(06-18-2014 08:30 AM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  If you're judging by dominance, the 1901 Michigan team didn't allow a single point scored all season, going 11-0 with an average score of 55-0. They won the first Rose Bowl 49-0 over Stanford.

Michigan's 11-0 1902 team came close, only allowing 14 points scored against. They had a higher score differential than the 1901 team, scoring over 85 points in 4 games.

Pitt's 1910 team was 9-0 with a collective score of 282-0.

Pitt's 1904 team went 10-0, but was scored against, going a collective 406-5.

Pitt's 1915, 16, and 17 teams under Pop Warner were a combined 26-0 and outscored opponents by a collective 762-62.

If Urban brought it up, it must be last night's dinner.

This is a worthless thread since football has evolved (equipment, rule changes, etc.) over the decades and great teams have come and gone.

Bottom line - there is no "best" college football team.

2001 Miami Hurricanes.
As already mentioned, that team was stacked!


Honorable mention: 1938 Duke Blue Devils
Five hundred and 59 minutes of shutout football forever tainted by the 560th: with 40 seconds left in the Rose Bowl, USC scored its only points of the game on a 16-yard touchdown pass to win 7-3. It was Duke's only loss and only points yielded that season.

Yeah aid also give my vote to the 01 Canes.

01 Canes had the most raw talent but a few things make them the most overrated of these teams IMO.

1- They had the MOST talent on their 2 deep but the actual players on the 2 deep isn't much farther ahead than teams like 95 Nebraska, 98 Tennessee, 99 FSU, 02 OSU, 04 USC, 05 Texas, 08 Florida, or 09 Bama in terms of # of NFL players. We can nitpick which guys where what caliber of pro player all we want but the net effect is that the other contenders will have enough talent on hand to be head and shoulders above what Miami saw in 2001 and raw talent isn't going to overwhelm them unless scheme is on the Canes side.

People really don't look at who actually played then. Players like Kellen Winslow, Sean Taylor, and Antrel Rolle were backups to some good but not great upperclassmen. Winslow was a 210 pound third string WR/TE that played behind both Shockey and an undrafted senior Robert Williams. Taylor played behind the Reed (who everyone knows) & James Lewis (who few people know). Rolle was MAYBE the 4th best corner after NFL busts Rumph & Buchanon and relative unknown Markese Fitzgerald. Wilfork was a very good freshman but he wasn't the Wilfork he was for his NFL career or else there is no way 6'5 270 Matt Walters would have been in the DT rotation ahead of him.

2- They were unbeaten but had pretty simplistic schemes, a flaw that would get Coker fired later when he didn't have the overwhelming talent advantages he once did. Particularly against spread to run teams they would struggle. They usually played 2 deep man under and teams like 2002 WV and 2002 VT racked up lots of yards from the QB spot with a spread to run approach against the same nickel front 6 that 01 Cane's used. WVU had 363 yards rushing despite Rasheed Marshall having very limited passing capability. If we are pitting the best teams against each other I give Miami very little chance of slowing down 2010 Auburn, 2005 Texas, or 2008 Florida.

3- Special teams- Why were the Miami-VT games always closer than they should have been? Because Miami got it's butt handed to them in the kicking game. VT had big returns and blocked kicks keep them in games where they simply shouldn't have been. The better special teams units in this discussion like 2008 Florida (8 blocked kicks, great at punt returns), 2009 Bama (6 blocked kicks, good return averages), or 2005 Texas (9 blocked kicks, 4 return td's, outstanding coverage teams) would own a consistent field position advantage on them because of it and it would hurt the Canes.

4- Opposition: The Nebraska team they played for the title was questionable on offense (shut down by TCU, OU, ND, and KSU) and had some horrendous moments on defense (Colorado hanging 62 on them with 380 on the ground, outmanned Texas Tech air rading 31 points and 440 yards against that secondary). The Huskers also didn't have near the talent of the other teams in this discussion or the talent the 90's huskers did with only 6 NFL guys. Washington was not a good defensive team and couldn't run the ball consistently, basically dependent on their freshman QB, WR, and freak TE to throw them to victory. VT had NO offense at all. Syracuse had dwight freeney but nobody in the secondary to match up to Johnson or Shockey and an iffy offense. Florida State had a bad defense and a freshman Chris Rix that turned it over 6 times. I do not see elite opposition that I see with most of the other programs here.

