http://irish.nbcsports.com/2014/07/31/fo...ame-story/

Irish===>ACC bound 2030

They'll be playing football in the conference before long

(08-01-2014 02:18 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  Irish===>ACC bound 2030

They'll be playing football in the conference before long

Nope.

I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

(08-01-2014 02:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

He will be retired in the next 2-3 years.

I didn't take his independence stance as one that was overly independence or bust. It was rather timid IMO.

Jack is a smart guy.

I think it's significant, and not appreciated (or even believed) by many football fans, that Notre Dame recognizes and is willing to accept that their stance on independence makes their opportunity for a national championship much more difficult. I believe they are sincere in their vision for ND football. If you were to say in the future that the only way to get in a playoff was to be in a conference, but you changed nothing else, I'd guess it's still no better than a 50/50 chance that ND changes its strategy. They haven't been champion for a long time now, and things are still going pretty well according to plan for the Irish.

(08-01-2014 02:25 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

He will be retired in the next 2-3 years.

I didn't take his independence stance as one that was overly independence or bust. It was rather timid IMO.

Yeah, and isn't that a change from the norm quite frankly?

The Irish see the writing on the wall.....the key phrase, is that they fit in the ACC culturally

I guarantee you, after 10+ years of FSU, Miami, Virginia Tech, and Clemson games, the Irish will finally take the plunge.

(08-01-2014 02:39 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:25 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

He will be retired in the next 2-3 years.

I didn't take his independence stance as one that was overly independence or bust. It was rather timid IMO.

Yeah, and isn't that a change from the norm quite frankly?

IMO it was different tone . But I may be parsing to much.

(08-01-2014 02:41 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:39 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:25 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

He will be retired in the next 2-3 years.

I didn't take his independence stance as one that was overly independence or bust. It was rather timid IMO.

Yeah, and isn't that a change from the norm quite frankly?

IMO it was different tone . But I may be parsing to much.

I think we are seeing the exact same thing. It is different. I can't imagine some of ND's AD's 15-20 years ago saying what he said.

(08-01-2014 02:06 PM)TerryD Wrote:  http://irish.nbcsports.com/2014/07/31/fo...ame-story/

Terry this was an interesting parsing of words in which Swarbrick declares the intentions of the school to remain independent, play a national schedule, pursue its own media deals, and hang onto traditions while acknowledging the likelihood of further consolidation (which has nothing to do with football), and doesn't dismiss out of hand full conference affiliation.

The way I hear this is that Notre Dame is desperately trying to hold onto its ideals but must confront the reality of the paradigm shift in both the economy and in college athletics. The only thing he seems to promise is that no significant change will occur on his watch.

(08-01-2014 02:45 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:41 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:39 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:25 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  I think he kind of alluded to it even in the piece:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

If Big 12 goes, you have 4 conferences and that's it.

He's 60 right now, so his professional career could be over within the next 10 years or so. Right when everything will be starting up again....

He will be retired in the next 2-3 years.

I didn't take his independence stance as one that was overly independence or bust. It was rather timid IMO.

Yeah, and isn't that a change from the norm quite frankly?

IMO it was different tone . But I may be parsing to much.

I think we are seeing the exact same thing. It is different. I can't imagine some of ND's AD's 15-20 years ago saying what he said.

IMO yes...
Reading it seems to hedge on outside forces behaving and not causing instability.

(08-01-2014 02:46 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:06 PM)TerryD Wrote:  http://irish.nbcsports.com/2014/07/31/fo...ame-story/

Terry this was an interesting parsing of words in which Swarbrick declares the intentions of the school to remain independent, play a national schedule, pursue its own media deals, and hang onto traditions while acknowledging the likelihood of further consolidation (which has nothing to do with football), and doesn't dismiss out of hand full conference affiliation.

The way I hear this is that Notre Dame is desperately trying to hold onto its ideals but must confront the reality of the paradigm shift in both the economy and in college athletics. The only thing he seems to promise is that no significant change will occur on his watch.

This is not all that different from his previous "monitoring the landscape" comments, in my opinion.

(08-01-2014 02:40 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  The Irish see the writing on the wall.....the key phrase, is that they fit in the ACC culturally

I guarantee you, after 10+ years of FSU, Miami, Virginia Tech, and Clemson games, the Irish will finally take the plunge.

While many have other views about this, I saw this "5-game-per-season for 12 seasons" ND/ACC scheduling agreement as a way for ND to get its fanbase used to seeing ACC member schools playing South Bend, so that when Swarbrick retires, his successor will have a much easier sell when ND makes the decision to have its FB program compete in the ACC. As a full member.

Remember -- "culturally, the ACC is a great fit".

(08-01-2014 03:14 PM)ecuacc4ever Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:40 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  The Irish see the writing on the wall.....the key phrase, is that they fit in the ACC culturally

I guarantee you, after 10+ years of FSU, Miami, Virginia Tech, and Clemson games, the Irish will finally take the plunge.

While many have other views about this, I saw this "5-game-per-season for 12 seasons" ND/ACC scheduling agreement as a way for ND to get its fanbase used to seeing ACC member schools playing South Bend, so that when Swarbrick retires, his successor will have a much easier sell when ND makes the decision to have its FB program compete in the ACC. As a full member.

Remember -- "culturally, the ACC is a great fit".

Nope. ND told the Big East and then told the ACC that football is never on the table.


Here’s Swarbrick on the school’s continued push to play a national schedule and pursue and align with big-time partners (Under Armour, NBC) as Notre Dame continues to cherish its independence and national reach.

