I apologize that this may not be "good form" for message boards, but there have been quite a few interesting threads & comments yesterday & today, so I wanted to add my 2 1/2 cents worth on the various topics in one place...

1. The game...I didn't think we would win, but I was pleasantly surprised at how competitive the Rockets were under the circumstances. I think the game was won/lost in the 1st half...keeping in mind that the final spread was 3 points...we got down to the 3 and ended up kicking a FG--net loss of likely 4 points...then, right before the half, we couldn't stop Northern and they kicked a FG. Second half, with the lead, NIU just needed to stay a step ahead, and they did.

2. Julian...don't want to pile on. Shame he got hurt. Tough situation to be in. Can't speak to how he did in practice, but given the results at Kent and last night, I agree with those who felt the game was just much fast for him. Given the guys returning & the fact that we always seem to sign a QB in each recruiting class (and have one lined up for next year), I would be very surprised if he takes many more snaps as a UT QB in his college career. Sometimes, the hype placed on guys is unfair.

3. Macon...having watched the 2nd half now on tape--man, did he play some ball last night. Perplexed that the coaches really believed that Julian was the better option. Macon takes snaps what, 1 practice each week? But he outplayed not only Julian but even Woodside (even a healthy Woodside, imo). I think it would be hard for any coaching staff to ignore that fact, and would expect that Macon starts the rest of the season, whether that's 2 games or more. Yes, BG will be better prepared for Macon--at least the Macon that played last night...can our coaching staff respond appropriately and throw some new wrinkles in? We'll see...

4. The MACC...need to win out--no small accomplishment at this point--and hope WMU beats Northern...which I think the Broncos will do. We haven't had that kind of "help" in recent seasons after losses to NIU. I think WMU is the best team in the MAC right now...that hurt just typing that...we were lucky they lost the game when we played them earlier, and they will likely be the favorite for the next couple seasons...Fleck will be moving upward & onward much faster than Campbell. But for now, we could still back into the MACC game.

5. Play Calling...I'm no huge Campbell fan as a HC...but I did appreciate his work as an OC. Campbell needs to take over the play calling the rest of the way. Our tendencies are becoming far too obvious in real time on the field (benefit of watching a game on tape).

6. Helmets/Uniforms...count me as a "traditionalist"...didn't like the helmets the last 2 games...at least the uniform colors have been respectable this season. We have a "Rocket" logo with "Toledo" on it. Nuff said.

7. Fan base...I think the majority of Rocket fans--certainly the "luke-warm" ones, but even many hard core--are growing more disillusioned with our inability to win more than one "big" game each season (BG). Talk of us being the "next Boise State" or even the next "Northern Illinois" really needs to stop...Coach K has the men's bball team so much closer to being a mid-major noisemaker than the football team is...maybe the University's resources should be re-allocated?

Thanks for your patience.

And one more thing...injuries. Yes, they are real, & they have clearly impacted the season. But this isn't that new. TO got injured each of his last 2 seasons...ditto Fluellen. My concern is that--especially if we lose to BG and/or EMU--these injuries become an "excuse" that "masks" some other problems with the program's ability to win the MAC, and then the steps that I think need to be taken won't get taken. Looking at last night's game, we could have won...even with a 4th string QB...there are other issues.

We would have wanted Enos gone four years ago if we swapped coaches, because CMU fans dont even complain about him as much as some of our fans do about Campbell. By the way we are undefeated against a lot of teams in our conference during Campbells tenure. Who wins conferences with a wr qb? Toledo will. I have faith. Some of you can watch us beat bg from home... I am too invested to call the season a wash after a 5-1 start in conference play despite the odds.

Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

(11-12-2014 07:57 PM)owen Wrote:  Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

To add onto that, how did the coaching staff watch these guys and have Ely and Woodside ahead of Macon?

(11-12-2014 07:57 PM)owen Wrote:  Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

Poignant?

3 years ago I would have been against this thought but at this point I'd honestly be totally fine with re allocating resources from football to basketball if we fielded a basketball team similar to cincy, Xavier, vcu, etc. And the cost was fielding a football team like emu.

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(11-12-2014 11:37 PM)Campbell4President Wrote:  3 years ago I would have been against this thought but at this point I'd honestly be totally fine with re allocating resources from football to basketball if we fielded a basketball team similar to cincy, Xavier, vcu, etc. And the cost was fielding a football team like emu.

