(10-22-2014 07:05 AM)shampoo Wrote:  This is a one year agreement - I would reserve judgment until the season is over and a long term deal is or isn't outlined. Tenancy - ETSU basketball will have 17 events at FH over a 3-4 month period. Doesn't exactly dominate the calendar. I personally abhor the thought of playing at Milligan...FH is on a high school campus, yes, but it is a civic center not a high school arena. Football at KT stadium already disappoints me strongly.

FH currently has only 6 events on the calendar in the next 5 months, very poor fixed asset utilization. ETSU tripled the facility usage with only basketball, maybe we disagree but I would call that dominating an idle calendar. ETSU could have and would have planned more events at FH (there is an ETSU event there this coming Sunday). I don't see the incentive to do so now.

I suggest Milligan because, except for Brooks, there are no other alternatives...if the Dome is to be used as an indoor practice facility for multiple sports.

Rock meet hard place.

Terms of agreement now available online at link above. FH to provide concessions and Pepsi to be sold. Guess I'll be carrying my competing beverage product with me...or dehydration will be the norm :)

(10-22-2014 07:05 AM)shampoo Wrote:  This is a one year agreement - I would reserve judgment until the season is over and a long term deal is or isn't outlined. Tenancy - ETSU basketball will have 17 events at FH over a 3-4 month period. Doesn't exactly dominate the calendar. I personally abhor the thought of playing at Milligan...FH is on a high school campus, yes, but it is a civic center not a high school arena. Football at KT stadium already disappoints me strongly.

Yes.. but..... it's great to have FOOTBALL to be disappointed by??????

(10-22-2014 10:03 AM)bucfan1968 Wrote:  

(10-22-2014 07:05 AM)shampoo Wrote:  This is a one year agreement - I would reserve judgment until the season is over and a long term deal is or isn't outlined. Tenancy - ETSU basketball will have 17 events at FH over a 3-4 month period. Doesn't exactly dominate the calendar. I personally abhor the thought of playing at Milligan...FH is on a high school campus, yes, but it is a civic center not a high school arena. Football at KT stadium already disappoints me strongly.

Yes.. but..... it's great to have FOOTBALL to be disappointed by??????

Assumption does not follow the statement. More appropriate to my own reasoning, KT stadium is simply a fact of the expedited return of football and a stronger demand not to play indoors at the dome. I can still be disappointed about using a true high school facility for football. Now, apply that to basketball - FH is another reality of expedited football. But at least it will be used by a college team only, as far as basketball. I do respect BucDoctor's concerns about it, but we do not have this year's "data" for a full evaluation. And we shouldn't assume this year's agreement is the longterm vision of either side, town or gown. I'll reserve judgment.

(10-22-2014 07:15 AM)BucDoctor Wrote:  

(10-22-2014 07:05 AM)shampoo Wrote:  This is a one year agreement - I would reserve judgment until the season is over and a long term deal is or isn't outlined. Tenancy - ETSU basketball will have 17 events at FH over a 3-4 month period. Doesn't exactly dominate the calendar. I personally abhor the thought of playing at Milligan...FH is on a high school campus, yes, but it is a civic center not a high school arena. Football at KT stadium already disappoints me strongly.

FH currently has only 6 events on the calendar in the next 5 months, very poor fixed asset utilization. ETSU tripled the facility usage with only basketball, maybe we disagree but I would call that dominating an idle calendar. ETSU could have and would have planned more events at FH (there is an ETSU event there this coming Sunday). I don't see the incentive to do so now.

I suggest Milligan because, except for Brooks, there are no other alternatives...if the Dome is to be used as an indoor practice facility for multiple sports.

Rock meet hard place.

They only have six because the people who run Freedom Hall are lazy as $#!T and are perfectly content with the bare minimum.
On the subject, let's wait and see how this plays out. It's our court, sounds like according to the article OUR SCOREBOARDS, and our sound system. It's easy to attack it, but let's how this works on a one year trial run with our equipment in there. Perhaps it works nice, and from there they can work towards a more permanent solution, whether it be working together to build a new facility (which should happen), or giving Freedom Hall enough of a facelift that it can be serviceable for another 10-15 years (likely).

Thank you, Buccanneerlover.

BucDoctor, that was a fair rebuttal about calendar domination. My only response is that our events - mostly limited to basketball - at present only fill 1/3 of the calendar year. The rest of the year it's the city's, apparently with the school district paying utilities. The school is the primary tenant, the city owns it, and ETSU is a third-party timesharing this facility in the first year, at least. Give it this year with me, and I'll be right there with you in the future demanding serious updates, amenities, and a shift in primary tenancy if they want to make it 5-15 years.

Side note: I'll be attending the Jim Gaffigan comedy performance at FH this Sunday. I expect it to be better than if it was done at the dome, but we'll see.