“A brilliant guy, our first full-time coach here, Jesse Harper, really set the model for us back in 1913, when he decided that Notre Dame would be the first team to schedule nationally. He really saw it as an opportunity to talk about Notre Dame, to promote the university, so that’s always been our model.

“The importance of the NBC partnership, the football independence, or Under Armour, it’s nothing to do with any direct or immediate impact, but has to do with the platform that it gives us to run the university. We couldn’t be more excited about Under Armour as a partner in that regard. They’re growing like crazy, they have a special place with the younger demographic in this country, and they help us tell the Notre Dame story.”


"“Fortunately, I think that world has settled down. I think we went through a period where there was sort of wholesale movements. I think we’re probably going to go through about a decade here… I think that’s going to produce a real period of stability. Our goal is to maintain independence. But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences. I don’t think that’s going to happen, at least not during my professional career, but that’s the only way we’d do it.

“It has nothing to do with football. We’d have a lot easier route to the national championship through a conference and becoming a conference champion, but that just doesn’t do for the university what we’re committed to do for it. So right now, that’s the balance we strike and it works well for us.”

Terry you didn't bold the most important line:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences.

If Big 12 disappears we're down to 4 leagues. Pretty easy to see 4 conference champs only making the playoff at that point. At that point- Notre Dame has no choice, which is what he's alluding to.

(08-01-2014 02:46 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-01-2014 02:06 PM)TerryD Wrote:  http://irish.nbcsports.com/2014/07/31/fo...ame-story/

Terry this was an interesting parsing of words in which Swarbrick declares the intentions of the school to remain independent, play a national schedule, pursue its own media deals, and hang onto traditions while acknowledging the likelihood of further consolidation (which has nothing to do with football), and doesn't dismiss out of hand full conference affiliation.

The way I hear this is that Notre Dame is desperately trying to hold onto its ideals but must confront the reality of the paradigm shift in both the economy and in college athletics. The only thing he seems to promise is that no significant change will occur on his watch.

I agree. But it's interesting that Notre Dame's actions went a long way to furthering that paradigm shift.

A fully independent Notre Dame that was willing to schedule home-and-home (1 for 1) with other large independents could have convinced UConn that it was in their interests to go indy in football. Remember, it was Notre Dame leaving the Big East that was the final straw for the C7 breaking away. The C-7 could have broken away with UConn and ND, added Creighton to get to 10, and been done with it.

If UConn went indy, Navy probably wouldn't have joined the AAC.

ND could offer UConn, say, a 3 for 3 over 10 years with the first 2 games in South Bend, and if the other team joins a conference then the return games are automatically canceled. Offer the same deal to Hawai'i, Temple, and Air Force (ND already does frequent home-and-home games with AF and is in the middle of one with Temple; they may as well attach conditions to it).

With those 5 teams added to the ranks of indies, all of a sudden you have a viable "conference" of indys that has to be taken seriously, instead of Notre Dame, BYU, and Army fighting alone. Also, UMass, Idaho, and New Mexico State wouldn't be completely desperate to join the first conference that will take them.

But this didn't happen. Instead of using their clout to prop up other independents, Notre Dame used their clout to force Shamrock Series games that make Navy and others schedule their "home" games of the series in far off locales. And instead of staying in a mostly Catholic conference, they joined a Southern conference where most of the schools are in Baptist country.

Why did they do this? My friend who has only missed 1 ND home game since 1984 says it was to make Swarbrick's job easier. It's ludicrous that his excuse was that it was hard to schedule games in October/November. It was *hard*, not *impossible.* But instead of earning his million dollar salary he used his power to make his own job easier.

(08-01-2014 03:22 PM)stever20 Wrote:  Terry you didn't bold the most important line:
But you never say never. It’s not that we prefer to ever pursue an alternative, but you could imagine further changes down the road, as people project further consolidation of conferences.

If Big 12 disappears we're down to 4 leagues. Pretty easy to see 4 conference champs only making the playoff at that point. At that point- Notre Dame has no choice, which is what he's alluding to.

They'll still have a choice. It's just that the price of independence will be a little steeper. I don't know whether they would choose to pay it or not.

Meh. I've got to agree with TerryD here. It's all "we're monitoring the landscape" speech. There is nothing - NOTHING - to the notion that playing more ACC teams would somehow "ease" ND fans into joining a conference. Remember that ND had been playing at least 3 Big Ten opponents annually (including the team that causes the most vitriol for them: Michigan) for a long time and have had many seasons where they were playing 4 or 5 Big Ten opponents. Yet, that never made the Big Ten more hospitable/tolerable for Irish alums. Domers are a completely different breed. That difference between 5 games against ACC opponents as an independent compared to 8 or 9 ACC conference games is MONUMENTAL for Domers even if the rest of the college football world doesn't see what the big deal is.

The only thing that I see causing ND to join a conference is that they would be flat out structurally NOT ALLOWED to participate in the playoff where it's an outright explicit requirement to win a power conference to compete for national title. So, in a 4 16-team superconference scenario where you *have* to win a conference title to play for the national championship, yes, we could see ND joining a conference. However, it's a chicken-or-the-egg scenario because none of these conferences are headed to 16 teams unless ND decides to join one of them in the first place, so ND can almost unilaterally prevent that scenario in the first place. (The one wild card is what Texas chooses to do. They're the only other school that could make 16-team superconferences into a reality and *could* force ND to do something against its will. No one else has that power.) As long as they have playoff access, though (even if it's really difficult in practicality), there's nothing - NOTHING - that can change the minds of Domers on this issue. They are actually crazier and more Borg-like single-minded about the topic than what most college football fans give them credit for.