(07-17-2014 06:43 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  Sigh, I see we still haven't learned much about markets' "eyeball potential" vs actual living, breathing fan bases. The large fan bases win out every time, see SEC football.

Yes, just because a school is "in" a big market doesn't mean it is delivering that market in any meaningful sense. An empty stadium and no viewers in Philly is really no different than the same in Fort Collins, Colorado.

FV does stand for fuquay varina

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(07-16-2014 11:30 PM)EastCarolinaU. Wrote:  Haha, we are so welcoming to new posters on this site. Tell them their post are dumb and accuse them of being the worst poster on the board. Welcome FV, I hope you have some thick skin, especially if you enter a basketball thread.

I have been following the board for some time and have been a little hesitant to post but enjoy the conversation so decided to start chiming in. Understand the thick skin portion. Thanks

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(07-16-2014 10:03 PM)NBPirate Wrote:  FV is not quo because I am guessing the FV stands for Fuquay-Varina. Quo wouldn't know about that.

FV does stand for Fuquay Varina

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(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

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Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

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Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Agreed, you have to look 'big-boy' on TV and win OOC to be have a shot at the power table.

*and that's for all of us sitting on the outside looking in.

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Yes but if you are a fan of capitalism then you should be upset that ECU with a larger fan base it's kept out of those bowls while Wake Forest with a smaller one is allowed to participate.

(07-16-2014 08:36 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  Not sure who Quo is

(07-16-2014 08:36 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  I have been following the board since ECU became part of the AAC,

I don't know if he is or isn't Quo, but I do know is there is no way possible that both of these statements can be true.

Place an AAC team in the access bowl for 4-5 years straight, so that our conference becomes the "de facto" P6. That helps with the casual fan to recognize the power of our conference.

My fear is that, in the new system, a 12-0 Marshall with a cream puff schedule gets that access spot over an 11-1 UCF, whose lone loss came @ Mizzou.

They can play up SoS all they want, but at the end of the day, I think the selectino committee always favors an undefeated team, becasue it has cache.

We shall see but I think that CUSA is so much weaker that you couple that with Marshall's OCC schedule that they will be penalized for it

(07-17-2014 08:41 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Yes but if you are a fan of capitalism then you should be upset that ECU with a larger fan base it's kept out of those bowls while Wake Forest with a smaller one is allowed to participate.

Actually it doesn't upset me at all b/c I understand risk analy$i$. More often than not the big time P5 programs, with lots of fans will make those bowls. Just look at the averages, that's what the big money bowl folks are interested in, regardless if they happen to end up with a WF or BC every once in a while. IN the long run the return is well worth the risk because the vast majority of the P5's are NOT like the WF and BC's of the world. IN contrast, the vast majority of the G5 looks like WF and BC in terms of attendance... or worse.

Hell, just look how many Arkansas, Iowa State and Miss St fans attended the "lowly (in the P5 view)" Liberty Bowl recently. They aren't exactly known for massive fanbases but they dwarfed ECU, Tulsa and Rice representation. It's a no brainer for the bowls to contract primarily with the P5, preferring a P5 vs P5 matchup.

The risks of losing your ass financially are practically guaranteed if the big $$$ bowls were to contract with a G5 conference. When they contract with a P5 conference, they're going to make money hand over fist more often than not.

(07-17-2014 08:41 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Yes but if you are a fan of capitalism then you should be upset that ECU with a larger fan base it's kept out of those bowls while Wake Forest with a smaller one is allowed to participate.

I am not sure that home attendance is perfectly correlated with "fan base" in a sense that matters to conferences and media. E.g., if in a given year, ECU averages 50,000 attendance and Miami 48,000, it wouldn't make much sense to say ECU has a "larger fan base" when we all know Miami has much greater TV appeal. It's a bit more complicated than just butts in the seats.

