Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

The funding is complete and construction begins right after football season this year.

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

Couldn't disagree more. I'd love to leave usf behind after all the blocking they did, but got to go with water under the bridge.

Ucf and usf combo gives the big 12 a good foot hold in the whole center of Florida which is heavily populated and tons of D1 talent. The amount of coverage ucf/usf get on that rivalry week is huge in this region. We are talking crowds of around 60k at RJS this year for the game. Grab 2 universities in the top 10 enrollment (ucf #2). Basically it is the theory of 1 + 1 = 3.

UConn basketball is awesome, but there is little div 1 talent in Connecticut for football. No real bowls in that area. I'm pretty sure the big 12 wants to lock down teams that have the potential to hang with Texas, Oklahoma, OSU, etc.

Ucf has a better shot at Big 12 and uconn has a better shot at the acc.

(07-16-2014 04:32 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

Couldn't disagree more. I'd love to leave usf behind after all the blocking they did, but got to go with water under the bridge.

Ucf and usf combo gives the big 12 a good foot hold in the whole center of Florida which is heavily populated and tons of D1 talent. The amount of coverage ucf/usf get on that rivalry week is huge in this region. We are talking crowds of around 60k at RJS this year for the game. Grab 2 universities in the top 10 enrollment (ucf #2). Basically it is the theory of 1 + 1 = 3.

UConn basketball is awesome, but there is little div 1 talent in Connecticut for football. No real bowls in that area. I'm pretty sure the big 12 wants to lock down teams that have the potential to hang with Texas, Oklahoma, OSU, etc.

Ucf has a better shot at Big 12 and uconn has a better shot at the acc.

Here's the thing... Neither of you is Florida or Florida State so add one, add both and in either case you don't the whole of central Florida. UCF is the better long term prospect of the two and USF has kind of plateaued.

UConn, in the Big 12 opens up more than just Connecticut it opens up all of new England and perhaps a good chunk of NY/NJ. It's not exactly Florida but they would bring something to the table.

No real bowls in the area? Pinstripe is in their backyard which has a Big12 tie in. UConn is also pretty close to the Military Bowl.

The sum of UCF and USF is not too much greater than each of their parts.

(07-16-2014 04:45 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:32 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

Couldn't disagree more. I'd love to leave usf behind after all the blocking they did, but got to go with water under the bridge.

Ucf and usf combo gives the big 12 a good foot hold in the whole center of Florida which is heavily populated and tons of D1 talent. The amount of coverage ucf/usf get on that rivalry week is huge in this region. We are talking crowds of around 60k at RJS this year for the game. Grab 2 universities in the top 10 enrollment (ucf #2). Basically it is the theory of 1 + 1 = 3.

UConn basketball is awesome, but there is little div 1 talent in Connecticut for football. No real bowls in that area. I'm pretty sure the big 12 wants to lock down teams that have the potential to hang with Texas, Oklahoma, OSU, etc.

Ucf has a better shot at Big 12 and uconn has a better shot at the acc.

Here's the thing... Neither of you is Florida or Florida State so add one, add both and in either case you don't the whole of central Florida. UCF is the better long term prospect of the two and USF has kind of plateaued.

UConn, in the Big 12 opens up more than just Connecticut it opens up all of new England and perhaps a good chunk of NY/NJ. It's not exactly Florida but they would bring something to the table.

No real bowls in the area? Pinstripe is in their backyard which has a Big12 tie in. UConn is also pretty close to the Military Bowl.

The sum of UCF and USF is not too much greater than each of their parts.

You could also argue that adding both would dilute the talent available to the schools compared to staking one school and using that advantage to help grow them.

UConn isn't the only non-FL option that could work well IMO. I think BYU and Cincinnati belong there too.

This post is laughable honestly and I mean no disrespect. UConn is how far from the Big 12??? UConn has only 2 options and they know it. The ACC and the B1G.

As for USF "Plateauing". Don't be absurd. USF is a young program and had a bad coaching hire. We're on our third Head Coach. Yes i said "3rd". USF is rebuilding and righting our ship. Lets see what happens these next 2 years. Then come talk to me.

