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World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
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miko33 Offline
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Post: #1
World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
I find it interesting that the World Cup was such a huge affair in the world - eclipsing even the hype of the Super Bowl and the NFL playoffs. IMHO, the U.S. fans of the NFL rarely come close to the craziness of soccer fans in Europe, SA/CA, Africa and Asia. Ultimately, it's used as an escape from everyday life. Brazil is a good case study of this. Granted, this may not apply to some of the more developed European nations, but I think it's instinctive for citizens of those countries where freedom is not as prevalent top latch onto something - anything - to make life more tolerable.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/world-cup...sNewsThird

Quote:"Brazil during the cup was like Fantasy Island, but the reality shock will come," said Marcelo Salomon, an economist who follows Brazil at Barclays in New York. "We are in a process of deceleration that has surprised even the biggest pessimists."

Economists have repeatedly lowered their expectations for Brazil's gross domestic product growth this year. Mr. Salomon now projects the nation's economy will expand just 0.7%, down from 1.7%.

Quote:Glimpses of Brazil's deep economic divide were on display at the cup. President Dilma Rousseff, who is seeking a second term, was booed grotesquely by thousands of Brazilians at the opener in June in São Paulo. Yet the former energy minister retains deep support in the poorest parts of the country after her left-wing Workers Party expanded welfare and housing subsidies during 12 years in power.

Polls show Ms. Rousseff, 66 years old, is favored to win another term. The smooth functioning of the World Cup helped boost her latest approval rating to 35%, up after a drop to 33% before the tournament, according to a July 3 poll by the Brazilian firm Datafolha.

"We Brazilians will hold on to the emotion and satisfaction of having held a very successful event," Ms. Rousseff said at the conclusion.

Quote:And while the World Cup was a hit, it hasn't provided the big economic payoff the host was seeking. Brazil planned to use the tournament to spur construction of trains, subways and other infrastructure that would boost its local economies. Many of these so-called legacy projects, such as a planned high-speed train between São Paulo and Rio, were never built, as Brazil focused on basics such as stadiums. At least four of these arenas—Brasilia, Cuiabá, Manaus and Natal—are unlikely to get used much, potentially becoming symbols of overspending.

A partially built highway overpass meant to be finished by the cup collapsed this month, killing two people, not far from the Belo Horizonte stadium where Brazil lost to Germany.

In a self-described nation of soccer where expectations of victory had been high, Brazil's humiliating 7-1 loss to Germany in the semifinal won't do much to lift Brazil's economic mood.

Some Brazilians are already returning to the broader questions about whether the cup's price tag was worth it.

"Now, with this defeat, people are going to look even closer at Brazil's problems, look at what was done, what wasn't done, the quality of the schools, the hospitals," said Rogerio de Souza Ribeiro, a 27-year-old São Paulo doorman.
07-14-2014 08:37 AM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
The WC is on a whole other level than and NFL, NBA, or any other league. You realize this is a three year tournament when you count qualifying games. National pride is just as prevalent in other countries as it is in the US, but in many cases something like the WC is all many people have to hang their hats on.

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07-14-2014 08:59 AM
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oklalittledixie Offline
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RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Soccer is popular in other parts of the world BECAUSE they do not have the NFL, NBA or MLB....not because it is a better or more entertaining sport.

Countries that embrace soccer tend to be under developed or plagued with economic crisis. Soccer, is in many cases is the only outlet.

Soccer will never be embraced in the United States like it is elsewhere. Of course the WC brings in great ratings. It is like the olympics. It only comes around every four years. Americans do not have the attention span or the history to embrace soccer on a regular basis.
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2014 09:10 AM by oklalittledixie.)
07-14-2014 09:10 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #4
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Smart nations are moving away from these gigantic wastes of money.

Brazil's government could fall over the cost of the WC and the Olympics. Brazil spent 20 Billion on the WC. What did they get for their money? A month of tourism, and multiple stadia that will have no use after the games. Manaus, where they spent several hundred million on a stadium, doesn't even have a soccer team. Brasilia's stadium cost over a billion bucks. Brasilia doesn't have a top level Brazilian soccer team.

Putin spent over 51 Billion for the Olympics in Sochi. Russian Oligarchs spent another 20 Billion. Games are over and now....there's little use for those facilities. Russians would rather go to Europe to ski, Turkey/Spain are warmer and nicer, and the whole place is empty.