Miami would definitely belong but they really would struggle with some of these teams.

I always thought the 2000 Miami team was on par or maybe better the '01 team, despite the Washington loss. They beat a strong Florida State team that played for the NC and beat #2 VT (with Vick) by nearly 3 TDs. And they had no trouble at all with SEC champ Florida in the Sugar Bowl.

2000 would have been a great year for the CFB playoff...OU, Miami, Florida State, Washington all in the mix.

(06-19-2014 09:28 AM)Hokie4Skins Wrote:  I always thought the 2000 Miami team was on par or maybe better the '01 team, despite the Washington loss. They beat a strong Florida State team that played for the NC and beat #2 VT (with Vick) by nearly 3 TDs. And they had no trouble at all with SEC champ Florida in the Sugar Bowl.

2000 would have been a great year for the CFB playoff...OU, Miami, Florida State, Washington all in the mix.

They were good but wasn't Vick on a bad ankle that killed his mobility for that 2000 game? That is a huge advantage.

2005 USC Trojans...oh wait... (someone will get that).

Has to be one of the Miami teams.

(06-19-2014 08:54 AM)1845 Bear Wrote:  01 Canes had the most raw talent but a few things make them the most overrated of these teams IMO.

1- They had the MOST talent on their 2 deep but the actual players on the 2 deep isn't much farther ahead than teams like 95 Nebraska, 98 Tennessee, 99 FSU, 02 OSU, 04 USC, 05 Texas, 08 Florida, or 09 Bama in terms of # of NFL players. We can nitpick which guys where what caliber of pro player all we want but the net effect is that the other contenders will have enough talent on hand to be head and shoulders above what Miami saw in 2001 and raw talent isn't going to overwhelm them unless scheme is on the Canes side.

People really don't look at who actually played then. Players like Kellen Winslow, Sean Taylor, and Antrel Rolle were backups to some good but not great upperclassmen. Winslow was a 210 pound third string WR/TE that played behind both Shockey and an undrafted senior Robert Williams. Taylor played behind the Reed (who everyone knows) & James Lewis (who few people know). Rolle was MAYBE the 4th best corner after NFL busts Rumph & Buchanon and relative unknown Markese Fitzgerald. Wilfork was a very good freshman but he wasn't the Wilfork he was for his NFL career or else there is no way 6'5 270 Matt Walters would have been in the DT rotation ahead of him.

2- They were unbeaten but had pretty simplistic schemes, a flaw that would get Coker fired later when he didn't have the overwhelming talent advantages he once did. Particularly against spread to run teams they would struggle. They usually played 2 deep man under and teams like 2002 WV and 2002 VT racked up lots of yards from the QB spot with a spread to run approach against the same nickel front 6 that 01 Cane's used. WVU had 363 yards rushing despite Rasheed Marshall having very limited passing capability. If we are pitting the best teams against each other I give Miami very little chance of slowing down 2010 Auburn, 2005 Texas, or 2008 Florida.

3- Special teams- Why were the Miami-VT games always closer than they should have been? Because Miami got it's butt handed to them in the kicking game. VT had big returns and blocked kicks keep them in games where they simply shouldn't have been. The better special teams units in this discussion like 2008 Florida (8 blocked kicks, great at punt returns), 2009 Bama (6 blocked kicks, good return averages), or 2005 Texas (9 blocked kicks, 4 return td's, outstanding coverage teams) would own a consistent field position advantage on them because of it and it would hurt the Canes.

4- Opposition: The Nebraska team they played for the title was questionable on offense (shut down by TCU, OU, ND, and KSU) and had some horrendous moments on defense (Colorado hanging 62 on them with 380 on the ground, outmanned Texas Tech air rading 31 points and 440 yards against that secondary). The Huskers also didn't have near the talent of the other teams in this discussion or the talent the 90's huskers did with only 6 NFL guys. Washington was not a good defensive team and couldn't run the ball consistently, basically dependent on their freshman QB, WR, and freak TE to throw them to victory. VT had NO offense at all. Syracuse had dwight freeney but nobody in the secondary to match up to Johnson or Shockey and an iffy offense. Florida State had a bad defense and a freshman Chris Rix that turned it over 6 times. I do not see elite opposition that I see with most of the other programs here.

Miami would definitely belong but they really would struggle with some of these teams.