As for UCF and USF not being Florida. I'll let you in on a little secret. You don't hear and hardly see anyone wearing Miami atire in Tampa these days. You see some FSU and a little Florida. Most of what you see is USF and UCF atire. FSU just won a Mythical national Championship. So yeah their going to get some bandwagoners. However, even the media will tell you that there is an overwhelming rise in the number of USF and UCF atire being displayed in central florida and Flroida as a whole.

I don't need to convince anyone but, the numbers of two of the largest universities in the nation Alumni in an area with expanding Electronics and Aerospace/Aereonautics markets is going to see a rise.

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

I understand that argument - especially when there are already 3 major FB programs in the state already - you're simply not going to get a windfall to recruiting to the newer programs when the state has such dominant in-state programs and national powerhouse out-of-state programs recruiting there already.

I also understand the argument that taking both helps "lock up central Florida" - but I think that argument falls flat. If it's the case that these two programs can lock up recruiting in central Florida, that means they can defend the territory from OhioSt, PennSt, Nebraska, Tennessee, LSU, Alabama etc. I don't believe they can - and if they can't, then there is no advantage to having both (or either) for the "lock-up Florida recruiting" rationale.

But even if by both being in a power conference, they can lock up the state and keep others out, then what advantage is it for the rest of the Big12 conference? Wouldn't they also be locking the other Big12 programs out? I don't think you can argue it both ways.

But I believe that there is one advantage of taking them both. That argument is that almost every conference program could visit Florida each year if you have both schools in the conference. If playing in Florida is an important driver for recruiting, then being on the ground in Florida almost yearly is important.

And I say that hoping that if the Big12 expands, they take Cincinnati and Memphis (or Cincinnati and UConn).

(07-16-2014 07:07 PM)nert Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

I understand that argument - especially when there are already 3 major FB programs in the state already - you're simply not going to get a windfall to recruiting to the newer programs when the state has such dominant in-state programs and national powerhouse out-of-state programs recruiting there already.

I also understand the argument that taking both helps "lock up central Florida" - but I think that argument falls flat. If it's the case that these two programs can lock up recruiting in central Florida, that means they can defend the territory from OhioSt, PennSt, Nebraska, Tennessee, LSU, Alabama etc. I don't believe they can - and if they can't, then there is no advantage to having both (or either) for the "lock-up Florida recruiting" rationale.

But even if by both being in a power conference, they can lock up the state and keep others out, then what advantage is it for the rest of the Big12 conference? Wouldn't they also be locking the other Big12 programs out? I don't think you can argue it both ways.

But I believe that there is one advantage of taking them both. That argument is that almost every conference program could visit Florida each year if you have both schools in the conference. If playing in Florida is an important driver for recruiting, then being on the ground in Florida almost yearly is important.

And I say that hoping that if the Big12 expands, they take Cincinnati and Memphis (or Cincinnati and UConn).

Most of our recruits have multiple bcs offers. We had a recruit last year that was down to ucf or bama. He picked ucf.

Ucf and usf is only going to grow. Won't be long when ucf is forced to expand our stadium. Averaged 43k last year that is near capicity. Where do you think presidents want to "vacation" whoops I mean have presidents meetings?

Ucf and usf do have a strong footprint from Daytona to St Pete. This only expands this territory if we join the big 12. Talking about millions of people here.

(07-16-2014 07:07 PM)nert Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

I understand that argument - especially when there are already 3 major FB programs in the state already - you're simply not going to get a windfall to recruiting to the newer programs when the state has such dominant in-state programs and national powerhouse out-of-state programs recruiting there already.

I also understand the argument that taking both helps "lock up central Florida" - but I think that argument falls flat. If it's the case that these two programs can lock up recruiting in central Florida, that means they can defend the territory from OhioSt, PennSt, Nebraska, Tennessee, LSU, Alabama etc. I don't believe they can - and if they can't, then there is no advantage to having both (or either) for the "lock-up Florida recruiting" rationale.

