(09-22-2014 06:52 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 06:50 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 06:48 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 06:43 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 06:38 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  And what defintion is that?

I don't recall defining anything but give it a try.

If you want to consider Vandy and Illinois big boys then knock yourself out.

Its just a double standard to me. Its a moving grading scale and not really fair. You essentially are using "big boy" to refer to a team a g5 school cannot beat. But when a g5 schools beats a "big boy" , they are no longer big boys, and thus you can never beat a big boy. Its an incestuous grading scale.

You're assuming because I don't consider bottom feeders, (Iowa admittingly better), in a conference that you continuously trash as a big boy that I only consider 5 teams in the nation to be worthy of a big boy label.

I honestly cannot see how a person jumps to that conclusion from my post.

"Wait..He doesn't consider Purdue a big boy? I guess only Florida St and Alabama are big boys then."

Its impossible to take down a big boy if beating a big boy makes them never a big boy to begin with. Its just like chasing the end of a rainbow.

That has nothing to do about your made up definition of something I didn't say, but alright.

Its nothing personal against you, I am just illustrating a broader perspective. If NIU beat Arkansas would Arkansas be considered a one of the big boys, no. I was just highlighting its a no-win situation for the smaller schools

I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

(09-22-2014 07:38 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

Quote:There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU

Last year SI I believe had NIU at #24 or something starting out the year, and they had a decent amount of votes to kick things off. NIU had a not-tough schedule last year and made rankings just fine and was on cruise control to another BCS game at the end of the regular season, which is 2/3rds based on rankings.

I think losing to BGSU who lost their bowl, and also losing to Utah State in their own bowl + losing Heisman Candidate Lynch + losing 1st-rounder Ward --> THAT is the reason they started out the season with no expectations or votes.

Quote:ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

I agree, they are the "hot thing" in the mid-major spectrum. Add to that, Marshall if they continue undefeated, and look out -- both those combined are going to take the limelight. Also, look at Boise with 1 loss to an SEC team (like NIU) -- those two will be in the shadows for a while unless one of those screws up.

BUT, ECU I think has a tougher schedule, but they don't have a Champ Game.

They have to play @Cinci and UCF... while UCF was supposed to be Good, but they unfortunately aren't so much (yet? almost took out Penn State tho). Throw in an improved, challenging @Temple team (have a taste of the MAC, guys) -- and I think ECU can lose it's luster. It's not crazy/wild for a mid-major to kick things off well and take a hit later (see NIU vs BGSU last year; or UCF almost blowing it against Temple last year, needing a wild catch to make a win).

IMO, anything can happen. If NIU goes 13-1 (with bowl victory) -- but not going to Access bowl, you can only be gleeful as hell. Going 12-1 leading up to that is TOUGHER, IMO, than Marshall/ECU/Boise opening up a hole for NIU to jump in. Because in college football, it's tough for anyone!

(09-22-2014 08:07 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 07:38 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done. UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football. You're not going to get credit for beating teams that are around 80 best in the nation, regardless of conference. A Ball St win is just as good as either of those games. I'm not going to call either of those teams big boys when most teams in the nation would beat them. How are you a big boy when most of the nation would beat you?

Just this past week Big Bad Purdue was 1.5 favorites at home vs. Southern Illinois. Don't let the Big 10 label hypnotize you into thinking either of those teams have any real talent. I doubt either of those teams finish Top 5 in the MAC.

(09-22-2014 08:40 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:07 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 07:38 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done. UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football. You're not going to get credit for beating teams that are around 80 best in the nation, regardless of conference. A Ball St win is just as good as either of those games. I'm not going to call either of those teams big boys when most teams in the nation would beat them. How are you a big boy when most of the nation would beat you?

Just this past week Big Bad Purdue was 1.5 favorites at home vs. Southern Illinois. Don't let the Big 10 label hypnotize you into thinking either of those teams have any real talent. I doubt either of those teams finish Top 5 in the MAC.

I just think its funny all of a sudden now the Big 10 is bad, after NIU beat the Big 10.

(09-22-2014 08:45 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:40 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:07 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 07:38 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done. UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football. You're not going to get credit for beating teams that are around 80 best in the nation, regardless of conference. A Ball St win is just as good as either of those games. I'm not going to call either of those teams big boys when most teams in the nation would beat them. How are you a big boy when most of the nation would beat you?

Just this past week Big Bad Purdue was 1.5 favorites at home vs. Southern Illinois. Don't let the Big 10 label hypnotize you into thinking either of those teams have any real talent. I doubt either of those teams finish Top 5 in the MAC.

I just think its funny all of a sudden now the Big 10 is bad, after NIU beat the Big 10.

So you think the Big 10 is good?

Because I can pull up a lot of posts where you say they're not.

(09-22-2014 08:46 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:45 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:40 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:07 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 07:38 PM)toddjnsn Wrote:  I've said this a few times on the boards here...

