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And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
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DrTorch Offline
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And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
10-17-2014 09:31 AM
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mlb Offline
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Post: #2
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
I'm curious if he read his personal contract at the beginning of the year. I am going to bet the language was in there that he would pay that fee and he missed it.

I'm not saying he is wrong, I'm just saying he may have to take some blame for not reading the fine print and pointing it out then.
10-17-2014 09:36 AM
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AngryAphid Offline
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Post: #3
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 09:36 AM)mlb Wrote:  I'm curious if he read his personal contract at the beginning of the year. I am going to bet the language was in there that he would pay that fee and he missed it.

I'm not saying he is wrong, I'm just saying he may have to take some blame for not reading the fine print and pointing it out then.

It’s possible that the contract that he signed is in conflict with current law…
or at least implied ambiguously through the “weasel words” used in the contract.
10-17-2014 09:52 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #4
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
Read some of those comments on the bottom. Very interesting. Unions have a chance. I like this one in particular.

CraigStace 40 minutes ago
I'm also a vet... much earlier, Cuba et al, early 1960's. I am a (retired) teacher and believe it is his right to not participate in union affairs. I DO NOT believe, however, that he should be excused from paying his share for the cost of the benefits he enjoys from union bargaining. Before you go ballistic, I have also been a corporation president and DBA owner with employees. I have been on both side of the union issue. And we all know that not all bosses, Superintendents, etc., treat their employees with respect and fairness. AND we also know that unions, and union bosses have abused their powers and influence. If I were to return to the work force today, I would definitely look for one with a strong union. The recent history of greed in the upper managements of manufacturers and employers is enough to necessitate the risk of unionism. There is an OLD adage that still often rings true, "Those who can, teach (work); those who can't become administrators and managers." We have lost basic fairness in the business world. Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work. And that only happens in unionized workplaces.
10-17-2014 09:53 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #5
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
That you guys can defend this leech who refuses to pay "his fair share" and still takes a union negotiated salary. It's crazy. It truly is.
10-17-2014 09:55 AM
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AngryAphid Offline
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Post: #6
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
It appears that “old adage” has gone through some evolving.
10-17-2014 09:55 AM
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mlb Offline
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Post: #7
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 09:55 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  That you guys can defend this leech who refuses to pay "his fair share" and still takes a union negotiated salary. It's crazy. It truly is.

I'm certainly of the opinion that if he doesn't want to be a part of the union, he doesn't get the same protections.
10-17-2014 09:59 AM
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AngryAphid Offline
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Post: #8
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
Its like paying a fee to the personal trainer at the gym of which you are no longer are a member.

I mean, that trainer was the guy that properly taught you how to do squats.
Just because you now work out at home doesn’t mean you shouldn’t pay your fair share.
10-17-2014 10:05 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #9
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
but you are still using the equipment at the gym. You're not working out at home.
10-17-2014 10:07 AM
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DaSaintFan Offline
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Post: #10
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 09:55 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  That you guys can defend this leech who refuses to pay "his fair share" and still takes a union negotiated salary. It's crazy. It truly is.

If the guy isn't part of the union, the school district is (IMO) under no obligation to pay him at the rate the salary the union demands. Unless they hire him at that rate, because he's worth that rate.

If he's worth that rate, then it has nothing to do with the Union-enforced pay rate, and has to do with his ability. If he's not, then pay him less...
(This post was last modified: 10-17-2014 10:09 AM by DaSaintFan.)
10-17-2014 10:09 AM
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DrTorch Offline
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Post: #11
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 09:53 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Read some of those comments on the bottom. Very interesting. Unions have a chance. I like this one in particular.