But even if by both being in a power conference, they can lock up the state and keep others out, then what advantage is it for the rest of the Big12 conference? Wouldn't they also be locking the other Big12 programs out? I don't think you can argue it both ways.

But I believe that there is one advantage of taking them both. That argument is that almost every conference program could visit Florida each year if you have both schools in the conference. If playing in Florida is an important driver for recruiting, then being on the ground in Florida almost yearly is important.

And I say that hoping that if the Big12 expands, they take Cincinnati and Memphis (or Cincinnati and UConn).

Actually I would argue the opposite. Recruiting in Florida is unimportant to the Big 12 schools and they don't help. If anything, elevating them up might hurt the few who do. Having both of them might help get media attention for the Big 12 and both schools and help them fend off South Carolina, Ole Miss, Purdue, etc. They will never be beating out Alabama and LSU and Florida and Florida St. except on rare occasions.

Their benefit would be if they could both be competitive and get media attention for the Big 12. But its still going to be SEC country.

Of course, neither has nearly enough media value now. They aren't even in the top 4 in the AAC. The TV contract says Houston, Cincinnati, Temple and UConn are the "class A" schools. And the Big 12 will not consider Houston (too many Texas teams) or Temple (don't need to explain that) or UConn (too far east). They've had many chances and considered about everyone BUT UConn. They're too much of an island to be beneficial to the Big 12.

(07-16-2014 08:25 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 07:07 PM)nert Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 04:07 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 03:09 PM)USFRamenu Wrote:  Ahem, this thread was about why "The Big 12 should add USF and UCF." not if the AAC should take Buffalo or not.

Here's whats missing in this picture?
http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/print...ge_gallery
1, Beaches
2, Girls in Bikini's
3, Theam Parks
4, Sun

To take it a step further, that article although written in 2013, states, "Planned". Not completed.

Can we get back on topic now.

Honestly were I the B12 I would take one or the other (probably UCF). Taking two schools like USF and UCF together is a waste of a spot that could go to UConn or Cincy...

I understand that argument - especially when there are already 3 major FB programs in the state already - you're simply not going to get a windfall to recruiting to the newer programs when the state has such dominant in-state programs and national powerhouse out-of-state programs recruiting there already.

I also understand the argument that taking both helps "lock up central Florida" - but I think that argument falls flat. If it's the case that these two programs can lock up recruiting in central Florida, that means they can defend the territory from OhioSt, PennSt, Nebraska, Tennessee, LSU, Alabama etc. I don't believe they can - and if they can't, then there is no advantage to having both (or either) for the "lock-up Florida recruiting" rationale.

But even if by both being in a power conference, they can lock up the state and keep others out, then what advantage is it for the rest of the Big12 conference? Wouldn't they also be locking the other Big12 programs out? I don't think you can argue it both ways.

But I believe that there is one advantage of taking them both. That argument is that almost every conference program could visit Florida each year if you have both schools in the conference. If playing in Florida is an important driver for recruiting, then being on the ground in Florida almost yearly is important.

And I say that hoping that if the Big12 expands, they take Cincinnati and Memphis (or Cincinnati and UConn).

Actually I would argue the opposite. Recruiting in Florida is unimportant to the Big 12 schools and they don't help. If anything, elevating them up might hurt the few who do. Having both of them might help get media attention for the Big 12 and both schools and help them fend off South Carolina, Ole Miss, Purdue, etc. They will never be beating out Alabama and LSU and Florida and Florida St. except on rare occasions.

Their benefit would be if they could both be competitive and get media attention for the Big 12. But its still going to be SEC country.

Of course, neither has nearly enough media value now. They aren't even in the top 4 in the AAC. The TV contract says Houston, Cincinnati, Temple and UConn are the "class A" schools. And the Big 12 will not consider Houston (too many Texas teams) or Temple (don't need to explain that) or UConn (too far east). They've had many chances and considered about everyone BUT UConn. They're too much of an island to be beneficial to the Big 12.

Not sure how this so called A group started or why. ESPN had us #1 on their request for the big east #10 expansion team. So that was ahead of houston and temple as so called A team. Now compare football tv ratings...Ucf vs Houston barely had any ratings in their own houston market when it was an away game for them.