(07-17-2014 09:10 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:41 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  

(07-16-2014 05:46 PM)F-V Pirate Wrote:  What does everyone feel it would take for this conference to be considered a power conference and do you feel that will happen

Posted from my mobile device using the CSNbbs App

Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Yes but if you are a fan of capitalism then you should be upset that ECU with a larger fan base it's kept out of those bowls while Wake Forest with a smaller one is allowed to participate.

I am not sure that home attendance is perfectly correlated with "fan base" in a sense that matters to conferences and media. E.g., if in a given year, ECU averages 50,000 attendance and Miami 48,000, it wouldn't make much sense to say ECU has a "larger fan base" when we all know Miami has much greater TV appeal. It's a bit more complicated than just butts in the seats.

Nice of you to pick Miami for your example. Who has won national championships and has created a national image.

Let's talk Wake Forest vs ECU those are the ones I mentioned

Except you can't isolate one school vs. one school. As we all know, that's not how TV deals or bowl ties work.

(07-17-2014 09:13 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 09:10 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:41 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:38 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 08:21 AM)MUsince96 Wrote:  Getting a contract to one of the big 6 bowl games where you'll send a team every year no matter what. Like the other P5.

Aside from that, nothing.

And that will take a LOT more fans from all the G5 conference. Fan bases are what this all boils down to. Without lots of fans the bowls and networks aren't willing to make the financial risk which is completely fair IMHO. I'm an ECU football fan but I'm a bigger fan of capitalism.

Yes but if you are a fan of capitalism then you should be upset that ECU with a larger fan base it's kept out of those bowls while Wake Forest with a smaller one is allowed to participate.

I am not sure that home attendance is perfectly correlated with "fan base" in a sense that matters to conferences and media. E.g., if in a given year, ECU averages 50,000 attendance and Miami 48,000, it wouldn't make much sense to say ECU has a "larger fan base" when we all know Miami has much greater TV appeal. It's a bit more complicated than just butts in the seats.

Nice of you to pick Miami for your example. Who has won national championships and has created a national image.

Let's talk Wake Forest vs ECU those are the ones I mentioned

WF and ECU are not even close. I challenge you to round up 5 Wake fans.

(07-17-2014 09:20 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  Except you can't isolate one school vs. one school. As we all know, that's not how TV deals or bowl ties work.

Yes but if this was really capitalism. Wake Forest would had been dumped to the curb for a school that would bring more fans to the table. In that case it's more like socialism with the big powers in a conference subsidizing members like WF

If the AAC sends a team to the playoffs each season for 3 or 4 straight seasons would that make the AAC a power conference or those programs power programs?

You have UCF in the AAC now coming off a 12-1 season with a solid win over a highly regarded Baylor team in a BCS bowl. You have UConn winning a national championship beating the almighty Kentucky program. It’s going to be pretty tough going up from there and you still don’t have anyone calling the AAC a power conference.

IMO until the AAC TV contract is financially in line with the other 5 major conferences the largest single influencer of people’s sports perceptions, ESPN, has no reason to hype the AAC to the P5 level. I believe getting a contract with those type numbers has more to do with market timing and competition than it does with on field performance or people in the stands. I’m sad to say it’s my opinion that the AAC won’t be considered a P5 until ESPN has enough money invested in the AAC to make it worth their while for the conference to be considered a P5.

The AAC will never command same tv money as the P5. The best this league can do its separate itself from the other G5 and that's achievable. Get a tv contract that makes it the tweener conference between the P5 and the G4.

That's a goal that its attainable and should be the league's focus

(07-17-2014 09:23 AM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-17-2014 09:20 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  Except you can't isolate one school vs. one school. As we all know, that's not how TV deals or bowl ties work.

Yes but if this was really capitalism. Wake Forest would had been dumped to the curb for a school that would bring more fans to the table. In that case it's more like socialism with the big powers in a conference subsidizing members like WF

I guess you're unfamiliar with partnerships and joint ventures as well. There's always what could be viewed as a "lesser / undeserving party" involved somehow. Bottom line is that Wake Forest is liked by their fellow ACC members who have chosen to work with them. That's not socialism. Socialism would be if the other members of the ACC didn't have a say in the matter (WF's membership).