(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

I don't feel bad for them. They are lucky. They are no more "worthy" than any other so called "g5", but by virtue of joining some conference 50+ years ago, they are now somehow more "worthy".

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

Vandy is LOADED with money.

You must be new to this whole "have not" thing. It's the same as it ever was, the schools with the biggest fan bases have all the power. That existed before the DI split, before the bowl alliance and before the BCS. This is just the latest incarnation of the real big boys getting what they want. They're just dragging their P5 leeches across the finish line. Eventually they'll turn on each other.

(07-23-2014 12:48 AM)Knightbengal Wrote:  

(07-22-2014 11:35 PM)Kronke Wrote:  Your priorities, manage them.

Let's say UCF was permanently relegated to "G5" status. Life will go on, trust me.

As I said in my above post however we have been fighting for relevance for as long as I can remember. I can't believe no one is putting up a fight. I know aresco is hoping to stay in everyone's good graces but I am sorry it's rediculous. I mean it's just brash now and the media is to the point where it's asking what's the plan. I am sorry but I don't want to slip into irrelevance again. It's bs and we just keep taking it on the chin. Jones idea is idiotic but we have to do something geez

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Welcome to the club. Perhaps you would like to share the wood of the cross you bear with the rest of us who have had programs around a good bit longer and fighting for the same "relevance" longer with less resources than are available today. We have felt it for years. Brother, I'm not trying to start a pissing match, believe me. We feel the same pain and anger over this whole mess as you. Your perspective as it relates to your school isn't unique. All we can do is keep giving to our respective schools and build our programs, work together as a conference to be as competitive as possible and pray that the pieces fall in the right place for a better future. We ALL bring something good to the table and all any of us have wanted for years is a fair chance and a level playing field.

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

You're kidding, right? These schools are all extremely wealthy to begin with, and now will be cashing massive $35m - $40m checks from the CFP and media deals!

An ECU fan ($130m endowment) feeling sorry for Vanderbilt ($4B endowment) and Duke ($6B endowment) is like a McDonald's burger flipper feeling sorry for Bill Gates and Warren Buffett.

(07-23-2014 09:33 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

I don't feel bad for them. They are lucky. They are no more "worthy" than any other so called "g5", but by virtue of joining some conference 50+ years ago, they are now somehow more "worthy".

They didn't "join", they founded those conferences. Good grief.

I simply will never watch a p5 game. Ever.

Won't make a difference , but I will feel better about it. I'm sure many fans will do the same, and overall P5 viewership will diminish.

Cfb is a mess. Used to be my favorite sport - but this p5 bullcrap has ruined it for me.

I'm thinking about it more from the standpoint of keeping up with the joneses...not as much their conference situation and contract revenue in comparison to us. For example, the extra scholarship situation: I mean these schools can't compete on the recruiting trail anyways because of how hard it is to get players into school, now they're gonna have to deal with Bama having 200 scholarship football players?

Also, they may have tons of money, but none of their athletic programs turn a profit and that's a well known fact. Especially Wake Forest. I don't mean feel bad in the sense that I want to console them and give them a glass of warm milk. But I do think that, like someone said earlier, they're leeches being dragged around. As prestigious private institutions they do have different expectations.

Also - for the record - Wake Forest had an athletic operating budget just $5 million more than ECU's during the BCS era. Now yes the CFP is a new day, but I'm specifically talking about the new rules and expenses that smaller P5 schools will have to deal with in addition.

Finally, a 4 billion dollar endowment doesn't mean jack diddly squat to an athletic department - otherwise the Ivy League would be in the P5. For the record, Vanderbilt's most recently recorded athletic operating budget is $49 million...that would be just $13 million more than ECU.

Now, are those stats the best thing to go off of? No, but the fact is that they're the only thing to go off of.

I also just want to say and admit that I personally would be no different than any other school in the P5 if I had the opportunity. Had I been a graduate of the University of North Caro-whine-a or been an NC State Woofie, I wouldn't give a crap about any of this and college football would be my favorite thing in the world right now and not remotely frustrating - but exciting.

But it damn sure is survival of the fittest, and all of us are just too slow to the show, and we've all got our own stories as to why.

