(07-11-2014 10:38 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  ??? First off, the MWC does not provide much more national exposure than CUSA, if any...unless you're Boise State.

and it's not them MWC that brings Boise that exposure... It's going undefeated and/or beating p5 schools that brings them that exposure...

(07-11-2014 10:38 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  ...this has been discussed ad nauseum in other threads...

(07-11-2014 10:41 AM)mrbig Wrote:  ...But we've discussed both possibilities a lot on here...

Sorry, I looked and even did a search but found nothing.

(07-11-2014 10:41 AM)mrbig Wrote:  The general consensus is that while Rice would probable construct a decent schedule as an independent (football only), it would be nearly impossible to get invited to bowls because we don't have the national following of other independents.

Agree, I think Rice would be able to pull off decent schedules as an Independent. I know that Rice was able to get Northwestern recently and would probably be able to regularly schedule other "academic peers" such as Vanderbilt, Duke, Stanford, etc., basically the talked about/rumored "Magnolia Conference."

Out of curiosity, which conference(s) would be options for Rice to place its non-football sports, if it did go Independent? I'm assuming that keeping non-football sports in CUSA would not be an option.

(07-11-2014 10:41 AM)mrbig Wrote:  As for the MWC, its kind of like a west coast version of CUSA. I don't think the gap between the two conferences in money or quality opponents, to the extent it is there at all, makes up for likely increased travel costs and decreased local exposure (no other Texas teams). At least right now Rice plays UTSA, North Texas, Southern Miss, and La Tech, which are all close enough for somewhat easy travel.

I brought up the MWC because the discussion here seemed to focus on increasing West Coast (specifically Cal) recruiting opportunities. The MWC would provide access to the areas being talked about.

There's also this: Adding Rice, on the MWC board.

I don't think the MWC will expand any time soon, but it makes sense that if it did, it would target a group of 2-4 Texas schools.

(07-11-2014 11:21 AM)TARDledo Wrote:  I brought up the MWC because the discussion here seemed to focus on increasing West Coast (specifically Cal) recruiting opportunities. The MWC would provide access to the areas being talked about.

There's also this: Adding Rice, on the MWC board.

I don't think the MWC will expand any time soon, but it makes sense that if it did, it would target a group of 2-4 Texas schools.

Not a focus per se. Just comments about schools and areas we are familiar with who happen to also be hotbeds of athletic talent.

While it helps, you don't need the MWC to try and recruit these areas. The only thing that schools like Fresno can offer Cali recruits that Rice can't are proximity to their homes for 6-8 games a year... That's not nothing by any means, but SOME people like to leave home for college and obviously we have a superior academic reputation.

The point is that a kid who might not be a perfect fit for Stanford, USC or Cal due to factors like scholarship limits, style and need etc might not really fit academically with anyone in the MWC, but those are their likely alternatives.... Rice might be a better fit.

Rice will always get the vast majority of its recruits from our back yard... and we are in a good place for talent... but it couldn't hurt to develop a reputation as an athletic alternative to Stanford, Cal or USC that doesn't cost you for the rest of your life

Based on what I know of the revenue and exposure differences between the MWC and CUSA, I wouldn't sacrifice so many games in our own back yard for a few recruits from the west by joining the MWC.... but I certainly don't think that the arguments that should work in CUSA (that we offer essentially the same athletic opportunity with a FAR superior academic one) doesn't also hold true against schools in the Belt, MWC, WAC, AAC and others.

(07-10-2014 10:43 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(07-10-2014 10:34 AM)grol Wrote:  I agree with Walt about Houston's image nationally. Houston is the subject of stupid jokes on TV. Rice is relatively unknown -- off the radar screen. But, once you're here, you end up liking Houston and Rice a lot.

Who says? Seriously? I can only speak for myself, but as much as I love Rice and truly miss not being a season ticketholder at all sporting events, there is no way I'm going to live in Houston. I do make 6 - 10 trips a year down to campus-- for Rice Baseball, Homecoming and Advisory Board meetings, but I'm not a big fan of Houston as a city.

Walt, I have been a banker for 42 years, 37 in Houston, the other 5 in NYC, and 2 years in Philly for grad school. I have known many fellow bankers and energy execs who moved to Houston from all over the US, Europe, and Mexico. Many of them came reluctantly, but virtually all have stayed, and have come to love Houston and now would never consider leaving. People here are friendly, rarely cliquish, and the business climate is great. Both of my daughters went to Rice and both are quite liberal feminists. One, a social worker, lives here while the other is, for now, a NY lawyer...so, quite different. I have many close Rice friends who came to Rice from hither and yon, but have spent most of their life here. So, my conclusion is that Houston is a hard sell for most auchlanders, but once here they happily stay. I am not criticizing, but from my experience you are the exception, not the rule.

