own coaches, build an on campus stadium, etc. - all of which equal a program which is successful on the field - students would have been competing for game tickets.

Could our football program have been that successful - you're damned right it could have been. If you want to see what could have been done with the right ingredients, just look what Coach Clark did in just one year with none of those advantages.

The BOT's plan was simple - deprive the UAB football program of all of the elements it needs to succeed and ultimately they could shut it down because it was not successful. Then, when the time comes, you carefully pick and chose how to define success - money, student participation, whatever is not up to par, and you have the necessary excuses to shut the program down. And that plan worked to perfection.

So let's not spend our time blaming other parts of the UAB family for not helping us to maintain what was precious to us. In my mind that deflects some of the blame from the scumbags who orchestrated this from the very start. I will not be a part of that!

This whole argument is stupid. Even Nick Saban has to get on TV and ***** about students not sticking around for the entire game at Alabama. What's the magic number of students that have to show up to be allowed to have a football team? It seems you guys want more students to show up for football than even show up for classes.

(12-03-2014 10:07 AM)BatesUAB Wrote:  In the press conference he was specifically asked about the $2 million cost to break future game contracts, and he specifically said it wasn't that much. Said something along the lines of "I don't know the exact number, but it isn't that." Unless by that he meant it was more, he was either explicitly lying or didn't have a clue what the numbers actually were. I can believe either.

I will give him credit for being truthful about one thing, and I have hesitated to say this. He wasn't lying when he said football by and large hasn't been a part of the student experience at UAB. Student support for football, and basketball for that matter, has been pathetic. Blame it on whatever you want- Legion Field, bad coaches and terrible teams- but the fact is with a student body of nearly 20,000 or whatever it is now we probably had less than 1,000 at the football games.

It hurts to look in the mirror some times, but some introspection is necessary here. The students by and large did not support the football team. And neither did a lot of young alumni for that matter. There are a lot of people close to me that went to the games religiously as students, but over the years they faded away from UAB football. It is difficult to get people to support a loser, I know that. But I really think some share of the blame must go on the shoulders of people who have diplomas from UAB hanging on their walls and people sitting in class at UAB right now.

I will now accept the blasting I am sure to get, but somebody had to say it.

Do you really think it's different at other schools. The vast majority of students and alumni from any university do not attend games. And twenty years is not enough time to build the large number of alumni that have the time and money to attend games. Think of it, twenty years out of college, most are thinking (worrying) of how to pay for their children's education, or beginning to really think of retirement funds. After thirty, that would ease as more become financially secure. UAB was building that base. Look at the letter from Med graduates in another thread, it is filled primarily with recent graduates that will not have the time to actually attend games for years, but the interest is there.
If UAB is to be eviscerated, both academically and athletically, it had to be done now, before the committed alumni base becomes too large.

Look, I am not saying that everything we know happened to bring the program down isn't true. Yes, a handful of people called the shots on this one. And I am not saying there is some magic number of students or alumni necessary to continue. But you have to remember, we see things from a different perspective. If you are here on this website, you are obviously a supporter. And like associate yourself with supporters. I know young alumni supported the program- I tailgated with a good size group of them at every game. And I know some students went to the games and were big time Blazer fans. All I am trying to say is that there support was not what it could or should have been, and Cajun laid out several reasons why.

I know people can't do everything all the time. I live an hour away and I struggle to make some of the basketball games, even though I hold season tickets. But the fact is that there are a lot of alums who live in town that don't support UAB athletics because they just don't care, and that is a problem. This should be a warning for the future.

A nice new stadium they could fall out of their dorm bed into might have mitigated this some.

Why didn't somebody think of that?

(12-03-2014 11:40 AM)Smaug Wrote:  A nice new stadium they could fall out of their dorm bed into might have mitigated this some.

Why didn't somebody think of that?

You get no argument from me there. That was the killer. I really, truly believe that would have been the moment when we turned a corner and all the things I have pointed out in this thread started going the other way. I always dreamed of having the experience of tailgating at HOME.