(07-22-2014 09:57 PM)Knightbengal Wrote:  I am sure many of you from all of our teams can relate to this. I am really getting frustrated with this p5 bs. The more that this becomes reality the more angry I become. As many of our schools have fought and clawed their way to get to the "big time" just to get smacked down because of tv dollars. It's already impacting recruiting and as we come off of the fiesta bowl high I am becoming more and more irritated that it's just happening especially having been vindicated in 2011 by getting an invite to a bcs league. It really is irritating. It's one thing to have more resources but quite another when you can just change the whole playing field. Sorry to vent but I am stewing right now and I am tired of reading these commissioners saying just shut up and take it.

The move is similar to what the BCS was designed to do, hold us back while they take the vast majority of the $'s. Once they start catching up and competing and taking too much of the pie for our tastes we will blow it up and set them back another 5 to 10 years scratching and figuring out how to get back up to speed. IMO.

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(07-23-2014 09:46 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:33 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

I don't feel bad for them. They are lucky. They are no more "worthy" than any other so called "g5", but by virtue of joining some conference 50+ years ago, they are now somehow more "worthy".

They didn't "join", they founded those conferences. Good grief.

Whether they joined or founded is totally irrelevent. They just happened to join/found the right conference long before the advent of the BCS/P5/Scam. If USF had joined/founded one of these conferences (I know difficult due to age of USF, but let's just say for the sake of argument), they would be golden today by doing absolutely NOTHING. That is the point.

(07-23-2014 09:39 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  You must be new to this whole "have not" thing. It's the same as it ever was, the schools with the biggest fan bases have all the power. That existed before the DI split, before the bowl alliance and before the BCS. This is just the latest incarnation of the real big boys getting what they want. They're just dragging their P5 leeches across the finish line. Eventually they'll turn on each other.

True in most cases, but in many cases false. There are many so called power 5 programs that have attendance at or below G5 levels. USF regularly averaged 45-50K in the old Big east, far more than the likes of Syracuse, for example. USF also dominated, and I mean dominated syracuse on the field. But guess who got invited.

(07-23-2014 10:26 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:39 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  You must be new to this whole "have not" thing. It's the same as it ever was, the schools with the biggest fan bases have all the power. That existed before the DI split, before the bowl alliance and before the BCS. This is just the latest incarnation of the real big boys getting what they want. They're just dragging their P5 leeches across the finish line. Eventually they'll turn on each other.

True in most cases, but in many cases false. There are many so called power 5 programs that have attendance at or below G5 levels. USF regularly averaged 45-50K in the old Big east, far more than the likes of Syracuse, for example. USF also dominated, and I mean dominated syracuse on the field. But guess who got invited.

How many fans did you avg. in basketball? Because Syracuse averages 30k and won X championships and is the most popular school in one of the most populous states in the country whether the actual school is upstate or not. I mean this argument could go around in 6000 circles.

We all have our stories for being here..some are far more worthy (UConn) than others, but the fact is that we are here.

For example, I contend that ECU should've been in the Big East YEARS ago - hell, in my opinion before USF. But John Thompson ran our program into the ground right when the Big East football teams were getting ransacked by the ACC. Like, literally, f'ing perfect timing. ECU had a lot of momentum coming into the 2000s them BOOM, John Thompson goes 3-20 in 2 years RIGHT when conferences realign. And everyone else will say "oh BS you guys didn't deserve it" and I'll say "yes we did we put 45,000 in the seats at the time in GREENVILLE." But who cares? We're here so that's all that really matters. Get my drift? 6000 circles.

(07-23-2014 10:31 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 10:26 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:39 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  You must be new to this whole "have not" thing. It's the same as it ever was, the schools with the biggest fan bases have all the power. That existed before the DI split, before the bowl alliance and before the BCS. This is just the latest incarnation of the real big boys getting what they want. They're just dragging their P5 leeches across the finish line. Eventually they'll turn on each other.

True in most cases, but in many cases false. There are many so called power 5 programs that have attendance at or below G5 levels. USF regularly averaged 45-50K in the old Big east, far more than the likes of Syracuse, for example. USF also dominated, and I mean dominated syracuse on the field. But guess who got invited.

How many fans did you avg. in basketball? Because Syracuse averages 30k and won X championships and is the most popular school in one of the most populous states in the country whether the actual school is upstate or not. I mean this argument could go around in 6000 circles.

