(11-20-2014 11:16 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 11:13 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 11:08 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  would like o see a game where Morman and Cobb are both lighting it up beyond the arc. It would really loosen the interior up for Ellis/Clark to attack the rim

I don't think Morman is much of an outside shooter at this point. More likely to see KJ and Cobb light it up.

wonder where I got the notion he was a deep threat? hmmm

so after Cobb who is our best three point shooters...

Sanders, KJ, Caupain?

And Quadri Moore

KJ's problem last year and so far this year has been bad turnovers. He is not a great ball handler or passer and tends to freeze up and panic when under pressure with the ball in his hands. A lot of his turnovers are passing turnovers which tend to result in easy fast break points. If he can get that under control he will see a nice increase in PT. Cobb gives us essentially what KJ does, with even a little more scoring pop, yet is a good ball handler. Caupain and Cobb need to be seeing the majority of the guard minutes with Guyn and KJ spelling them as needed.

(11-20-2014 12:15 PM)OneUChoopsfan Wrote:  If you look at the stats, last night Moore should not have been on the court. 16 minutes, 2 personal fouls, 1 turnover, 1 point, 1 rebound. Can't help but think he may have more of a typical big man timeline. Hope I'm wrong.

DeBerry played 2 minutes, and Strickland played less than 1 minute.

That left Ellis and Clark to carry the load, and we shouldn't expect that combo to work this much night after night. They will foul out of some games, may tire over the course of the season, and if the other bigs don't prove their worth, we'll be forced to play small.

Things will probably work out, but I am still concerned.

Work in progress. We all know that.

Agree about Moore. Not sure why he saw so much run last night. Not effective at all, especially on defense, where boxing out clearly was not in his mindset. On offense, I did not understand his extra dribbles (like Shaq has continued to do into his fourth year). His shot is good enough, that he can drain 10-15 footers with ease. He needs to pull up instead of trying to back all the way down for a layup every time. But, all that will come with experience, and his b-ball IQ is good. He'll get there quickly.

Deberry needs more PT, but he also has to fill the proper role, while in. It's beyond me, why he spent so much time camping in the high post. Put him on the low block. It's his bread and butter.

Clark and Ellis are clearly the proper starters at this point.

iirc, Mick kept KJ on the bench because after he picked up his second foul, Mick felt that Cobb, Caupain and Guyn had a nice rhythm and there was no need to interfere with it. My espn3 hasn't been working so, unfortunately, i haven't been able to watch the games. i will say that, from what i've listened to, Shaq sounds like he's playing like shite, Ellis has been our best player, hands down, Cobb is our best shooter, hands down, and our 2nd year guards (Caupain and KJ) are not playing like second year guards.

While i'm disappointed that Shaq/Guyn/Sanders haven't taken the JJ leap, yet, i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

(11-20-2014 03:04 PM)eroc Wrote:  i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

He has missed soooo much time in the last 4 years. Like probably 70%+. I think it's gonna take him some time to contribute. I'm not expecting much this year.

It's too bad he can't redshirt, and it's really too bad he wasn't allowed to at least practice last year.

I know it's only one game and I'm trying to contain my enthusiasm, but I honestly can't remember any UC player who could shoot the 3 ball as well as Farad did last night. Maybe Logan. His shot was just so smooth and natural. The tempo and arc was just perfect. I think all but one of the 6 didn't touch the rim, and then barely even touched the net. Reminded me of Steve Kerr with AZ and the Bulls. I just don't think it was even "close" to a fluke night. Guess we'll see, but I think he's the real deal.

(11-20-2014 03:04 PM)eroc Wrote:  iirc, Mick kept KJ on the bench because after he picked up his second foul, Mick felt that Cobb, Caupain and Guyn had a nice rhythm and there was no need to interfere with it. My espn3 hasn't been working so, unfortunately, i haven't been able to watch the games. i will say that, from what i've listened to, Shaq sounds like he's playing like shite, Ellis has been our best player, hands down, Cobb is our best shooter, hands down, and our 2nd year guards (Caupain and KJ) are not playing like second year guards.