You can't seriously tell me that you expect people to take time out of their day and make a trip to Legion Field of all places to witness the prolonged suffering of a program that tried to do things the right way. The streak of incompetence, machinations, and veiled attacks on the program were instituted to bring this about. You wanted people turn out after a man got an extension for losing? After a winless team stopped by and blew us out?

You don't even have to look far to see what losing does. A few years removed from holding up a national championship trophy, Chizik was losing and one of the big points to him having to go was a drop in attendance. They were starting to lose more often, so people stop showing up. This is a SEC school that has a stadium on campus and one that also has a history of success. And you're expecting a relatively young school that never had the backing of the people that are supposed to help to have good turn out despite the stretch of bad seasons so long that the good things about the program barely resonate with the current student body?

You're blaming us students for this? For real?

One year. In one year with coach that really invested himself in the program, I have seen students that didn't even like football show up. I saw people get their hopes up and make it a point to come to the game. That's just one year. At Legion Field. Don't subscribe to the school of thought that we should be blamed for not supporting it because the board of trustees and the things they did exhausted a fanbase that was already battered. I mean, this is the same talking point the people against us have been rehashing in all those crazy comments. You can't seriously be pointing the finger at us for this catch 22.

(12-03-2014 11:59 AM)Hopeful Wrote:  You can't seriously tell me that you expect people to take time out of their day and make a trip to Legion Field of all places to witness the prolonged suffering of a program that tried to do things the right way. The streak of incompetence, machinations, and veiled attacks on the program were instituted to bring this about. You wanted people turn out after a man got an extension for losing? After a winless team stopped by and blew us out?

You don't even have to look far to see what losing does. A few years removed from holding up a national championship trophy, Chizik was losing and one of the big points to him having to go was a drop in attendance. They were starting to lose more often, so people stop showing up. This is a SEC school that has a stadium on campus and one that also has a history of success. And you're expecting a relatively young school that never had the backing of the people that are supposed to help to have good turn out despite the stretch of bad seasons so long that the good things about the program barely resonate with the current student body?

You're blaming us students for this? For real?

One year. In one year with coach that really invested himself in the program, I have seen students that didn't even like football show up. I saw people get their hopes up and make it a point to come to the game. That's just one year. At Legion Field. Don't subscribe to the school of thought that we should be blamed for not supporting it because the board of trustees and the things they did exhausted a fanbase that was already battered. I mean, this is the same talking point the people against us have been rehashing in all those crazy comments. You can't seriously be pointing the finger at us for this catch 22.

Got to agree with Bates on this. One of the reasons often given for having football (even when it's a losing proposition) is the college-life experience it gives students. It becomes harder to make that argument if students aren't using that particular experience. I KNOW WE HAVE MANY OBSTACLES, but that was one point Watts made that was hard to argue against.

(12-03-2014 11:59 AM)Hopeful Wrote:  You can't seriously tell me that you expect people to take time out of their day and make a trip to Legion Field of all places to witness the prolonged suffering of a program that tried to do things the right way. The streak of incompetence, machinations, and veiled attacks on the program were instituted to bring this about. You wanted people turn out after a man got an extension for losing? After a winless team stopped by and blew us out?

You don't even have to look far to see what losing does. A few years removed from holding up a national championship trophy, Chizik was losing and one of the big points to him having to go was a drop in attendance. They were starting to lose more often, so people stop showing up. This is a SEC school that has a stadium on campus and one that also has a history of success. And you're expecting a relatively young school that never had the backing of the people that are supposed to help to have good turn out despite the stretch of bad seasons so long that the good things about the program barely resonate with the current student body?

You're blaming us students for this? For real?

One year. In one year with coach that really invested himself in the program, I have seen students that didn't even like football show up. I saw people get their hopes up and make it a point to come to the game. That's just one year. At Legion Field. Don't subscribe to the school of thought that we should be blamed for not supporting it because the board of trustees and the things they did exhausted a fanbase that was already battered. I mean, this is the same talking point the people against us have been rehashing in all those crazy comments. You can't seriously be pointing the finger at us for this catch 22.

Attendance was improving; wasn't the average this year double of the previous year? It seems that continued improvement on the field was ahead for this team, resulting in an even greater attendance number. Also, there were some students not sitting in the student section, some were sitting in the other seats.