As long as we are in the Big Dance every year, I'd be OK with that.

(11-12-2014 08:28 PM)FtLauderdaleRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 07:57 PM)owen Wrote:  Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

To add onto that, how did the coaching staff watch these guys and have Ely and Woodside ahead of Macon?

Because Macon wasn't a QB. Ely was clearly the #1 at the start of the season and Woodside was the backup. It's pretty evident that he was probably the best choice as he had you undefeated in MAC play. It likely made no sense to move your #3/#4 receiver to a second or third string quarterback position where he may never see the field all year. You have to maximize your strengths and Macon would have been wasted at QB if you remained injury free at the QB position.

Hindsight is 20/20 after all ya know!

Ding ding ding. You keep your playmakers on the field. Dwight didn't have the mechanics of our other QB's when he came to UT so the coaches moved him somewhere he could play. Honestly how many 5"10 QB's are out there? Macon is a threat at WR so he saw the field where he could.

[sidenote] Toledo has a lot of designed passes for the first down with no extra yards, such as curls where the WR falls after the catch is made. Dwight is one of our only WR's who turns up-field and pushes for an extra yard or two. I love him as a WR, even if he isn't targeted that often.

When $h!t hit the fan he found a new spot in our offense. Woodside is more capable than Macon when healthy. Sadly he wasn't... so in the short time Macon (who knows the playbook from another perspective) came in and picked it up quickly. It's not that Dwight is best QB on our team, it's that he is a different breed which NIU was not ready for. Even if they could have been, he is a breed that is tough to game plan because every play has a bailout run when no options are available. As to where a pocket passer/less athletic passer needs to do more checkdowns and throw the ball away apposed to tucking it for the possible first down run.

Dwight never felt forced to make a throw in traffic because he knew his legs could put the offense in a better position on the next play. He played CONFIDENT!!! That's a huge factor playing the QB position. Maybe a reason why Julian wasn't very effective.

(11-13-2014 08:46 AM)FtLauderdaleRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 11:37 PM)Campbell4President Wrote:  3 years ago I would have been against this thought but at this point I'd honestly be totally fine with re allocating resources from football to basketball if we fielded a basketball team similar to cincy, Xavier, vcu, etc. And the cost was fielding a football team like emu.

As long as we are in the Big Dance every year, I'd be OK with that.

I have always been a football first fan, but I am beginning to come around to your point of view primarily because of what Coach K has shown so far. Still Stan showed a lot early on too, but could never quite get over the hump. I think Coach K will get the program over the hump and then move on to greener pastures.

If UT had fielded a basketball team similar to Cincy back in the late 1990s-early 2000s, I strongly suspect that UT would likely have been invited to the Big East while it was still a major football conference and today would probably be in the AAC. Back in those days UT usually fielded a better football team than Cincy and also usually had more fans in the stands than Cincy.

Agreed.

(11-13-2014 10:56 AM)T-Town Wrote:  

(11-13-2014 08:46 AM)FtLauderdaleRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 11:37 PM)Campbell4President Wrote:  3 years ago I would have been against this thought but at this point I'd honestly be totally fine with re allocating resources from football to basketball if we fielded a basketball team similar to cincy, Xavier, vcu, etc. And the cost was fielding a football team like emu.

As long as we are in the Big Dance every year, I'd be OK with that.

I have always been a football first fan, but I am beginning to come around to your point of view primarily because of what Coach K has shown so far. Still Stan showed a lot early on too, but could never quite get over the hump. I think Coach K will get the program over the hump and then move on to greener pastures.

If UT had fielded a basketball team similar to Cincy back in the late 1990s-early 2000s, I strongly suspect that UT would likely have been invited to the Big East while it was still a major football conference and today would probably be in the AAC. Back in those days UT usually fielded a better football team than Cincy and also usually had more fans in the stands than Cincy.

(11-12-2014 08:28 PM)FtLauderdaleRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 07:57 PM)owen Wrote:  Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

To add onto that, how did the coaching staff watch these guys and have Ely and Woodside ahead of Macon?

