While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

Even though Notre Dame has never played an FCS team and plays almost exclusively Power Five opponents already, Irish coach Brian Kelly said he would be against it if it meant no longer playing Navy.

Kelly said removing Navy from Notre Dame's schedule would be "a deal-breaker."

http://espn.go.com/college-football/stor...oday_Sport

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

#1) ND has a lot of loyalty to Navy. As late as last week, Brian Kelly called a prohibition against ND playing Navy a "deal breaker".

But, in my opinion, if push came to shove, ND would sacrifice its relationship with Navy rather than join a football conference (for that particular reason).

#2) #1 above makes this moot, in my opinion.

Only if Navy/ND were in the Northern division and not a stupid fake zipper where they can dump Navy in FSU's division...

(08-11-2014 11:44 AM)Ragu Wrote:  Only if Navy/ND were in the Northern division and not a stupid fake zipper where they can dump Navy in FSU's division...

If the scenario were to ever come about I imagine that heads will explode in Greensboro and Chapel Hill because of trying to figure out which benefits the Holes the most.

Do you want Notre Dame for the exposure that playing the parasites gains you or do you want Navy to maintain your cozy divisional alignment so that Miami is your only remote school, you get more exposure in the better recruiting grounds in the DelMarVa area, and the fact that Navy isn't going to be a threat in your handicapped division?

(08-11-2014 11:43 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

#1) ND has a lot of loyalty to Navy. As late as last week, Brian Kelly called a prohibition against ND playing Navy a "deal breaker".

But, in my opinion, if push came to shove, ND would sacrifice its relationship with Navy rather than join a football conference (for that particular reason).

#2) #1 above makes this moot, in my opinion.

What would any of this have to do with ND joining a football conference?

Classy btw considering they basically saved ND's ass.

(08-11-2014 12:34 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:43 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

#1) ND has a lot of loyalty to Navy. As late as last week, Brian Kelly called a prohibition against ND playing Navy a "deal breaker".

But, in my opinion, if push came to shove, ND would sacrifice its relationship with Navy rather than join a football conference (for that particular reason).

#2) #1 above makes this moot, in my opinion.

What would any of this have to do with ND joining a football conference?

Classy btw considering they basically saved ND's ass.

I disagree with Terry and I think "IF" that became a requirement we would ensure them a spot.

We have never wavered in loyalty to them. All this is moot because the P-5 needs G-5 games. Unless everyone is willing to have less home games.

(08-11-2014 12:48 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 12:34 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:43 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

#1) ND has a lot of loyalty to Navy. As late as last week, Brian Kelly called a prohibition against ND playing Navy a "deal breaker".

But, in my opinion, if push came to shove, ND would sacrifice its relationship with Navy rather than join a football conference (for that particular reason).

#2) #1 above makes this moot, in my opinion.

What would any of this have to do with ND joining a football conference?

Classy btw considering they basically saved ND's ass.

I disagree with Terry and I think "IF" that became a requirement we would ensure them a spot.

We have never wavered in loyalty to them. All this is moot because the P-5 needs G-5 games. Unless everyone is willing to have less home games.

There are also a lot of good rivalry games that exist between P5 and G5 schools.

I doubt that P5 only scheduling will ever exist, but this thread is just a hypothetical.

I believe ND would do whatever it takes to continue playing Navy.*

*Anything that doesn't harm ND athletics.

ND stays loyal. At worst, ND has a new rule created for a "preseason" game in which they could play Navy. More likely that ND secures a slot for Navy. This is an hypothetical only. I still think ND stays Indy for a long time. The G5 still have access to the playoffs, if only on paper, and every P5 school is enjoying the extra home games or made for TV neutral $ite game$.

At one time I thought the Navy/G'town add was a great idea and it is tempting. I believe ND will stay loyal, I just think Navy will release them from their obligation.
P5 football, with all the changes, doesn't seem to me to fit the Navy mission. Georgetown is fantastic and would love to find a way to play them again.

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

I suspect there are enough votes in the ACC to look after Navy. Some will not like it, but Navy is a special case and Navy doesn't have to be offered a full share of revenue and just because you allow Navy for football does not mean we need to add a 16th for basketball so that issue can be finessed and kicked down the road if the current 15 team format is suitable for the majority.

I don't know of any other school that has a gripe with the Naval Academy but some do have closer ties than what might appear on the surface.

(08-11-2014 12:11 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:44 AM)Ragu Wrote:  Only if Navy/ND were in the Northern division and not a stupid fake zipper where they can dump Navy in FSU's division...

If the scenario were to ever come about I imagine that heads will explode in Greensboro and Chapel Hill because of trying to figure out which benefits the Holes the most.

Do you want Notre Dame for the exposure that playing the parasites gains you or do you want Navy to maintain your cozy divisional alignment so that Miami is your only remote school, you get more exposure in the better recruiting grounds in the DelMarVa area, and the fact that Navy isn't going to be a threat in your handicapped division?

Bravo!

I think you were able to diss about five schools in one paragraph.

[b][b][b][b][b]

(08-11-2014 12:34 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:43 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

#1) ND has a lot of loyalty to Navy. As late as last week, Brian Kelly called a prohibition against ND playing Navy a "deal breaker".