Something else to consider: Young school (relative as compared to the money makers), therefore, smaller # of alumni. Further, many (like me) either a) don't live in the state, or b) don't live close to the venue. The problem with the "butts in seats" argument is its more a matter of perception than it is a matter of ticket sales to make money. I would presume that MOST/ALL young programs require a rather lengthy time requiring a large amount of subsidy to build the program to stand on it's own. Just ask UCF, USF, etc.
Once Gene Bartow was gone, UAB was NEVER given the support and resources she needed to compete and attempt to stand up the football program on its own. This goes back to 1) the Jimbo nix, 2) the forced hire of Neil Calloway, 3) the OCS abortion, and 4) yesterday's "Watts calls the time of death" for football proclamation. Do "butts in seats" matter? Sure. But, they are the ultimate goal. IMHO, UAB was never given the realistic chance to reach that goal.

It's the chicken and egg thing. They planned it this way all along. Feed the golden elephant, neglect the lizard in the corner and this week we saw the culmination of their treachery.

(12-03-2014 01:33 PM)USAFBlazerFan Wrote:  Something else to consider: Young school (relative as compared to the money makers), therefore, smaller # of alumni. Further, many (like me) either a) don't live in the state, or b) don't live close to the venue. The problem with the "butts in seats" argument is its more a matter of perception than it is a matter of ticket sales to make money. I would presume that MOST/ALL young programs require a rather lengthy time requiring a large amount of subsidy to build the program to stand on it's own. Just ask UCF, USF, etc.
Once Gene Bartow was gone, UAB was NEVER given the support and resources she needed to compete and attempt to stand up the football program on its own. This goes back to 1) the Jimbo nix, 2) the forced hire of Neil Calloway, 3) the OCS abortion, and 4) yesterday's "Watts calls the time of death" for football proclamation. Do "butts in seats" matter? Sure. But, they are the ultimate goal. IMHO, UAB was never given the realistic chance to reach that goal.

Agree completely.

One of the things I saw missing from the study that should have been there was analysis of what USF and UCF have done over the last 10 years. What were their costs and subsidies vs capital improvements and how they got to where they are. A real study of how a modern program can be successful should have included those schools at a minimum. But that was not the point of the study...

(12-03-2014 11:59 AM)Hopeful Wrote:  You can't seriously tell me that you expect people to take time out of their day and make a trip to Legion Field of all places to witness the prolonged suffering of a program that tried to do things the right way. The streak of incompetence, machinations, and veiled attacks on the program were instituted to bring this about. You wanted people turn out after a man got an extension for losing? After a winless team stopped by and blew us out?

Don't subscribe to the school of thought that we should be blamed for not supporting it because the board of trustees and the things they did exhausted a fanbase that was already battered. I mean, this is the same talking point the people against us have been rehashing in all those crazy comments. You can't seriously be pointing the finger at us for this catch 22.

Dude. We're not blaming you. Everything that you point out that's hurtful and depressing and soulgrinding about being a UAB football fan, I've been enduring since you were in the first grade.

I understand that this board is a place for the hard core Blazer fan.

I'm just saying that you're not going to get much sympathy from me when my wife and I sat through a game while 3" to 4" of rain fell and didn't even leave our seats to get under the canopy... on a game that was on ESPN and we could have stayed home and watched.

We've endured more pain and armageddon around UAB Football than you can imagine, and find your lack of faith... disturbing.

Relax. It's the old men bitching about "kids today".

I get that.

It's just depressing, here of all places, to see informed people take that bait so easily. I'm just saying that I hate to see this issue even being thrown around like it's legitimate when we all know the truth. I hate to see blame delegated and fingers being pointed when the ones responsible for all of this wants us to use this as ammunition against each other and want to see it used as a real talking point when its not.

Some of you seriously over-estimate the thought that the average UAB undergrad student (previously) put into the athletic programs. Students weren't weighing all of those factors by ticking it out on an abacus or something. It was fairly clear that a majority just didn't care. I do feel the outrage does have a streak of a "Have your cake and eat it too" attitude, but that's to be expected with a younger crowd.

No one can blame those who protested, those were the students who actually did go to games.