Russia has announced that it will spend 20 Billion for World Cup 2018. Given the level of corruption and overruns at Sochi, as well as the extreme reluctance of Russian buisnesspersons to donate heavily again, the cost is estimated to rise to 75 Billion. Russia is building massive stadiums in places where there will be little, if any, use for the stadiums after the games. Yekaterinburg and Kaliningrad are two examples.

Qatar isn't even pretending that there will be any use for its stadiums after they host the World Cup in 2022. They're planning on tearing down all the stadium's save one after the games.

And then there's the distaste of the corruption needed to 'win' the games. Many places aren't going to go that route anymore.

------------------

But people are getting smart about it. The IOC opened up bidding for the 2022 Winter Games. They want the games in the Americas or non-CIS Europe. Well there are exactly zero bids from the US, Zero bids from Canada, and Zero bids from Europe. As of now, only two bidders, Beijing and Almaty in Kazakhstan. The IOC is apparently deeply offended and worried that the West, from whom the vast majority of the IOC's legal revenues come from (TV etc.) have basically said "we're washing our hands of the whole mess". If no one in a civilized country is willing to host, then the Winter Games will sink into irrelevance. The feedback that the IOC is getting from some Western venues is, 'we really don't want the games in 2022 and we really don't think we're going to want them anytime in future if this is how we have to bid for the games and spend to produce them'. There are limited places the IOC can host a Winter Olympiad.

---------------------

I think the US should bid on the World Cup in 2026. They should announce that the bid will take the following form. "We will not build any stadiums, but will place the turf of your choosing in the existing stadiums used to host the games. We have any number of fantastic, already built stadiums to propose as venues'. Obviously there's security costs and other costs of putting on the games. So while everyone else is bidding 20 Billion while planning on spending 40 Billion, we will bid 4 Billion to put on the games (which would make the games profitable as a result of TV revenue, licensing revenue etc.).

Basically our bid is a nice way of saying 'you can make the games an orgy of waste, or you can host them without the waste'. We know you'll choose waste, but we just want to highlight that you are choosing waste.

There is some value to hosting the World Cup. The number of fans are greater, they're spread out over a greater area, and they stay for longer periods. But it isn't worth 20 Billion.

-------------------

The Summer Olympics is considered valuable by many nations. I fail to see why. They generate more income than the Winter games, but still involve a ton of wasteful and duplicative spending. Studies have shown that host cities actually have less total tourism in hosting years because the number of people avoiding the host city outweigh the number of tourists who travel there for the 2 weeks of the games. Hosting the games also usually involves massive disruptions to commerce. Every single Summer Olympics has lost money since Barcelona in 1992. And most have lost massive amounts of money. They'res no shortage of cities wishing to host the games. I hope none of them are in the US. But its not like any US city will be awarded the games. The IOC, which is largely funded by the US, is extremely anti-American.
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2014 10:19 AM by Tom in Lazybrook.)
07-14-2014 10:11 AM
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LSU04_08 Offline
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Post: #5
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
On top of the wasted money, think of the damage done by the citizens after losses. The extra policemen, the extra ammunition, etc.
07-14-2014 10:35 AM
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ODUgradstudent Offline
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Post: #6
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 10:11 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Smart nations are moving away from these gigantic wastes of money.

-------------------

The Summer Olympics is considered valuable by many nations. I fail to see why. They generate more income than the Winter games, but still involve a ton of wasteful and duplicative spending.

The London Olympics made a profit.
07-14-2014 10:41 AM
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Smaug Offline
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Post: #7
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Alabama is bottom 10 in most quality of life matrices. But #1 in by-gawd football.
07-14-2014 10:51 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 10:41 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 10:11 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Smart nations are moving away from these gigantic wastes of money.

-------------------

The Summer Olympics is considered valuable by many nations. I fail to see why. They generate more income than the Winter games, but still involve a ton of wasteful and duplicative spending.

The London Olympics made a profit.

Not if you include the costs of converting the Olympic stadium to a football venue. That costs 90 million pounds. The games "profit" was 52 million pounds. There was a lot of 'creative' accounting going on there. London was well run, but it wasn't profitable.
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2014 11:04 AM by Tom in Lazybrook.)
07-14-2014 11:02 AM
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All Dukes_All Day Offline
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Post: #9
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 10:41 AM)ODUgradstudent Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 10:11 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  Smart nations are moving away from these gigantic wastes of money.

-------------------

The Summer Olympics is considered valuable by many nations. I fail to see why. They generate more income than the Winter games, but still involve a ton of wasteful and duplicative spending.