I really think Ely would have blossomed if he hadn't gone down with the injury. Keep in mind, we were watching a kid who had not played a meaningful game since 2010...FL HS State Champ game. The kid can play...smart, good decision maker...heck of a competitor. He looked sharp vs UNH...saw the field well...spread the ball around and didn't focus on the primary target. Vs Mizzou, he definitely looked shaky, but he also had a DE in his face play after play. That DE was 3 steps behind the LOS before Nelson got out of his stance. He started to settle down and looked much better in the 2nd half...then went down with an ACL. I firmly believe the tone on this board would be much different had he remained healthy...look at the numbers our offense puts up with our 2nd through 4th QB options...we would be sick. Heard through the grapevine that Ely is rehabbing and expects to get a medical RS...meaning he'd have 2 years remaining. If so, I think we'll be ok the next 2 years as long as the oline comes together and protects him.

I know this topic has been touched on a few times, however, I really ponder how different this team would look right now if we had a true QB's coach out there. If Candle is calling the plays, who is coaching up our Quarterbacks during the game - food for thought.

QB's run off the field and go right to the phones. Most QB coaches are up in pressbox anyway. If down on field usually means they have less say.

Do QB's really talk to QB coaches during the game anyway? If you don't know the basics by game time, Lord help you!

Most times after the offensive series is over, all their time is spent with the OC.

(11-13-2014 10:44 AM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Ding ding ding. You keep your playmakers on the field. Dwight didn't have the mechanics of our other QB's when he came to UT so the coaches moved him somewhere he could play. Honestly how many 5"10 QB's are out there? Macon is a threat at WR so he saw the field where he could.

I don't think the point of the thread was not that Macon should have started the season ahead of Ely or Woodside. Although 1 person did suggest that.

But the point is that when pressed into playing a #3 to start, and with all week to decide, how did this staff determine Julien as out best chance to win ahead of Macon?
Julien is clearly too wet behind the ears and Macon knows the entire offense.

(11-13-2014 11:20 AM)TampaRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 08:28 PM)FtLauderdaleRocket Wrote:  

(11-12-2014 07:57 PM)owen Wrote:  Something very poignant buried in that post.

How did the coaching staff watch these guys and not see Macon ahead of Julien?

To add onto that, how did the coaching staff watch these guys and have Ely and Woodside ahead of Macon?

I really think Ely would have blossomed if he hadn't gone down with the injury. Keep in mind, we were watching a kid who had not played a meaningful game since 2010...FL HS State Champ game. The kid can play...smart, good decision maker...heck of a competitor. He looked sharp vs UNH...saw the field well...spread the ball around and didn't focus on the primary target. Vs Mizzou, he definitely looked shaky, but he also had a DE in his face play after play. That DE was 3 steps behind the LOS before Nelson got out of his stance. He started to settle down and looked much better in the 2nd half...then went down with an ACL. I firmly believe the tone on this board would be much different had he remained healthy...look at the numbers our offense puts up with our 2nd through 4th QB options...we would be sick. Heard through the grapevine that Ely is rehabbing and expects to get a medical RS...meaning he'd have 2 years remaining. If so, I think we'll be ok the next 2 years as long as the oline comes together and protects him.

I think we all would of liked to see what Ely was capable of.
He did look good against New Hampshire for what its worth.

(11-13-2014 05:16 PM)owen Wrote:  

(11-13-2014 10:44 AM)UofToledoFans Wrote:  Ding ding ding. You keep your playmakers on the field. Dwight didn't have the mechanics of our other QB's when he came to UT so the coaches moved him somewhere he could play. Honestly how many 5"10 QB's are out there? Macon is a threat at WR so he saw the field where he could.

I don't think the point of the thread was not that Macon should have started the season ahead of Ely or Woodside. Although 1 person did suggest that.

But the point is that when pressed into playing a #3 to start, and with all week to decide, how did this staff determine Julien as out best chance to win ahead of Macon?
Julien is clearly too wet behind the ears and Macon knows the entire offense.

Again, it likely depends on how much of a role Macon plays in the offense being the #3/#4 receiver. If you take him out of that situation, does it adversely effect the team in other areas?

We fans really just like to second guess most coaches just to second guess them. They see these guys in practice the whole year. They aren't in the business of putting the worse of two options out there.

(11-13-2014 05:19 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  They aren't in the business of putting the worse of two options out there.

These are always exceptions to the rules.... Or a lack of common sense.