They will bring wrestling to the MAC which already has Missouri as part of its ranks.

(06-16-2014 05:02 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  Here is the thing.

A lot of those extra sports are regional niche sports that were not historically popular/important in the south.

Wrestling, ice hockey, field hockey, lacrosse, water polo, rowing etc

The only sport I'm surprised is not more prominent in the SEC is Rifle.

Of all the SEC schools, only Kentucky and South Carolina field men's soccer. Vandy briefly had a team. I'm a little surprised Florida, Georgia or Mizzou don't have it. I know it's not historically popular/important in the south, but most of the ACC sponsors men's soccer. Guess the preference just varies from school to school.

(06-16-2014 05:21 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-16-2014 05:05 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(06-16-2014 04:50 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-16-2014 04:12 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(06-15-2014 06:34 PM)JRsec Wrote:  A long time ago 1960's - mid 1970's Auburn was an annual wrestling top 10. We weren't quite where Iowa and Oklahoma State were but we were close. There were other wrestling programs in the SEC. All were a victim of Title 9. We have numerous wrestling programs at the high school level, but most of them are located in large metropolitan areas. The set up for them is travel intensive so poorer kids opt for other sports. But overall I agree that the talent level isn't there in sufficient numbers to supply the 14 members of the SEC with talent in each discipline and weight class.

It's ridiculous to suggest that SEC schools are hindered by Title IX.

Somehow half the MAC schools are able to sponsor more than the requisite 16 NCAA sports despite having less than 1/2 the revenue of the lowest SEC school. Somehow Ohio State is able to sponsor 39 sports despite having revenue only 10% higher than the top SEC schools (Florida and Alabama, which only sponsor 21 sports apiece).

Most SEC schools have made an institutional decision to spend every possible penny on their football programs. If they could get away with cutting every other sport except men's basketball and baseball, most SEC schools would do so (except Tennessee, who would also keep WBB). Other sports be damned.

The decision on wrestling happened at the end of the 1975 season. It wasn't about the money back then and the SEC wasn't flush when it had to make the decisions. Women's soccer, basketball, track & field (indoor and outdoor), swimming and diving, tennis, golf, and softball all came into existence. Since then Equestrian and Volleyball have been added. Now that the media money is coming in other men's sports can be added back if there is enough interest.

Your post interjected opinions that would not have been reflective of the situation in 1975. In 1975 Title 9 was a burden that led to some drastic decisions. Football revenue was nothing then like it is now. In 1975 a season ticket book for football was $100 today it aprx. $500. In 1975 a donation to the Athletic Fund was not required to buy season books, today the minimum contribution for the privilege of buying a pair of books is $600 for end zone, $800 for upper deck, and $1200 and up for regular sideline seating in addition to the $1,000 for the pair of season books. In 1975 student tickets were $2. The lucrativeness of football money in the SEC is only about three decades old and yes it is one of three money making sports with basketball and baseball being the other two. Most SEC schools offer 20 or more varsity sports, but 18 are required.

Are you suggesting that the MAC had similar budgets to the SEC in the 70s & 80s? Or that Ohio State had ticket prices/tv revenue that grew substantially less than the SEC over the last 30 years? I don't have the numbers, but I highly doubt that.

Even if those comparisons are invalid 30 years ago, startup costs for non-revenue sports are extremely low. It would have been easy to restart a program as revenues increased in the 90s-00s. Instead, SEC schools have chosen to build palaces for football players and have coaching budgets for football that are larger than the entire athletic budget at many D-1 schools.

I am suggesting that it was the Georgia and Oklahoma case against the NCAA over TV rights that cut the floods of money loose on athletic departments and the torrent began to pour in about 1981 to 83 and has been increasing ever since. In 1975 Title IX hurt everybody, Ohio State, the MAC and others included. In the South where wrestling has never been as popular as other sports it was one of the first casualties of Title IX. Baseball was cut at some institutions in the North. Historically the Big 10 has always had more money to put into sports than the other conferences. The SEC's arrival as a top money earner began in the late 1980's. In the 1970's and early 80's business had not yet fled the North to get away from unions and populations shifts were not as discernible. You are trying to make an apples to apples comparison that simply didn't exist. In 1975 the SEC had only been integrated for 4 years and that not successfully. It was a conference of 10 Southern schools from predominantly poor states. Florida had not boomed in 1975. Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia, Louisiana, Kentucky, and Tennessee were all poor states.

I'm just saying that you are trying to make 2014 comparisons for 1975 and claiming in a very misinformed way that the changes hit everyone in equal percentages, which simply wasn't so. I might also add that in the 1970's the MAC was probably at the peak of its athletic prominence and was quite competitive in many sports. The Big 10 was king. Comparing the SEC circa 1970's to the Big 10 is not the comparison it is today. The economic and political power of the South circa 1970's is nowhere near where it would stand today. When you've lived over 6 decades you know these things without having to be told. Hell in 1963 we had a beach home south of Panama City, Florida. It was 2 and a half miles to our nearest neighbor. Think about that?! By the 1980's that world was gone forever. More change has happened in the South since 1975 until today than happened from 1963 until the 1980's and those two decades saw oodles of change.

Funny that you mention that as that was the time when the MAC had a number of wins against the SEC in Tangerine Bowl games. Odd times back then.

If the SEC somehow wound up with Oklahoma and/or Oklahoma State, there might be some incentive for schools to start wrestling and women's lacrosse (Florida and Vanderbilt already have programs). SECN will need something other than baseball and softball for the spring months. Wrestling also adds some variety to the schedule during the winter.

(06-16-2014 05:02 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  Here is the thing.

A lot of those extra sports are regional niche sports that were not historically popular/important in the south.

Wrestling, ice hockey, field hockey, lacrosse, water polo, rowing etc

The only sport I'm surprised is not more prominent in the SEC is Rifle.

Now that you mention it I'm surprised to hear that too. Seton Hall of all places has rifle. You guys have shotgun? Is that even an NCAA sanctioned sport? If it isn't it ought to be.

I think OSU will stay in the B1G and I can't the SEC adding a MAC team.

(06-17-2014 09:20 PM)perimeterpost Wrote:  I think OSU will stay in the B1G and I can't the SEC adding a MAC team.

I took a different angle to that, back on page 1:

(06-14-2014 12:27 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  Oh, both the Buckeyes and the Bobcats would be welcome to wrestle in the MAC. Heck, the MAC allowed Big12 school Mizzou to join the MAC for wrestling when Mizzou joined the SEC, despite the fact that Mizzou (as could have been and probably was anticipated) has dominated the MAC championship in the two year since joining.