CraigStace 40 minutes ago
I'm also a vet... much earlier, Cuba et al, early 1960's. I am a (retired) teacher and believe it is his right to not participate in union affairs. I DO NOT believe, however, that he should be excused from paying his share for the cost of the benefits he enjoys from union bargaining. Before you go ballistic, I have also been a corporation president and DBA owner with employees. I have been on both side of the union issue. And we all know that not all bosses, Superintendents, etc., treat their employees with respect and fairness. AND we also know that unions, and union bosses have abused their powers and influence. If I were to return to the work force today, I would definitely look for one with a strong union. The recent history of greed in the upper managements of manufacturers and employers is enough to necessitate the risk of unionism. There is an OLD adage that still often rings true, "Those who can, teach (work); those who can't become administrators and managers." We have lost basic fairness in the business world. Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work. And that only happens in unionized workplaces.

So this guy is happy to spend someone else's money.

Oh, and this part "Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work." is a known lie. So you say you like this liar in particular.
10-17-2014 10:12 AM
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AngryAphid Offline
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Post: #12
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 10:07 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  but you are still using the equipment at the gym. You're not working out at home.

Perhaps I should use a much simpler analogy.

A neighborhood kid offers to mow your lawn for $20 bucks. It’s a good deal so you accept.

Later that month the man down the street demands you to pay him a fee,
since it was he that negotiated neighborhood kid down to the $20 rate.
10-17-2014 10:16 AM
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QuestionSocratic Offline
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Post: #13
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
Quote:Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work.

Another misinformed individual.

Quote:Since 1963 it has been unlawful under the federal Equal Pay Act for an employer to pay a female employee less than a male employee for equal work. Sex discrimination in wages is also prohibited by Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. For employees of federal contractors and subcontractors, Executive Order 11,246 prohibits gender-based pay discrimination.

The Mythical Pay Equity "Crisis"
(This post was last modified: 10-17-2014 10:22 AM by QuestionSocratic.)
10-17-2014 10:21 AM
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QuestionSocratic Offline
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Post: #14
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
Again teachers unions show their true stripes:

Quote:Philadelphia School Failure
Tom Corbett tried to accommodate unions. Here’s his reward.


Philadelphia public schools are in turmoil, and the reason reflects the other-worldliness of modern public unions. They don’t want to pay so much as a dime for health insurance.

Last week the Philadelphia School Reform Commission mandated that teachers chip in between 5% to 13% toward health-care premiums on a sliding scale based on salary. Teachers will pay each month an average of $49 for single coverage and $139 for a family. Government workers on average cover 15% of their premiums while private workers pay about 25%.

The teachers union calls this “union-busting.” Yet the commission, which runs the Philly schools and includes three Democrats and two Republicans, unanimously backed the cost-sharing as a last resort when unions failed to negotiate a new contract.

The district has borrowed $300 million and cut 5,000 jobs over two years. Gov. Tom Corbett and the GOP legislature bailed out Philadelphia schools this year by authorizing a citywide $2 cigarette tax and one-percentage-point sales tax extension, which are projected to avert 1,300 more layoffs.

The district still faces an $8 million deficit this school year and $70 million in the next. Shrinking student enrollment and soaring labor costs are mainly to blame, as enrollment at traditional schools has declined by about a quarter since 2000 while quadrupling at charters. The district has effectively banned charter expansion.

Teachers on average earn about $71,000, which is more than twice the median household income in Philadelphia. Total compensation with benefits tops $110,000. The district’s pension costs have ballooned by $100 million in five years and will increase by $35 million more next year. Payments to the union’s Health and Welfare Fund, which administers prescription, dental, vision and retiree medical benefits, have grown by more than a third since 2004. The fund is sitting on $45 million in cash.

Since their contract expired in August 2013, the teachers’ union has refused to bargain in good faith. The union offered a mere $2 million in concessions from its 11,000 members while the district’s 400 principals agreed to $25 million in salary and benefit cuts. So the commission used its legal authority to cancel the prior collective-bargaining agreement and impose new terms. Meanwhile, only about 40% of students are proficient in reading, and student test scores have slipped in the last two years.

The union is hoping to wait out the commission until the November election when they hope to replace Mr. Corbett with Democrat Tom Wolf, who has endorsed a tax on natural-gas fracking and a progressive income tax. Mr. Corbett is getting whipsawed for cutting education, yet state spending on schools has increased by nearly $1.5 billion since 2010. The trouble is that teacher pension costs have risen by nearly $2 billion over the same period.