If I was UCF, USF, Cincy, Memphis, etc....I would chill for a bit. To be honest, the Big 12's current round-robin scheduling is finally making the Big 12 a cohesive conference. Playing every member every year is awesome! We're finally getting to know the remaining Big 8 schools and WVU too. In a few years we may be in a great place to add a couple schools without making strangers of current members like the Big 10.

(07-16-2014 09:07 PM)FreshPrinceOfDarkness Wrote:  If I was UCF, USF, Cincy, Memphis, etc....I would chill for a bit. To be honest, the Big 12's current round-robin scheduling is finally making the Big 12 a cohesive conference. Playing every member every year is awesome! We're finally getting to know the remaining Big 8 schools and WVU too. In a few years we may be in a great place to add a couple schools without making strangers of current members like the Big 10.

Unless the big 12 is pushed into having a minimum number of teams (aka required championship ) from the other majors, the status quo will continue for a long time. These other conferences just killed natural rivalries for the sake of adding new markets.

The B12 isn't expanding any time soon, so it is all a moot point. They wont be forced to expand, and are making tons of $$$ without a champ game.

(07-16-2014 08:46 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  Not sure how this so called A group started or why.

It was a clause in the TV contract as written up by NBC. They had four teams listed as priority teams, I believe UConn, Cincy, Temple, and Houston, to where if they were to leave the conference the TV contract would be null and void and have to be renegotiated. If one of those teams left, or two of the rest left, it forced a renegotiation. Since ESPN matched the terms of the contract, it should still be a part of the AAC TV agreement.

(07-16-2014 10:38 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  The B12 isn't expanding any time soon, so it is all a moot point. They wont be forced to expand, and are making tons of $$$ without a champ game.

only way they expand is if they get hosed time and again out of the playoff...or if tv says "add a couple of teams and we will cover the difference".

(07-18-2014 10:44 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 10:38 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  The B12 isn't expanding any time soon, so it is all a moot point. They wont be forced to expand, and are making tons of $$$ without a champ game.

only way they expand is if they get hosed time and again out of the playoff...or if tv says "add a couple of teams and we will cover the difference".

This is right. Let's just focus on making the AAC a positive experience IMO.

(07-18-2014 10:44 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 10:38 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  The B12 isn't expanding any time soon, so it is all a moot point. They wont be forced to expand, and are making tons of $$$ without a champ game.

only way they expand is if they get hosed time and again out of the playoff...or if tv says "add a couple of teams and we will cover the difference".

agree, but then again that takes time. When I say not soon I mean as in 3 or 4 years.

(07-16-2014 09:27 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 09:07 PM)FreshPrinceOfDarkness Wrote:  If I was UCF, USF, Cincy, Memphis, etc....I would chill for a bit. To be honest, the Big 12's current round-robin scheduling is finally making the Big 12 a cohesive conference. Playing every member every year is awesome! We're finally getting to know the remaining Big 8 schools and WVU too. In a few years we may be in a great place to add a couple schools without making strangers of current members like the Big 10.

Unless the big 12 is pushed into having a minimum number of teams (aka required championship ) from the other majors, the status quo will continue for a long time. These other conferences just killed natural rivalries for the sake of adding new markets.

Exactly! But if the day comes for the Big 12 to expand, I'm cool with adding UCF. You're definitely an up-and-comer!

I heard Roy Kramer on College Sports XM 91 the other day. Kramer was askedby Greg McElroy if the Big 12 should be made to have a CCG since the other 4 Power conferences have them. Kramer said one of the beauties of college football is that the conferences get to decide what is best for them. Kramer also pointed out the argument for having a CG can both be a positive and a negative for a conference. Kramer thought the Big 12 was wise to extend the regular season so that they would still be playing games when Championship Weekend came around.

In other words, the Big 12 probably won't play a CG anytime in the forseeable future and they definitely won't be force to do it. Which means they probably won't expand unless it is absolutely necessary or the money is just too good to turn down.