After Missouri is saying no G5 home games. Would the P5 like to see another conference created to get home games.

NDSU, Liberty, and JMU have made no qualms about wanting to become FBS. So lets say the following is proposed football only. Just looking at Stadium Sizes of 19-20K or past team successes. This would not be any worse than the SB or CUSA. If they convince BYU to join to be part of the playoff access teams. You know these teams would be willing to play all P5 at home only in the start except for BYU or Army. BYU could probably bring the Poinsettia bowl and Army the Armed Forces bowl.

East
Army
UMASS
Liberty
JMU
UT-Chat
Delaware
E. Kentucky

West
NDSU
Montana
Abilene Christian Wildcats
BYU (If no BYU then Weber State)
Portland State Vikings
Sacramento State Hornets


Feel free to suggest any other FCS teams or proposals.

I don't see it becoming that big of a deal. For all the bluster from the P5 only camp there are enough programs in each conference that the games aren't going to go away. In fact I don't see anybody in the Pac12 voting to do away with games vs the G5 simply because they know if no G5 games every other year they are likely having to come east twice

And despite the bluster from the G5 folks about getting tough and saying "home and home or no games at all" there are enough G5 teams that can be bought.

Just for reference, here are all the FCS schools that averaged 10,000+ last season.

1. Appalachian St. - 24,894 <<<Sun Belt
2. Montana - 24,380
3. James Madison - 21,011
4. Southern U. - 20,107
5. Yale - 19,809 <<<Not Leaving Ivy League
6. Montana St. - 19,704
7. North Dakota St - 18,622
8. Delaware - 18,108
9. Jackson St. - 17,286
10. Jacksonville St. - 15,814
11. Charlotte - 15,541 <<<C-USA
12. Liberty - 15,031
13. Ga. Southern - 14,828 <<< Sun Belt
14. Alabama St. - 14,387
15. N.C. A&T - 13,574
16. Youngstown St. - 13,506
17. Citadel - 13,155
18. UNI - 12,572
19. McNeese St. - 12,072
20. Harvard - 12,067 <<< Not Leaving Ivy League
21. Penn - 11,936 <<< Not Leaving Ivy League
22. South Carolina St. - 11,880
23. Tennessee St. - 11,462
24. Florida A&M - 11,170
25. South Dakota St. - 10,694
26. Illinois St. - 10,139

Last thing we need is a WAC 2.0. Every region should have one power conference and one light conference. You have the PAC/MWC. B1G/MAC. ACC/AAC. Conf USA/Sunbelt/SEC/Big 12. Not in favor of an influx of teams. Change needs to be gradual, until there is another major shakeup or major shift that starts from the top and trickles down.

(09-03-2014 02:41 PM)Chappy Wrote:  Just for reference, here are all the FCS schools that averaged 10,000+ last season.

1. Appalachian St. - 24,894 <<<Sun Belt
2. Montana - 24,380
3. James Madison - 21,011
4. Southern U. - 20,107<<<HBCU Not leaving the SWAC
5. Yale - 19,809 <<<Not Leaving Ivy League
6. Montana St. - 19,704
7. North Dakota St - 18,622
8. Delaware - 18,108
9. Jackson St. - 17,286
10. Jacksonville St. - 15,814
11. Charlotte - 15,541 <<<C-USA
12. Liberty - 15,031
13. Ga. Southern - 14,828 <<< Sun Belt
14. Alabama St. - 14,387<<<HBCU Not leaving the SWAC
15. N.C. A&T - 13,574<<<HBCU Not leaving the MEAC
16. Youngstown St. - 13,506
17. Citadel - 13,155<<<Not leaving the SoCon
18. UNI - 12,572
19. McNeese St. - 12,072
20. Harvard - 12,067 <<< Not Leaving Ivy League
21. Penn - 11,936 <<< Not Leaving Ivy League
22. South Carolina St. - 11,880<<<HBCU Not leaving the MEAC
23. Tennessee St. - 11,462
24. Florida A&M - 11,170<<<HBCU Not leaving the MEAC
25. South Dakota St. - 10,694
26. Illinois St. - 10,139

The bold is my additions

(09-03-2014 02:27 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  After Missouri is saying no G5 home games. Would the P5 like to see another conference created to get home games.