While i'm disappointed that Shaq/Guyn/Sanders haven't taken the JJ leap, yet, i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

What's wrong with how Troy played last night? I thought he was solid across the board. His job is to run the offense and as such he was the primary ball handler playing 31 minutes. In that time he had 6 assists and only turned it over 1 time. He took good shots and after a slow start at the free throw line he made is foul shots. He also chipped in with 5 rebounds and made 1 of his 2 three point attempts. That's exactly the kind of game I want from Troy and the kind I think he can give them all year.

(11-20-2014 03:42 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:04 PM)eroc Wrote:  iirc, Mick kept KJ on the bench because after he picked up his second foul, Mick felt that Cobb, Caupain and Guyn had a nice rhythm and there was no need to interfere with it. My espn3 hasn't been working so, unfortunately, i haven't been able to watch the games. i will say that, from what i've listened to, Shaq sounds like he's playing like shite, Ellis has been our best player, hands down, Cobb is our best shooter, hands down, and our 2nd year guards (Caupain and KJ) are not playing like second year guards.

While i'm disappointed that Shaq/Guyn/Sanders haven't taken the JJ leap, yet, i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

What's wrong with how Troy played last night? I thought he was solid across the board. His job is to run the offense and as such he was the primary ball handler playing 31 minutes. In that time he had 6 assists and only turned it over 1 time. He took good shots and after a slow start at the free throw line he made is foul shots. He also chipped in with 5 rebounds and made 1 of his 2 three point attempts. That's exactly the kind of game I want from Troy and the kind I think he can give them all year.

I think "our second year guards are not playing like second year guards" was a compliment. He said he hasn't been able to see the games, so I don't think he realizes KJ has struggled out of the gate.

I could have misunderstood though.

(11-20-2014 03:45 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:42 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:04 PM)eroc Wrote:  iirc, Mick kept KJ on the bench because after he picked up his second foul, Mick felt that Cobb, Caupain and Guyn had a nice rhythm and there was no need to interfere with it. My espn3 hasn't been working so, unfortunately, i haven't been able to watch the games. i will say that, from what i've listened to, Shaq sounds like he's playing like shite, Ellis has been our best player, hands down, Cobb is our best shooter, hands down, and our 2nd year guards (Caupain and KJ) are not playing like second year guards.

While i'm disappointed that Shaq/Guyn/Sanders haven't taken the JJ leap, yet, i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

What's wrong with how Troy played last night? I thought he was solid across the board. His job is to run the offense and as such he was the primary ball handler playing 31 minutes. In that time he had 6 assists and only turned it over 1 time. He took good shots and after a slow start at the free throw line he made is foul shots. He also chipped in with 5 rebounds and made 1 of his 2 three point attempts. That's exactly the kind of game I want from Troy and the kind I think he can give them all year.

I think "our second year guards are not playing like second year guards" was a compliment. He said he hasn't been able to see the games, so I don't think he realizes KJ has struggled out of the gate.

I could have misunderstood though.

it wasn't a compliment. i haven't been able to see the games but listening to Dan and Chuck, it sounds like they aren't running the break well, not penetrating when other teams are playing zone, taking some bad shots, etc. it's not to say that they haven't done some things right but, in your opinion, is it night and day between what you saw last year vs. this one? ti doesn't sound like it.

(11-20-2014 03:39 PM)payday Wrote:  I know it's only one game and I'm trying to contain my enthusiasm, but I honestly can't remember any UC player who could shoot the 3 ball as well as Farad did last night. Maybe Logan. His shot was just so smooth and natural. The tempo and arc was just perfect. I think all but one of the 6 didn't touch the rim, and then barely even touched the net. Reminded me of Steve Kerr with AZ and the Bulls. I just don't think it was even "close" to a fluke night. Guess we'll see, but I think he's the real deal.