(10-22-2014 01:41 PM)shampoo Wrote:  Thank you, Buccanneerlover.

BucDoctor, that was a fair rebuttal about calendar domination. My only response is that our events - mostly limited to basketball - at present only fill 1/3 of the calendar year. The rest of the year it's the city's, apparently with the school district paying utilities. The school is the primary tenant, the city owns it, and ETSU is a third-party timesharing this facility in the first year, at least. Give it this year with me, and I'll be right there with you in the future demanding serious updates, amenities, and a shift in primary tenancy if they want to make it 5-15 years.

Side note: I'll be attending the Jim Gaffigan comedy performance at FH this Sunday. I expect it to be better than if it was done at the dome, but we'll see.

Hypothetically, without prime tenantship, anyone could bump a weekend ETSU planned an event. The contract is for basketball only and limited to the games listed in the addendum. What happens if ETSU is to host a post season game (not so hypothetical)? Unless I missed something, it appears that would be open for negotiation, and without prime tenantship, the event could not happen because of a cow pokes convention. Not a great contract as I see it. Just my opinion, prime tenantship was critical to a true partnership.

There is no formal partnership, yet, that's where you're hung up. This is a single year contract in which ETSU will be renting FH. Seeing the city taking on the lighting rig right now is enough for me. Seats, etc. seem likely next, if a long term contract is indeed sought. And at that point, then I expect the city and university to start demonstrating a true partnership.

If ETSU pays for the seating in the future, the city needs to let us have them blue and gold. We need to really brand that place ETSU.

(10-22-2014 05:31 PM)etsubuc Wrote:  If ETSU pays for the seating in the future, the city needs to let us have them blue and gold. We need to really brand that place ETSU.

Is FH used for any kind of high school sports?

(10-22-2014 05:07 PM)shampoo Wrote:  There is no formal partnership, yet, that's where you're hung up. This is a single year contract in which ETSU will be renting FH. Seeing the city taking on the lighting rig right now is enough for me. Seats, etc. seem likely next, if a long term contract is indeed sought. And at that point, then I expect the city and university to start demonstrating a true partnership.

So with ETSU without a plan B, what is the incentive for the City to partner?

That is where I am hung up, I'll be surprised if next year's contract is any different from this year's contract-except it will cost more because the school board will say that costs weren't covered.

Did you read the details of the contract language? Weak in my opinion and at one time in my career I negotiated contracts for a living.

(10-22-2014 06:31 PM)Buc66 Wrote:  

(10-22-2014 05:31 PM)etsubuc Wrote:  If ETSU pays for the seating in the future, the city needs to let us have them blue and gold. We need to really brand that place ETSU.

Is FH used for any kind of high school sports?

Science Hill and another local team (D-B or Tennessee High) have had Round Ball in the Hall where they play two teams from out town and then swap the next night (so 4 games) sometimes but that is about it. Science Hill now has two gyms (a new one and the old one) they don't need Freedom Hall.

Even if they did have occasional high school games in the facility, the seats can should still be blue and gold if ETSU pays for it. If the city pays for the seats they can make them any color they want. But there is no negative that I see to making it blue and gold as much as possible- it will be good branding for ETSU for years to come including the other community events at freedom hall

(10-22-2014 07:25 PM)BucDoctor Wrote:  

(10-22-2014 05:07 PM)shampoo Wrote:  There is no formal partnership, yet, that's where you're hung up. This is a single year contract in which ETSU will be renting FH. Seeing the city taking on the lighting rig right now is enough for me. Seats, etc. seem likely next, if a long term contract is indeed sought. And at that point, then I expect the city and university to start demonstrating a true partnership.

So with ETSU without a plan B, what is the incentive for the City to partner?

That is where I am hung up, I'll be surprised if next year's contract is any different from this year's contract-except it will cost more because the school board will say that costs weren't covered.

Did you read the details of the contract language? Weak in my opinion and at one time in my career I negotiated contracts for a living.

At the end of the day, when all is said and done, if it goes south and Freedom Hall is a disaster, they can make the dome work. It's not ideal, but the reality is the seats are still in there, stowed away like Christmas decorations, waiting to be used again or repurposed.
I doubt it goes that way, hopefully the city will see the benefit of having a true partnership with ETSU, at which time they cut the middle man (the school board) completely out and BUILD a new place. The reality is it's just time, the buildings from the 70's are outdated everywhere and being cycled out. Either with sin taxes, entertainment taxes, whatever it takes to pay for it. It's time to get it done.

They need to do black seats like they did with the remodel of Thompson Boling.. it looks classy.. and with black seats instead of orange and the lighting focused down low over the court.. empty seats don't stand out on TV...

Navy blue works just fine. Turn on the Predators hockey game and see how the few empties show up. When the team wore blue you didn't see empty chairs at all.