Mr. Corbett failed to take advantage of a GOP legislature to press school reforms, and the unions oppose him anyway. He backpedaled on his ultimatum last year requiring Philadelphia teachers to accept reduced benefits in return for state aid. This year he reneged on a pledge not to sign the budget if the legislature didn’t also pass pension reforms.

The lesson is that there’s no reward for restraint on education reform, so political leaders might as well do something worthwhile.

Full link you won't get cause you're too cheap to pay

But it's for the kids.
(This post was last modified: 10-17-2014 10:30 AM by QuestionSocratic.)
10-17-2014 10:28 AM
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blah Offline
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Post: #15
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-17-2014 09:53 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Read some of those comments on the bottom. Very interesting. Unions have a chance. I like this one in particular.

CraigStace 40 minutes ago
I'm also a vet... much earlier, Cuba et al, early 1960's. I am a (retired) teacher and believe it is his right to not participate in union affairs. I DO NOT believe, however, that he should be excused from paying his share for the cost of the benefits he enjoys from union bargaining. Before you go ballistic, I have also been a corporation president and DBA owner with employees. I have been on both side of the union issue. And we all know that not all bosses, Superintendents, etc., treat their employees with respect and fairness. AND we also know that unions, and union bosses have abused their powers and influence. If I were to return to the work force today, I would definitely look for one with a strong union. The recent history of greed in the upper managements of manufacturers and employers is enough to necessitate the risk of unionism. There is an OLD adage that still often rings true, "Those who can, teach (work); those who can't become administrators and managers." We have lost basic fairness in the business world. Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work. And that only happens in unionized workplaces.

The adage is "Those who can "do", those who can't "teach".

I can see why you like this guy. He clearly does not know what he is talking about.
10-19-2014 09:58 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #16
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
Never heard that one Blah. Darn you are smart. Thanks for the update.
10-19-2014 10:12 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #17
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-19-2014 10:12 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Never heard that one Blah. Darn you are smart. Thanks for the update.

Turning a new leaf.

1-0
10-19-2014 10:13 AM
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Post: #18
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-19-2014 10:13 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  
(10-19-2014 10:12 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Never heard that one Blah. Darn you are smart. Thanks for the update.

Turning a new leaf.

1-0

Too late.

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10-19-2014 12:05 PM
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JMUDunk Offline
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Post: #19
RE: And teachers' unions continue to steal in MI
(10-19-2014 09:58 AM)blah Wrote:  
(10-17-2014 09:53 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Read some of those comments on the bottom. Very interesting. Unions have a chance. I like this one in particular.

CraigStace 40 minutes ago
I'm also a vet... much earlier, Cuba et al, early 1960's. I am a (retired) teacher and believe it is his right to not participate in union affairs. I DO NOT believe, however, that he should be excused from paying his share for the cost of the benefits he enjoys from union bargaining. Before you go ballistic, I have also been a corporation president and DBA owner with employees. I have been on both side of the union issue. And we all know that not all bosses, Superintendents, etc., treat their employees with respect and fairness. AND we also know that unions, and union bosses have abused their powers and influence. If I were to return to the work force today, I would definitely look for one with a strong union. The recent history of greed in the upper managements of manufacturers and employers is enough to necessitate the risk of unionism. There is an OLD adage that still often rings true, "Those who can, teach (work); those who can't become administrators and managers." We have lost basic fairness in the business world. Otherwise women would be paid equally for equal work. And that only happens in unionized workplaces.

The adage is "Those who can "do", those who can't "teach".

I can see why you like this guy. He clearly does not know what he is talking about.

Yea, this guy is pretty adept at "bending" things to make it whatever he likes. Those who can, do, those who can't... well there ya go...

And as already pointed out, in fact in many cases the gals are paid more for equal work. So, this guy does nothing more than regurgitate another lazy, fallacious claim trotted out there by the left for the ignorant masses to gobble up and puke out at their cocktail parties and poetry readings.
10-19-2014 12:16 PM
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