NDSU, Liberty, and JMU have made no qualms about wanting to become FBS. So lets say the following is proposed football only. Just looking at Stadium Sizes of 19-20K or past team successes. This would not be any worse than the SB or CUSA. If they convince BYU to join to be part of the playoff access teams. You know these teams would be willing to play all P5 at home only in the start except for BYU or Army. BYU could probably bring the Poinsettia bowl and Army the Armed Forces bowl.

East
Army-I highly doubt Army wants to be playing this group after years of "big boy football" despite how terrible they've been.
UMASS
Liberty-Will always face challenges in a new home for political reasons. If the SB won't take em, I don't think this group of schools wants to either.
JMU-Admin can't find their heads from their assses.
UT-Chat
Delaware-No desire for FBS football.
E. Kentucky-Not quite ready yet, maybe 5 years down the road.

West
NDSU
Montana
Abilene Christian Wildcats
BYU (If no BYU then Weber State)
Portland State Vikings
Sacramento State Hornets


Feel free to suggest any other FCS teams or proposals.

My thoughts in bold.

I think you'd have a hard time convincing BYU, Army, and UMass that a conference such as this one would benefit them.

Are you serious? The 5 current G5 split 75 million in playoff money. Why the hell would we want pull up a dozen more teams to split it with. Why would we want to water the G5 talent base down even more? Why would want to make G5 games even more plentiful, thus giving the existing G5 conferences even less leverage with networks? There are a million reasons not to do something this silly.

If you are worried about G5 home games---don't. The bottom 2/3rds of the P5 still NEED G5 games to qualify for bowls. They are FAR more interested in getting bowl qualified than getting playoff qualified. They will continue to be a source for G5-P5 home-and-homes. Additionally, if the 65 P5 schools can generate enough home games for themselves, then the G5 can to. Frankly, if the G5 want to solve their problems, just get each conference to pass a home and home rule. Make it against the conference rules to play anything other than home-and-homes.

What is this garbage?

@Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

(09-03-2014 08:38 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

Its not a major negative impact for the G5. It would be killer for most of the programs that tried to move up though. Any new league cant participate in the Playoff, nor can they get the cash for that playoff. Those teams can move up...sure, but they would be at a huge recruiting disadvantage to other G5 schools.

(09-03-2014 08:38 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

The difference is that the schools in FCS made the choice to be in FCS when the D1 split occurred in the late 70's. The schools that joined the NCAA in football since that time knew it takes a conference invite to become part of the top level of football. That's entirely different from kicking schools out of the top level of football against thier wishes.

(09-03-2014 02:27 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  After Missouri is saying no G5 home games. Would the P5 like to see another conference created to get home games.

NDSU, Liberty, and JMU have made no qualms about wanting to become FBS. So lets say the following is proposed football only. Just looking at Stadium Sizes of 19-20K or past team successes. This would not be any worse than the SB or CUSA. If they convince BYU to join to be part of the playoff access teams. You know these teams would be willing to play all P5 at home only in the start except for BYU or Army. BYU could probably bring the Poinsettia bowl and Army the Armed Forces bowl.

East
Army
UMASS
Liberty
JMU
UT-Chat
Delaware
E. Kentucky

West
NDSU
Montana
Abilene Christian Wildcats
BYU (If no BYU then Weber State)
Portland State Vikings
Sacramento State Hornets


Feel free to suggest any other FCS teams or proposals.

Why would the FBS create a league with 1 inferior conference for them to pillage when they've spent the last 20 years creating 5 inferior conferences to exploit? You're just suggesting a mini version of the BCS.

(09-03-2014 08:38 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

Scared to lose the play off money.
Bigger threat the next CFP is eight with P5 guaranteed a spot and three at large. Easy to pay out per spot at that point. So each conference is guaranteed an eighth to a fourth. Then G5 gets no play off money unless they make one of these games which they won't.

