UCF seems to be a popular school in realignment discussions and why not? They won the Fiesta Bowl and fill their campus stadium. USF is often mentioned along with UCF because of the rivalry, travel partner and TV market aspects.

Under Jim Leavitt, USF actually broke on the national scene before UCF did. USF beat Florida St, Miami, West Virginia, Auburn, Clemson, UNC, NC St, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, etc. They once enjoyed a big advantage over UCF.

Saturday, 1-0 USF drew 18,101 butts in seats for Big 10 Maryland. The local interest in the USF program appears to be at an all-time low. USF continues to play off campus at an NFL Stadium.

What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

(09-08-2014 01:09 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  UCF seems to be a popular school in realignment discussions and why not? They won the Fiesta Bowl and fill their campus stadium. USF is often mentioned along with UCF because of the rivalry, travel partner and TV market aspects.

Under Jim Leavitt, USF actually broke on the national scene before UCF did. USF beat Florida St, Miami, West Virginia, Auburn, Clemson, UNC, NC St, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, etc. They once enjoyed a big advantage over UCF.

Saturday, 1-0 USF drew 18,101 butts in seats for Big 10 Maryland. The local interest in the USF program appears to be at an all-time low. USF continues to play off campus at an NFL Stadium.

What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

Conventional wisdom seems to pair USF and UCF as candidates to move up to the P5 together. That's probably because UCF would be as big a geographic outlier in the Big 12 as West Virginia is if they went alone. Now I think that if somebody wants UCF in the next few years, they won't be interested in USF.

(09-08-2014 01:09 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  UCF seems to be a popular school in realignment discussions and why not? They won the Fiesta Bowl and fill their campus stadium. USF is often mentioned along with UCF because of the rivalry, travel partner and TV market aspects.

Under Jim Leavitt, USF actually broke on the national scene before UCF did. USF beat Florida St, Miami, West Virginia, Auburn, Clemson, UNC, NC St, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, etc. They once enjoyed a big advantage over UCF.

Saturday, 1-0 USF drew 18,101 butts in seats for Big 10 Maryland. The local interest in the USF program appears to be at an all-time low. USF continues to play off campus at an NFL Stadium.

What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

Raymond James Stadium is only 10 miles from USF. Real Estate is a premium in that area.

There are a couple of Golf Courses and State Park just northeast of campus. I don't thing that will be an option.

The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

This may be the case right this second, but P5 doesn't look like they're expanding now. When the P5 does expand, it's very possible that other schools have stepped up and are a lot more viable than they appear right this second. Especially since some schools are in a lot stronger position now than they were 2 years ago.

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

What claim would BYU and UConn have to any P5 membership? They aren't P5 members. BYU was just rebuffed by the ACC and SEC for consideration as fulfilling each conference's "power school" scheduling requirement. Neither is under any serious consideration for an invitation, so how can either "claim" P5 membership?

That said, USF, like any school hoping to gain access to the club, needs to increase their fan support and academic standing, reduce the reliance on institutional subsidies, and honestly, partner with UCF to be a combo. The two schools together are a better addition than either separately.

(09-08-2014 02:04 PM)CommuterBob Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

What claim would BYU and UConn have to any P5 membership? They aren't P5 members. BYU was just rebuffed by the ACC and SEC for consideration as fulfilling each conference's "power school" scheduling requirement. Neither is under any serious consideration for an invitation, so how can either "claim" P5 membership?

That said, USF, like any school hoping to gain access to the club, needs to increase their fan support and academic standing, reduce the reliance on institutional subsidies, and honestly, partner with UCF to be a combo. The two schools together are a better addition than either separately.

Only if they agree to split one conference distribution share between them.

(09-08-2014 01:09 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

Minimal...it was honestly a head scratcher when they were called up by the Big East.

For starters, they need to get an on-campus stadium and change the USFL looking uni's.