I would keep it a bit contained. Yes he is a seriously good shooter - but Morehead wasn't getting out to the wing to guard him. Why? I have no clue. But they weren't.

Teams are going to respect his ability and he isn't going to let him get as many of those perfect step-into-your-shot perimeter looks.

We have to engage our post guys in the offense, other than Ellis. And are in huge trouble if we get extremely limited production out of our small forwards.

Shaq Thomas passing up an open 12 footer to drive straight into defenders in the lane and try to force a contested 7 footer is asinine.

Troy passing up open shots all over the place. WHY?????

Good things are happening - things are improving. but there are some real issues as well.

(11-20-2014 04:19 PM)eroc Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:45 PM)Overrated Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:42 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:04 PM)eroc Wrote:  iirc, Mick kept KJ on the bench because after he picked up his second foul, Mick felt that Cobb, Caupain and Guyn had a nice rhythm and there was no need to interfere with it. My espn3 hasn't been working so, unfortunately, i haven't been able to watch the games. i will say that, from what i've listened to, Shaq sounds like he's playing like shite, Ellis has been our best player, hands down, Cobb is our best shooter, hands down, and our 2nd year guards (Caupain and KJ) are not playing like second year guards.

While i'm disappointed that Shaq/Guyn/Sanders haven't taken the JJ leap, yet, i'm very discouraged about Jamaree Strickland. While i didn't know what to expect, i would have expected him to be the natural backup to Ellis at this point. Hopefully he'll start making more contributions down the line.

What's wrong with how Troy played last night? I thought he was solid across the board. His job is to run the offense and as such he was the primary ball handler playing 31 minutes. In that time he had 6 assists and only turned it over 1 time. He took good shots and after a slow start at the free throw line he made is foul shots. He also chipped in with 5 rebounds and made 1 of his 2 three point attempts. That's exactly the kind of game I want from Troy and the kind I think he can give them all year.

I think "our second year guards are not playing like second year guards" was a compliment. He said he hasn't been able to see the games, so I don't think he realizes KJ has struggled out of the gate.

I could have misunderstood though.

it wasn't a compliment. i haven't been able to see the games but listening to Dan and Chuck, it sounds like they aren't running the break well, not penetrating when other teams are playing zone, taking some bad shots, etc. it's not to say that they haven't done some things right but, in your opinion, is it night and day between what you saw last year vs. this one? ti doesn't sound like it.

KJ hasn't played well. He is fouling too much, so he isn't playing much. He was our most impressive player in the game in the Bahamas and overall I think most that got to see offseason workouts expect him to be one of the best players on the team this year. But it's been a disappointing start.

I think Troy has been solid. I would like the team to play faster and push the ball more. I think that is a strength of Troy's. But I don't think that it's his decision not to. I think that Mick likes to play incredibly slow because it allows him more control and favors defense, and he is incredibly partial to defense. But he has been efficient from the floor posting 120+ O-Ratings in each game, with a strong assist rate, and he is getting to the foul line a lot (granted a lot of that is late in the game).

Troy looks to be doing exactly what Mick wants him to do. He's facilitating the offense, taking care of the basketball and scoring when he needs to. I do agree with Eastside that I wish Troy would take more open jumpers, but I think he's concentrating on running their stuff, which should pay off in the long term. The team seems to have no desire to really play with tempo unless the easy break is there. That seems to be more a coaching decision than a Troy thing.

(11-20-2014 05:15 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  Troy looks to be doing exactly what Mick wants him to do. He's facilitating the offense, taking care of the basketball and scoring when he needs to. I do agree with Eastside that I wish Troy would take more open jumpers, but I think he's concentrating on running their stuff, which should pay off in the long term. The team seems to have no desire to really play with tempo unless the easy break is there. That seems to be more a coaching decision than a Troy thing.

You know, after watching VCU against Toledo, I really think we could benefit from doing what they do offensively. They'll do a kind of stutter break, where if things are open when they come out of it, they'll go to the hoop, but if not, they set something up. It leaves opposing defenses less time to adjust while we're walking the ball up the court for 8 seconds trying to get a play from the sidelines.