The London Olympics made a profit.

Outside of athletics and quality of women, the British are superior to Brazil in basically every way.
07-14-2014 11:03 AM
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Smaug Offline
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Post: #10
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:03 AM)All Dukes_All Day Wrote:  quality of women

This is no small consideration.
07-14-2014 11:05 AM
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South Carolina Duke Offline
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Post: #11
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Please add food along with the women and athletics comparison of Brazil and UK.
07-14-2014 11:21 AM
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #12
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:21 AM)South Carolina Duke Wrote:  Please add food along with the women and athletics comparison of Brazil and UK.

I'd put weather in there as well. Definitely advantage Brazil.
07-14-2014 11:24 AM
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VA49er Offline
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RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 09:10 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Soccer is popular in other parts of the world BECAUSE they do not have the NFL, NBA or MLB....not because it is a better or more entertaining sport.

Countries that embrace soccer tend to be under developed or plagued with economic crisis. Soccer, is in many cases is the only outlet.

Soccer will never be embraced in the United States like it is elsewhere. Of course the WC brings in great ratings. It is like the olympics. It only comes around every four years. Americans do not have the attention span or the history to embrace soccer on a regular basis.

How do you explain Europe?

I get you don't like soccer and that's cool. However, yesterday my son and I watched the WC final at a neigborhood restaurant/bar. The place was packed and had about 20 TV's all tuned to the match. Not as many folks as when the US played, but still a packed house.
07-14-2014 11:27 AM
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Smaug Offline
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Post: #14
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:27 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 09:10 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Soccer is popular in other parts of the world BECAUSE they do not have the NFL, NBA or MLB....not because it is a better or more entertaining sport.

Countries that embrace soccer tend to be under developed or plagued with economic crisis. Soccer, is in many cases is the only outlet.

Soccer will never be embraced in the United States like it is elsewhere. Of course the WC brings in great ratings. It is like the olympics. It only comes around every four years. Americans do not have the attention span or the history to embrace soccer on a regular basis.

How do you explain Europe?

I get you don't like soccer and that's cool. However, yesterday my son and I watched the WC final at a neigborhood restaurant/bar. The place was packed and had about 20 TV's all tuned to the match. Not as many folks as when the US played, but still a packed house.

Pinko commie.
07-14-2014 11:30 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Man...I am glad it's over. I could not help but giggle at fans crying in the stands after the game. I hope to hell I never get so fcking tied up in any sport that I cry like a girl after the team I support loses. Fcking embarrassing.01-wingedeagle
07-14-2014 11:35 AM
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oklalittledixie Offline
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Post: #16
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:27 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 09:10 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Soccer is popular in other parts of the world BECAUSE they do not have the NFL, NBA or MLB....not because it is a better or more entertaining sport.

Countries that embrace soccer tend to be under developed or plagued with economic crisis. Soccer, is in many cases is the only outlet.

Soccer will never be embraced in the United States like it is elsewhere. Of course the WC brings in great ratings. It is like the olympics. It only comes around every four years. Americans do not have the attention span or the history to embrace soccer on a regular basis.

How do you explain Europe?

I get you don't like soccer and that's cool. However, yesterday my son and I watched the WC final at a neigborhood restaurant/bar. The place was packed and had about 20 TV's all tuned to the match. Not as many folks as when the US played, but still a packed house.

Europe is surrounded by their own enemies. We are not. We are not anything like Europe.
07-14-2014 11:37 AM
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nomad2u2001 Offline
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Post: #17
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:27 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 09:10 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Soccer is popular in other parts of the world BECAUSE they do not have the NFL, NBA or MLB....not because it is a better or more entertaining sport.

Countries that embrace soccer tend to be under developed or plagued with economic crisis. Soccer, is in many cases is the only outlet.

Soccer will never be embraced in the United States like it is elsewhere. Of course the WC brings in great ratings. It is like the olympics. It only comes around every four years. Americans do not have the attention span or the history to embrace soccer on a regular basis.

How do you explain Europe?

I get you don't like soccer and that's cool. However, yesterday my son and I watched the WC final at a neigborhood restaurant/bar. The place was packed and had about 20 TV's all tuned to the match. Not as many folks as when the US played, but still a packed house.

To be fair economic crisis is no stranger in Europe, but underdevelopment in the best countries not so much.