No.
The more likely scenario is trimming down to a Group of Four.

(09-04-2014 04:32 AM)MJG Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:38 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

Scared to lose the play off money.
Bigger threat the next CFP is eight with P5 guaranteed a spot and three at large. Easy to pay out per spot at that point. So each conference is guaranteed an eighth to a fourth. Then G5 gets no play off money unless they make one of these games which they won't.

I know everyone is clamoring for an 8 team playoff but the Elephant in the Room is called the NFL. How do you avoid conflict with their schedule? The last weekend of the NFL usually leaves Monday night for a bowl game. The playoffs start right after New Years the next weekend. The reason it works with College Basketball and the NBA, there is no conflict. I would even say College Basketball is bigger than the NBA. That is just not the case for College Football vs the NFL. Both are huge and work well together. I don't see College Football rocking the boat with this. The way the 4 team play off was done, it did not an add extra date for the championship game. If someone could show me a model that does not conflict with the NFL, I would love to see it. Right now, I am curious how long ESPN Thursday Night football will last once it has ratings verse CBS NFL Thursday Night Football. My bet they move to smaller games and the bigger games will start being on Friday Night.

(09-04-2014 11:32 AM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-04-2014 04:32 AM)MJG Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:38 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 08:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(09-03-2014 06:39 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  @Attackcoog, this is not from a G5 but P5 perspective. Creating more "Home" only G5 teams basically forcing the hand of G5 teams that demand for Home and Home. Yes, this would come out of the the other G5 budget for the CFP, so why would the P5 not support it. It is win/win for the P5. Just presenting views from the other side.

@Dukes One very surprising thing is Liberty unlike other schools has the money to become fbs. If anything we have learned about college football, it is the green not the views.

Finally with all the bowls, adding another G5 type helps teams get to bowl status.

The P5 don't much want to associated with the G5---so I doubt they have an interest in making it bigger by using teams that are FCS now. If anything, the P5 goal is to shrink FBS. The P5 will have no trouble getting home games---and if they do, the simple solution will be to expand the number of conference games played.

Correct about P5 does not want to play G5 away games, not that I agree. However, I doubt the P5 has any issues of getting new FBS teams that are more than willing to play "Pay Day Away Games". My perspective the AAC and ACC will have many H/H series. I just see that there will be more schools wanting to get to FBS. Really there is only one open spot which is in the Sun Belt. So either a new conference or teams stuck at FCS. What I find funny is the G5 would be against it because it would negatively impact them, however, the G5 complains about the P5 blocking them out.

Scared to lose the play off money.
Bigger threat the next CFP is eight with P5 guaranteed a spot and three at large. Easy to pay out per spot at that point. So each conference is guaranteed an eighth to a fourth. Then G5 gets no play off money unless they make one of these games which they won't.

I know everyone is clamoring for an 8 team playoff but the Elephant in the Room is called the NFL. How do you avoid conflict with their schedule? The last weekend of the NFL usually leaves Monday night for a bowl game. The playoffs start right after New Years the next weekend. The reason it works with College Basketball and the NBA, there is no conflict. I would even say College Basketball is bigger than the NBA. That is just not the case for College Football vs the NFL. Both are huge and work well together. I don't see College Football rocking the boat with this. The way the 4 team play off was done, it did not an add extra date for the championship game. If someone could show me a model that does not conflict with the NFL, I would love to see it. Right now, I am curious how long ESPN Thursday Night football will last once it has ratings verse CBS NFL Thursday Night Football. My bet they move to smaller games and the bigger games will start being on Friday Night.

There is nothing to be concerned about. The current bowls schedule has 38 bowls set up around the NFL schedule. Its just not that hard.

In addition to everything stated above, current NCAA rules prohibit a sport specific conference. And no one would vote to make that change, and would open up a large can or worms, as conferences everywhere would be destroyed as teams started forming basketball only conferences, which would utterly destroy most of the other conferences who would lose heir NCAA money.