(11-20-2014 04:23 PM)Eastside_J Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:39 PM)payday Wrote:  I know it's only one game and I'm trying to contain my enthusiasm, but I honestly can't remember any UC player who could shoot the 3 ball as well as Farad did last night. Maybe Logan. His shot was just so smooth and natural. The tempo and arc was just perfect. I think all but one of the 6 didn't touch the rim, and then barely even touched the net. Reminded me of Steve Kerr with AZ and the Bulls. I just don't think it was even "close" to a fluke night. Guess we'll see, but I think he's the real deal.

I would keep it a bit contained. Yes he is a seriously good shooter - but Morehead wasn't getting out to the wing to guard him. Why? I have no clue. But they weren't.

Teams are going to respect his ability and he isn't going to let him get as many of those perfect step-into-your-shot perimeter looks.

We have to engage our post guys in the offense, other than Ellis. And are in huge trouble if we get extremely limited production out of our small forwards.

Shaq Thomas passing up an open 12 footer to drive straight into defenders in the lane and try to force a contested 7 footer is asinine.

Troy passing up open shots all over the place. WHY?????

Good things are happening - things are improving. but there are some real issues as well.

Only been 2 games, but it seems clear teams will try the Rubles approach of baiting him to actually shoot a midrange shot rather than letting him get to the rim. It's probably a good strategy. We can only hope Shaq makes that shot enough this year to punish it.

(11-20-2014 05:31 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 05:15 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  Troy looks to be doing exactly what Mick wants him to do. He's facilitating the offense, taking care of the basketball and scoring when he needs to. I do agree with Eastside that I wish Troy would take more open jumpers, but I think he's concentrating on running their stuff, which should pay off in the long term. The team seems to have no desire to really play with tempo unless the easy break is there. That seems to be more a coaching decision than a Troy thing.

You know, after watching VCU against Toledo, I really think we could benefit from doing what they do offensively. They'll do a kind of stutter break, where if things are open when they come out of it, they'll go to the hoop, but if not, they set something up. It leaves opposing defenses less time to adjust while we're walking the ball up the court for 8 seconds trying to get a play from the sidelines.

I agree that a faster tempo might suit this year's personnel, but I actually have felt that way since Yancy left and it hasn't happened. Jackson ran the floor at least as well as Ellis does and we still walked it up. I'm not expecting us to change now.

(11-21-2014 10:07 AM)uccheese Wrote:  Jackson ran the floor at least as well as Ellis does and we still walked it up. I'm not expecting us to change now.

JJ was also foul prone with little depth behind him. Pushing the tempo and him getting in foul trouble would have put us in a real disadvantage. Until Moore and DeBerry are ready to play D1 defense we've got to keep Ellis and Clark on the floor. Mick also said Ellis was throwing up in game 1 because he's not used to having to guard people.

(11-20-2014 04:23 PM)Eastside_J Wrote:  

(11-20-2014 03:39 PM)payday Wrote:  I know it's only one game and I'm trying to contain my enthusiasm, but I honestly can't remember any UC player who could shoot the 3 ball as well as Farad did last night. Maybe Logan. His shot was just so smooth and natural. The tempo and arc was just perfect. I think all but one of the 6 didn't touch the rim, and then barely even touched the net. Reminded me of Steve Kerr with AZ and the Bulls. I just don't think it was even "close" to a fluke night. Guess we'll see, but I think he's the real deal.

I would keep it a bit contained. Yes he is a seriously good shooter - but Morehead wasn't getting out to the wing to guard him. Why? I have no clue. But they weren't.

Teams are going to respect his ability and he isn't going to let him get as many of those perfect step-into-your-shot perimeter looks.

I get that. But we've had 3 point shooters who have been covered before. And they've bricked so many looks when open. They'll get him open. We just haven't anyone with such a pure shot in so long. We'll see.