I kind of agree with that...that Nebraska team they played was not very good, and it robs 2001 Miami of a chance to cement their legacy. The national championship game clearly elevates 1995 Nebraska over 2001 Miami in my mind, draftees or not.

Miami had the talent for sure, but as mentioned, based on Coker's body of work, there's no reason to think that all that talent was maximized in their performance as a "team".

(06-20-2014 02:21 PM)Lou_C Wrote:  

(06-19-2014 08:54 AM)1845 Bear Wrote:  01 Canes had the most raw talent but a few things make them the most overrated of these teams IMO.

1- They had the MOST talent on their 2 deep but the actual players on the 2 deep isn't much farther ahead than teams like 95 Nebraska, 98 Tennessee, 99 FSU, 02 OSU, 04 USC, 05 Texas, 08 Florida, or 09 Bama in terms of # of NFL players. We can nitpick which guys where what caliber of pro player all we want but the net effect is that the other contenders will have enough talent on hand to be head and shoulders above what Miami saw in 2001 and raw talent isn't going to overwhelm them unless scheme is on the Canes side.

People really don't look at who actually played then. Players like Kellen Winslow, Sean Taylor, and Antrel Rolle were backups to some good but not great upperclassmen. Winslow was a 210 pound third string WR/TE that played behind both Shockey and an undrafted senior Robert Williams. Taylor played behind the Reed (who everyone knows) & James Lewis (who few people know). Rolle was MAYBE the 4th best corner after NFL busts Rumph & Buchanon and relative unknown Markese Fitzgerald. Wilfork was a very good freshman but he wasn't the Wilfork he was for his NFL career or else there is no way 6'5 270 Matt Walters would have been in the DT rotation ahead of him.

2- They were unbeaten but had pretty simplistic schemes, a flaw that would get Coker fired later when he didn't have the overwhelming talent advantages he once did. Particularly against spread to run teams they would struggle. They usually played 2 deep man under and teams like 2002 WV and 2002 VT racked up lots of yards from the QB spot with a spread to run approach against the same nickel front 6 that 01 Cane's used. WVU had 363 yards rushing despite Rasheed Marshall having very limited passing capability. If we are pitting the best teams against each other I give Miami very little chance of slowing down 2010 Auburn, 2005 Texas, or 2008 Florida.

3- Special teams- Why were the Miami-VT games always closer than they should have been? Because Miami got it's butt handed to them in the kicking game. VT had big returns and blocked kicks keep them in games where they simply shouldn't have been. The better special teams units in this discussion like 2008 Florida (8 blocked kicks, great at punt returns), 2009 Bama (6 blocked kicks, good return averages), or 2005 Texas (9 blocked kicks, 4 return td's, outstanding coverage teams) would own a consistent field position advantage on them because of it and it would hurt the Canes.

4- Opposition: The Nebraska team they played for the title was questionable on offense (shut down by TCU, OU, ND, and KSU) and had some horrendous moments on defense (Colorado hanging 62 on them with 380 on the ground, outmanned Texas Tech air rading 31 points and 440 yards against that secondary). The Huskers also didn't have near the talent of the other teams in this discussion or the talent the 90's huskers did with only 6 NFL guys. Washington was not a good defensive team and couldn't run the ball consistently, basically dependent on their freshman QB, WR, and freak TE to throw them to victory. VT had NO offense at all. Syracuse had dwight freeney but nobody in the secondary to match up to Johnson or Shockey and an iffy offense. Florida State had a bad defense and a freshman Chris Rix that turned it over 6 times. I do not see elite opposition that I see with most of the other programs here.

Miami would definitely belong but they really would struggle with some of these teams.

I kind of agree with that...that Nebraska team they played was not very good, and it robs 2001 Miami of a chance to cement their legacy. The national championship game clearly elevates 1995 Nebraska over 2001 Miami in my mind, draftees or not.

Miami had the talent for sure, but as mentioned, based on Coker's body of work, there's no reason to think that all that talent was maximized in their performance as a "team".

Question for you:

2013 vs 1999 vs 1993... which Noles win?

(06-19-2014 06:26 AM)mac6115cd Wrote:  This is a worthless thread since football has evolved (equipment, rule changes, etc.) over the decades and great teams have come and gone.

Bottom line - there is no "best" college football team.

You're missing the point. It's a fun discussion because there is no "right answer". Like arguing whether Babe Ruth or Willie Mays was better.