I think it's pretty cool that I have a lot of friends who want to join the Triangle Gooners and give the EPL a chance, which is better quality soccer than the WC.
07-14-2014 11:38 AM
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oklalittledixie Offline
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Post: #18
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
Here are the main reasons soccer will never become mainstream in America

1) The vast majority of Americans simply view soccer as too 'foreign'. Football is the number one sport followed by the great American pastime of baseball and the passion of basketball. These three sports somehow bring forth national and regional pride that cannot be captured by Soccer. There is no feeling of 'closeness' to the teams or the entire idea. In America people are fiercely loyal to their local teams. They display this on their cars and their clothing. It is not only as source of pride in the sport but also in where you are from and who you are.

2) For the vast majority of Americans Soccer is simply boring. There is no blood and guts in the sport. It does not have the intensity of football or even baseball. It does not have the extremes of Basketball. It is just flat out boring to watch. Yes, as children we like to play it but certainly don't want to actually watch it unless our kids are playing the sport. Then we are forced to be in the audience but to spend an entire Sunday watching Soccer is just not in the DNA of most Americans who crave a harder sport with more excitement.

3) Even the scoring of Soccer is boring. Many Americans just shake their head over the whole score concept of Soccer and force out a yawn when asked.

4) There is simply no strategy in Soccer. It is no where near as strategic as football.

5) We are not surrounded by nations that are our adversaries. No other nation is our equal, therefore, global rivalries are not as important to us as they are to less powerful nations.
07-14-2014 11:44 AM
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nomad2u2001 Offline
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Post: #19
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:44 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Here are the main reasons soccer will never become mainstream in America

1) The vast majority of Americans simply view soccer as too 'foreign'. Football is the number one sport followed by the great American pastime of baseball and the passion of basketball. These three sports somehow bring forth national and regional pride that cannot be captured by Soccer. There is no feeling of 'closeness' to the teams or the entire idea. In America people are fiercely loyal to their local teams. They display this on their cars and their clothing. It is not only as source of pride in the sport but also in where you are from and who you are.

2) For the vast majority of Americans Soccer is simply boring. There is no blood and guts in the sport. It does not have the intensity of football or even baseball. It does not have the extremes of Basketball. It is just flat out boring to watch. Yes, as children we like to play it but certainly don't want to actually watch it unless our kids are playing the sport. Then we are forced to be in the audience but to spend an entire Sunday watching Soccer is just not in the DNA of most Americans who crave a harder sport with more excitement.

3) Even the scoring of Soccer is boring. Many Americans just shake their head over the whole score concept of Soccer and force out a yawn when asked.

4) There is simply no strategy in Soccer. It is no where near as strategic as football.

5) We are not surrounded by nations that are our adversaries. No other nation is our equal, therefore, global rivalries are not as important to us as they are to less powerful nations.

Your opinion was just as valid as any other until this point.
07-14-2014 11:52 AM
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oklalittledixie Offline
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Post: #20
RE: World Cup - Escape from Reality aka "Bread and Circuses"
(07-14-2014 11:52 AM)nomad2u2001 Wrote:  
(07-14-2014 11:44 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Here are the main reasons soccer will never become mainstream in America

1) The vast majority of Americans simply view soccer as too 'foreign'. Football is the number one sport followed by the great American pastime of baseball and the passion of basketball. These three sports somehow bring forth national and regional pride that cannot be captured by Soccer. There is no feeling of 'closeness' to the teams or the entire idea. In America people are fiercely loyal to their local teams. They display this on their cars and their clothing. It is not only as source of pride in the sport but also in where you are from and who you are.

2) For the vast majority of Americans Soccer is simply boring. There is no blood and guts in the sport. It does not have the intensity of football or even baseball. It does not have the extremes of Basketball. It is just flat out boring to watch. Yes, as children we like to play it but certainly don't want to actually watch it unless our kids are playing the sport. Then we are forced to be in the audience but to spend an entire Sunday watching Soccer is just not in the DNA of most Americans who crave a harder sport with more excitement.

3) Even the scoring of Soccer is boring. Many Americans just shake their head over the whole score concept of Soccer and force out a yawn when asked.

4) There is simply no strategy in Soccer. It is no where near as strategic as football.

5) We are not surrounded by nations that are our adversaries. No other nation is our equal, therefore, global rivalries are not as important to us as they are to less powerful nations.

Your opinion was just as valid as any other until this point.

Just trying to give you the reasons.
07-14-2014 11:57 AM
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