If Tulane can make an on-campus stadium work where it is located (blocks off of St. Charles Ave..), I'm sure USF can figure it out. If not, they are not serious about moving up....and it is what it is. If you really want student interest, you can't play at a stadium 10 miles away. UCF finally invested in an on-campus stadium, and look at the difference.

Until the P5 is interested in going to 16 teams or more across the board...USF will be in the AAC. The AAC will need to stay the premier G5 conference...and fight for inclusion with the cartel.

1) On Campus Stadium/Attendance.

Off campus kills atmosphere and attendance for all but the biggest of big games and thats not what the P5 want. The B1G sucks all kind of hind tit but keeps getting love and attention because they still get huge attendance and TV numbers to watch them do so. Start averaging 50K fans to see you play Tulsa or F_U and people will take notice.

2) Academics

As Frank is fond of reminding us, university presidents make these decisions and so academics are a factor (importance varies by how stable the conference you want to join is). Right now by USNW rankings (yes, all rankings are flawed one way or another but for better or worse this is the big one everyone judges by) #170 USF would be the worst school in both the ACC and SEC (by 20 places) and would be tied for worst in the B12 with #170 WVU.

3) Win

Win big in everything you can but especially football. Winning gets you in the conversation you might otherwise not be in (see Louisville). Winning gives you claim to your market and a TV share that will get you noticed. Winning spreads your brand and puts you in the spotlight. You can get in without it, but not if you are lacking in other places.

Wait.

When the GORs expire common wisdom says that at least some realignment is going to happen. USF and UCF right now are newbies in the big boy football club and their lack of history hurts them. They will certainly be looked at if the Big 12 wants to get back to 12 or even 14 with Cincy/BYU and give WVU some eastern partners. Not saying it is going to happen but they will be considered. 10 years from now, these two schools will have more history, and hopefully more big wins under their belt to convince people they are big time. I would say an on campus stadium is huge but not a deal breaker if the school wins alot, has alot of support, and maybe shows that they want to improve academics too, as these markets are a big deal.

On the other hand if WVU manages to get to the ACC then Big 12 may look west - Boise, SDSU, Fresno, and BYU could be a good combination or take New Mexico/Colorado State.

However, according to the most theories that I have scene that include the breakup of the Big 12 and/or ACC, USF/UCF could wind up in the ACC as backfiller for Miami (Big 10) and Florida State (SEC). Just a theory.

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

I thought football was driving the bus for expansion/realignment, apparently you have been watching a different UConn team play football than I have.

USF will remain a part of the AAC as that conference becomes the premier Mid Major conference of the future. Right now it is debatable as to whether the AAC truly is. After it expands aggressively, there will be no more debate.

(09-08-2014 02:07 PM)ken d Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 02:04 PM)CommuterBob Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

What claim would BYU and UConn have to any P5 membership? They aren't P5 members. BYU was just rebuffed by the ACC and SEC for consideration as fulfilling each conference's "power school" scheduling requirement. Neither is under any serious consideration for an invitation, so how can either "claim" P5 membership?

That said, USF, like any school hoping to gain access to the club, needs to increase their fan support and academic standing, reduce the reliance on institutional subsidies, and honestly, partner with UCF to be a combo. The two schools together are a better addition than either separately.

Only if they agree to split one conference distribution share between them.

Says who? You? Really? At least one of them not USF would compete at or near the top in any P-5 conference right now, and if they compete better than most, why should they make less money? Oh yeah, it's simple, GREED.

For either or both of USF and UCF to get a look, the Big 12 would have to start a cable network and be looking to expand it's subscriber base. There's no indication right now that they're at all interested in that. The other possibility, which is even more unlikely, would be for the Big 12 to somehow find a way to pull in FSU leaving the ACC in need of a Florida replacement.

(09-08-2014 01:09 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  UCF seems to be a popular school in realignment discussions and why not? They won the Fiesta Bowl and fill their campus stadium. USF is often mentioned along with UCF because of the rivalry, travel partner and TV market aspects.