(07-11-2014 02:00 PM)RiceDad Wrote:  

(07-10-2014 10:43 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(07-10-2014 10:34 AM)grol Wrote:  I agree with Walt about Houston's image nationally. Houston is the subject of stupid jokes on TV. Rice is relatively unknown -- off the radar screen. But, once you're here, you end up liking Houston and Rice a lot.

Who says? Seriously? I can only speak for myself, but as much as I love Rice and truly miss not being a season ticketholder at all sporting events, there is no way I'm going to live in Houston. I do make 6 - 10 trips a year down to campus-- for Rice Baseball, Homecoming and Advisory Board meetings, but I'm not a big fan of Houston as a city.

Walt, I have been a banker for 42 years, 37 in Houston, the other 5 in NYC, and 2 years in Philly for grad school. I have known many fellow bankers and energy execs who moved to Houston from all over the US, Europe, and Mexico. Many of them came reluctantly, but virtually all have stayed, and have come to love Houston and now would never consider leaving. People here are friendly, rarely cliquish, and the business climate is great. Both of my daughters went to Rice and both are quite liberal feminists. One, a social worker, lives here while the other is, for now, a NY lawyer...so, quite different. I have many close Rice friends who came to Rice from hither and yon, but have spent most of their life here. So, my conclusion is that Houston is a hard sell for most auchlanders, but once here they happily stay. I am not criticizing, but from my experience you are the exception, not the rule.

And you could be right. Personly, I hate hot, humid weather, but I certainly agree on the friendliness of Houstonians. The key point of my original response and post, confirmed by the head of Admissions, is that Houston and Texas is a very hard sell for out of staters ; particularly those from either coast.

(07-11-2014 02:27 PM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(07-11-2014 02:00 PM)RiceDad Wrote:  

(07-10-2014 10:43 AM)waltgreenberg Wrote:  

(07-10-2014 10:34 AM)grol Wrote:  I agree with Walt about Houston's image nationally. Houston is the subject of stupid jokes on TV. Rice is relatively unknown -- off the radar screen. But, once you're here, you end up liking Houston and Rice a lot.

Who says? Seriously? I can only speak for myself, but as much as I love Rice and truly miss not being a season ticketholder at all sporting events, there is no way I'm going to live in Houston. I do make 6 - 10 trips a year down to campus-- for Rice Baseball, Homecoming and Advisory Board meetings, but I'm not a big fan of Houston as a city.

Walt, I have been a banker for 42 years, 37 in Houston, the other 5 in NYC, and 2 years in Philly for grad school. I have known many fellow bankers and energy execs who moved to Houston from all over the US, Europe, and Mexico. Many of them came reluctantly, but virtually all have stayed, and have come to love Houston and now would never consider leaving. People here are friendly, rarely cliquish, and the business climate is great. Both of my daughters went to Rice and both are quite liberal feminists. One, a social worker, lives here while the other is, for now, a NY lawyer...so, quite different. I have many close Rice friends who came to Rice from hither and yon, but have spent most of their life here. So, my conclusion is that Houston is a hard sell for most auchlanders, but once here they happily stay. I am not criticizing, but from my experience you are the exception, not the rule.

And you could be right. Personly, I hate hot, humid weather, but I certainly agree on the friendliness of Houstonians. The key point of my original response and post, confirmed by the head of Admissions, is that Houston and Texas is a very hard sell for out of staters ; particularly those from either coast.

I agree, so we have to do a better sales job. I would think California is mostly wasted effort, but there are lots of people who I have met that just don't like cold/snow, so there are right places for all of us. We just need to match things up!

(07-11-2014 02:42 PM)RiceDad Wrote:  I agree, so we have to do a better sales job. I would think California is mostly wasted effort, but there are lots of people who I have met that just don't like cold/snow, so there are right places for all of us. We just need to match things up!

It's averaged about 108 in the Central Valley this week (where Fresno State is) with a high of 112... and unlike Houston, even the valley is 'built' for people to be outside, not inside.

So while it would certainly be a tough sell vs the Bay Area or San Diego in THAT regard, it's not bad vs LA and the CV.

I'm not saying it's easy... I'm merely saying that every year we get students from across the country... and lots of places where non p-5 schools are have just as many drawbacks as Houston.... not as many have the advantages of Houston, and almost NONE have the advantages of Rice.

We have sufficient talent to recruit from in the greater Houston area (not to mention other Texas cities) to be a top 20 team at some point if we keep this momentum up, without having to go national.

Stanford is in the enviable position, with P5, school prestige and their enormous athletic endowment, to go after 4 and 5 star players across the country - which puts them in the top 10 year in and out. But - I'll take top 20 (for the time being).

The P5 has positives and negatives. Positives being recruiting and $$$$$$. Negatives are that you have a play a damn good team every week - see TCU now that they are in the Big 12. When they were in the MWC they were a top 5 team; not no mo'.