But, in my opinion, if push came to shove, ND would sacrifice its relationship with Navy rather than join a football conference (for that particular reason).

#2) #1 above makes this moot, in my opinion.

What would any of this have to do with ND joining a football conference?

Classy btw considering they basically saved ND's ass.

You must have missed the premise in the OP's first question paragraph?

I did not diss Navy in any manner. I just answered the question.

I respect the Naval Academy and the Navy and always acknowledge the debt ND owes the Navy.

Plus, my son is a Marine, my father-in-law a 23 year Marine vet who did 3 Vietnam tours and retired as a Gunnery Sergeant.

One of my nephews served on the U.S S. Nicholson (home ported in Charleston) during the Gulf War and another was a Marine infantryman during the 2003 Iraq invasion.

I also root for Navy when it is not playing ND, including when it plays any ACC team and ECU, for that matter.

I just don't think ND will give up independence so Navy can join the ACC, sorry .

That was indeed the premise in Hokie Mark's first question, right?

I think instead that Navy/ ND will be granted a waiver , but that wasn't the hypothetical presented.

I hope that ND stays independent and annually plays Navy for 100 more years.

Apology accepted, btw.

P.S. A question. Is this a perpetual "debt"owed by ND or has it been repaid, almost 70 years after the end of World War II?

Is it now really just good relations, good will on ND's part and Navy's desire to play/ cash in and an annual tradition going back to 1927 that keeps this series going?

(08-11-2014 11:39 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  While I doubt this ever happens, let's play hypothetical for a moment: what if the P5 end up with a rule that they can ONLY play other P5 teams (and Notre Dame, presumably).

Q1: Would the ND have enough loyalty to Navy that the Irish would join the ACC for football provided that Navy was #16 - thus giving the Midshipmen one of the last lifeboats?

Q2: if Notre Dame suggested such a deal, would the rest of the ACC be willing to accept it? What about a Navy/Georgetown hybrid? Multiple votes from the same school fanbase mean nothing... it would come down to how many different schools would agree / disagree.

Thoughts?

My thoughts only:

1) Notre Dame will not be joining the ACC for football in my lifetime.
2) The P5 should give an exemption and include all of the service academies so that game counts as a P5 opponent.

Notre Dame is not in a P5 (football) conference. So making a rule that P5 football teams can only play P5 football teams would not apply to Notre Dame. I don't believe Notre Dames "loyalty" to Navy extends beyond football so I don't think such a rule would entice or force Notre Dame into a conference.

I think any rule that prohibits a school, conference or group of conferences from playing any of the military academies is suicidal. I don't care if they are P5, G5 or Division III.

I'm not opposed to the Navy/Georgetown hybrid but would have to see more details. Is the DC/MD market worth it?

(08-11-2014 06:54 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  Notre Dame is not in a P5 (football) conference. So making a rule that P5 football teams can only play P5 football teams would not apply to Notre Dame. I don't believe Notre Dames "loyalty" to Navy extends beyond football so I don't think such a rule would entice or force Notre Dame into a conference.

I think any rule that prohibits a school, conference or group of conferences from playing any of the military academies is suicidal. I don't care if they are P5, G5 or Division III.

I'm not opposed to the Navy/Georgetown hybrid but would have to see more details. Is the DC/MD market worth it?

I believe the loyalty extends beyond football. ND's loyalty to Navy is greater than Duke/UNC/NC State's loyalty to Wake Forest - and that loyalty is real.

(08-11-2014 07:15 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 06:54 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  Notre Dame is not in a P5 (football) conference. So making a rule that P5 football teams can only play P5 football teams would not apply to Notre Dame. I don't believe Notre Dames "loyalty" to Navy extends beyond football so I don't think such a rule would entice or force Notre Dame into a conference.

I think any rule that prohibits a school, conference or group of conferences from playing any of the military academies is suicidal. I don't care if they are P5, G5 or Division III.

I'm not opposed to the Navy/Georgetown hybrid but would have to see more details. Is the DC/MD market worth it?

I believe the loyalty extends beyond football. ND's loyalty to Navy is greater than Duke/UNC/NC State's loyalty to Wake Forest - and that loyalty is real.

Maybe. Notre Dame has not played Navy in mens basketball this century. I don't think ND puts much, if any, emphasis on scheduling Navy outside of football.

(08-11-2014 09:24 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 07:15 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(08-11-2014 06:54 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  Notre Dame is not in a P5 (football) conference. So making a rule that P5 football teams can only play P5 football teams would not apply to Notre Dame. I don't believe Notre Dames "loyalty" to Navy extends beyond football so I don't think such a rule would entice or force Notre Dame into a conference.

I think any rule that prohibits a school, conference or group of conferences from playing any of the military academies is suicidal. I don't care if they are P5, G5 or Division III.

I'm not opposed to the Navy/Georgetown hybrid but would have to see more details. Is the DC/MD market worth it?

I believe the loyalty extends beyond football. ND's loyalty to Navy is greater than Duke/UNC/NC State's loyalty to Wake Forest - and that loyalty is real.

Maybe. Notre Dame has not played Navy in mens basketball this century. I don't think ND puts much, if any, emphasis on scheduling Navy outside of football.

I have no idea if ND has played Navy much in basketball, but ND as a rule doesn't put that much emphasis on basketball, period.