Under Jim Leavitt, USF actually broke on the national scene before UCF did. USF beat Florida St, Miami, West Virginia, Auburn, Clemson, UNC, NC St, Louisville, Pitt, Syracuse, etc. They once enjoyed a big advantage over UCF.

Saturday, 1-0 USF drew 18,101 butts in seats for Big 10 Maryland. The local interest in the USF program appears to be at an all-time low. USF continues to play off campus at an NFL Stadium.

What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

We need to win games so as to bring the fans back. Then, we need to win more games to get even more fans excited about the program again.

(09-08-2014 03:55 PM)NestaKnight1 Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 02:07 PM)ken d Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 02:04 PM)CommuterBob Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 01:48 PM)Cali_Cat Wrote:  The only G5 schools with any claim to P5 membership are BYU and Connecticut. Cincinnati is in a tier below those two, others schools like UCF, Houston and Temple are long shots. South Florida isn't even on the radar...

What claim would BYU and UConn have to any P5 membership? They aren't P5 members. BYU was just rebuffed by the ACC and SEC for consideration as fulfilling each conference's "power school" scheduling requirement. Neither is under any serious consideration for an invitation, so how can either "claim" P5 membership?

That said, USF, like any school hoping to gain access to the club, needs to increase their fan support and academic standing, reduce the reliance on institutional subsidies, and honestly, partner with UCF to be a combo. The two schools together are a better addition than either separately.

Only if they agree to split one conference distribution share between them.

Says who? You? Really? At least one of them not USF would compete at or near the top in any P-5 conference right now, and if they compete better than most, why should they make less money? Oh yeah, it's simple, GREED.

I'm not sure I understand your post at all. My position is that a P5 conference would do better by taking just UCF rather than as a package deal with USF. Do you think UCF is more valuable as part of a combo than it is by itself?

(09-08-2014 03:42 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  1) On Campus Stadium/Attendance.

Off campus kills atmosphere and attendance for all but the biggest of big games and thats not what the P5 want. The B1G sucks all kind of hind tit but keeps getting love and attention because they still get huge attendance and TV numbers to watch them do so. Start averaging 50K fans to see you play Tulsa or F_U and people will take notice.

2) Academics

As Frank is fond of reminding us, university presidents make these decisions and so academics are a factor (importance varies by how stable the conference you want to join is). Right now by USNW rankings (yes, all rankings are flawed one way or another but for better or worse this is the big one everyone judges by) #170 USF would be the worst school in both the ACC and SEC (by 20 places) and would be tied for worst in the B12 with #170 WVU.

3) Win

Win big in everything you can but especially football. Winning gets you in the conversation you might otherwise not be in (see Louisville). Winning gives you claim to your market and a TV share that will get you noticed. Winning spreads your brand and puts you in the spotlight. You can get in without it, but not if you are lacking in other places.

I'm sure their basketball tradition and recent success in baseball helped out big time. Anything extra (men's soccer has been successful recently and draws pretty well too) is icing on the cake.

(09-08-2014 02:39 PM)LSUtah Wrote:  

(09-08-2014 01:09 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  What are your thoughts on USF's realignment prospects? And what do they need to do to improve them?

Minimal...it was honestly a head scratcher when they were called up by the Big East.
For starters, they need to get an on-campus stadium and change the USFL looking uni's.

USF was ahead of UCF at the time. Both were considered, but USF basically blazed the trail of large, southern, urban schools starting football and moving up quickly. UCF had taken a much more conservative approach and did not move up to then D1a until after USF did. As such USF was in CUSA while UCF was in the lower MAC. The BE was taking a big enough credibility hit by being raided and having to desperately back fill from the them equalish CUSA. Bringing in UCF would have made the perception problem even worse. Hindsight being 20/20 UCF should have been invited then.