We all have our stories for being here..some are far more worthy (UConn) than others, but the fact is that we are here.

Not many compared to Cuse. Maybe that was a bad example due to basketball. I was strictly talking football lines. I could have used other examples, but that one came to the top of my head. Pitt didn't have any better football attendance that USF in the old BE. Just didn't. Theres probably 10 examples of lower drawing so called "p5" programs we could list.

(07-23-2014 09:45 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

You're kidding, right? These schools are all extremely wealthy to begin with, and now will be cashing massive $35m - $40m checks from the CFP and media deals!

An ECU fan ($130m endowment) feeling sorry for Vanderbilt ($4B endowment) and Duke ($6B endowment) is like a McDonald's burger flipper feeling sorry for Bill Gates and Warren Buffett.

Can't argue with that.........

(07-22-2014 09:57 PM)Knightbengal Wrote:  I am sure many of you from all of our teams can relate to this. I am really getting frustrated with this p5 bs. The more that this becomes reality the more angry I become. As many of our schools have fought and clawed their way to get to the "big time" just to get smacked down because of tv dollars. It's already impacting recruiting and as we come off of the fiesta bowl high I am becoming more and more irritated that it's just happening especially having been vindicated in 2011 by getting an invite to a bcs league. It really is irritating. It's one thing to have more resources but quite another when you can just change the whole playing field. Sorry to vent but I am stewing right now and I am tired of reading these commissioners saying just shut up and take it.


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I am not irritated, I am actually starting to feel indifferent or perhaps apathetic about college sports altogether. Eliminating competition by off the field machinations is just a tremendous turn off.

(07-23-2014 09:45 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-23-2014 09:01 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  I really do feel bad for schools like Vandy, Wake, Northwestern, and Duke. I'm not 100% sure they'll be able to survive all of this spending. Eventually their Universities and alumni are going to stop funneling money down an unprofitable toilet. Those schools are going to lose TONS of money.

You're kidding, right? These schools are all extremely wealthy to begin with, and now will be cashing massive $35m - $40m checks from the CFP and media deals!

An ECU fan ($130m endowment) feeling sorry for Vanderbilt ($4B endowment) and Duke ($6B endowment) is like a McDonald's burger flipper feeling sorry for Bill Gates and Warren Buffett.

(07-22-2014 09:57 PM)Knightbengal Wrote:  I am sure many of you from all of our teams can relate to this. I am really getting frustrated with this p5 bs. The more that this becomes reality the more angry I become. As many of our schools have fought and clawed their way to get to the "big time" just to get smacked down because of tv dollars. It's already impacting recruiting and as we come off of the fiesta bowl high I am becoming more and more irritated that it's just happening especially having been vindicated in 2011 by getting an invite to a bcs league. It really is irritating. It's one thing to have more resources but quite another when you can just change the whole playing field. Sorry to vent but I am stewing right now and I am tired of reading these commissioners saying just shut up and take it.


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You are exactly right. The schools outside of the BCS and now the "P5" have got to band together and sue under the antitrust/monopoly statutes. Our leaders have got to step up and fight if they want to remain part of CFB.

If we don't win so what- we have nothing left to lose

(07-23-2014 09:53 AM)Carolina Stang Wrote:  I simply will never watch a p5 game. Ever.

Won't make a difference , but I will feel better about it. I'm sure many fans will do the same, and overall P5 viewership will diminish.

Good luck with that.

(07-23-2014 10:08 AM)PiratePanther189 Wrote:  Finally, a 4 billion dollar endowment doesn't mean jack diddly squat to an athletic department - otherwise the Ivy League would be in the P5. For the record, Vanderbilt's most recently recorded athletic operating budget is $49 million...that would be just $13 million more than ECU.

Remember, if ECU's athletic operating budget is $37 million, that is probably the most it can be at this moment in time, because ECU is fully committed to having a "big time" athletic program. If ECU could have a $100 million budget, it would, but can't.

In contrast, if Vanderbilt's operating budget is $49 million, it's because that's what Vandy wants it to be. Vandy could have a $150 million athletic budget if they wanted to, they have more than enough money to fund that. But that's not what they want.

Ditto the Ivies. Harvard could have an athletic budget bigger than Alabama's if it wanted to, but that's not the type of institution it wants to be. Don't confuse "don't want" with "can't".