They would have said the same thing 2 years ago when NIU lost to a mediocre Iowa team in Soldier Field. Being blown out @Arkansas? Okay. But as long as Arkansas is seen as a "quality loss opponent" and it being @Ark, it's not over yet if Marshall loses 1 (knocks them out), Boise loses 1 (gives them 2 losses), and ECU loses another one and seems a bit flat in other wins while not being able to play an extra challenging game of a conference championship -- yes, the committee will have to strongly consider NIU @ 12-1. Especially if Boise's loss is in the MWC game, where they'd be disqualified. At that point, sure, ECU very well may fairly win out @ 10-2 over 12-1 NIU -- but not without consideration. And depending on how both play out the rest of the season -- it could very well be fair to pick the 12-1 NIU. If ECU loses to Houston (who was supposed to be good but not), barely gets by Temple on a lucky play (see UCF last year), and loses to Cinci by 14 -- while NIU torches Toledo & BGSU in the title game while winning by 2TD+ with a few complete stomps -- look out. The committee WILL be sweating.

So for the time being and for a while -- yes, NIU is out of consideration. But then again, it's not until the end of the conf championship season that the committee even considers ANYONE anyway.

There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done. UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football. You're not going to get credit for beating teams that are around 80 best in the nation, regardless of conference. A Ball St win is just as good as either of those games. I'm not going to call either of those teams big boys when most teams in the nation would beat them. How are you a big boy when most of the nation would beat you?

Just this past week Big Bad Purdue was 1.5 favorites at home vs. Southern Illinois. Don't let the Big 10 label hypnotize you into thinking either of those teams have any real talent. I doubt either of those teams finish Top 5 in the MAC.

I just think its funny all of a sudden now the Big 10 is bad, after NIU beat the Big 10.

So you think the Big 10 is good?

Because I can pull up a lot of posts where you say they're not.

Yes but by that same thinking Va Tech got its rep for beating a really bad Ohio State team, and as we saw Va Tech was not that good. I have never thought the Big 10 was good, I just like how convenient it is for others to discredit what NIU has done. Its a no-win situation for teams like NIU, you beat someone you are not supposed to, its because they sucked. If you don't, its because you suck. Its just really frustrating.

(09-22-2014 08:54 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:46 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:45 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:40 PM)PrideinthePack Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 08:07 PM)MaddDawgz02 Wrote:  There is a problem with the Huskies, for some reason national pudits/pollsters feel that NIU was given their chance with FSU, and this Arkansas loss will reinforce that. Its completely idiotic way of thinking, but it wont allow NIU any upward mobility. Simplistic, stupid thinking but a reality. ECU is the new "hot thing", ECU plays absolutely no one down the stretch, as easy of a schedule as NIU essentially.

ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done. UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football. You're not going to get credit for beating teams that are around 80 best in the nation, regardless of conference. A Ball St win is just as good as either of those games. I'm not going to call either of those teams big boys when most teams in the nation would beat them. How are you a big boy when most of the nation would beat you?

Just this past week Big Bad Purdue was 1.5 favorites at home vs. Southern Illinois. Don't let the Big 10 label hypnotize you into thinking either of those teams have any real talent. I doubt either of those teams finish Top 5 in the MAC.

I just think its funny all of a sudden now the Big 10 is bad, after NIU beat the Big 10.

So you think the Big 10 is good?

Because I can pull up a lot of posts where you say they're not.

Yes but by that same thinking Va Tech got its rep for beating a really bad Ohio State team, and as we saw Va Tech was not that good. I have never thought the Big 10 was good, I just like how convenient it is for others to discredit what NIU has done. Its a no-win situation for teams like NIU, you beat someone you are not supposed to, its because they sucked. If you don't, its because you suck. Its just really frustrating.

If Virginia Tech is "not very good" could you describe Purdue for me.

If we're going to play Monday Morning Quarterback, Alabama, one of NIU's program defining wins was against a team that was not very good.

Edit ... "Not that good"

Quote:ECU's win at VTech is better than anything NIU has done.

VTech already has 2 losses so far, though. And if WMU, with the strength of a thousand field mice, somehow beat VaTech this weekend -- okay, dream -- but you should root for WMU to knock 'em out if it's close at all mid-way in the game. That would take a TON of wind out of ECU's sails. But again, VaTech losing to Georgia Tech -- the ACC's version of a polished Navy. VaTech is going to be 8-4 at best. They started far from being ranked for a reason.

Quote:UNC also compares nicely to anything NIU has done in recent years.

UNC is always overrated in the ACC -- they never live up to their hype. 70 points given up against ECU? Really? Sounds like what EMU would give up to someone. Again, not really. UNC fell out of the give-them-a-favor rankings before the game. Beating UNC doesn't compare to beating Iowa last year, the surprise B10 team.

Quote:Purdue/Northwestern are two of the worst Power 5 teams in football.

Maybe NW. I think Purdue's improved(ing). Relatively close against ND. There are some real bad P5 teams out there. Wake Forrest, Vandy, Colorado (last two almost knocked off by UMass -- come on).

I agree somewhat of your assessment -- but I firmly believe you're stretching it. It's not so bleak.

How many times has everyone talked about how good/bad particular teams are 4 weeks in when some teams have played only 3 or 4 games --- yet, near season's end it's VERY DIFFERENT? :)

Who thought, after Kent State got Crushed by Kentucky that they'd be ranked and in the running for the MACC and possible Orange Bowl, just 2 years ago? LOL

That's what makes college football great. Row the boat.

You have to also take into account what the win meant at the moment. At the moment it was a very big win for ECU.

Like the NIU/Alabama example. It was a huge win for NIU. The fact that Bama won 4 games that season doesn't completely diminish what the win meant at the time it happened.