Everything old is new again.

Until 1973 there were no NCAA scholarship limits in football. You had "College Division" schools who awarded more scholarships than "University Division", they were College Division based on their schedule and the number of sports sponsored. Scholarship limits (if any) were determined by each conference and independents were free to award as many as they could afford and deal with.

Until 1992 not every FBS/I-A conference even had the same scholarship limits despite the NCAA setting a cap.

The big boys don't want to break away, they want the old days back. They don't care if CUSA is in the same division with them they just want to set their own aid rules and it's up to you to figure out if you want to mirror those rules or do something different.

(06-02-2014 01:23 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Everything old is new again.

Until 1973 there were no NCAA scholarship limits in football. You had "College Division" schools who awarded more scholarships than "University Division", they were College Division based on their schedule and the number of sports sponsored. Scholarship limits (if any) were determined by each conference and independents were free to award as many as they could afford and deal with.

Until 1992 not every FBS/I-A conference even had the same scholarship limits despite the NCAA setting a cap.

The big boys don't want to break away, they want the old days back. They don't care if CUSA is in the same division with them they just want to set their own aid rules and it's up to you to figure out if you want to mirror those rules or do something different.

Correct...

the limit on scholarships is what made the difference in some schools outside of the P5(6) being able to compete on the field and court.

Before that schools could take a lot more chances on developing talent and it was OK if that talent only panned out for their Sr season.

But going back to that today will not work like before...

transfers will skyrocket from the p5

I don't think they want to raise the number of scholarships, at least anytime soon.

But would be funny is if they approve 4 year guaranteed scholarships and stipends and no one else adopts stipends. How are they going to flush kids out to transfer and make room for new players when a kid figures out that as long as he shows up to practice, he gets his spending money and no one else will give it to him.

(06-02-2014 01:40 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 01:23 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Everything old is new again.

Until 1973 there were no NCAA scholarship limits in football. You had "College Division" schools who awarded more scholarships than "University Division", they were College Division based on their schedule and the number of sports sponsored. Scholarship limits (if any) were determined by each conference and independents were free to award as many as they could afford and deal with.

Until 1992 not every FBS/I-A conference even had the same scholarship limits despite the NCAA setting a cap.

The big boys don't want to break away, they want the old days back. They don't care if CUSA is in the same division with them they just want to set their own aid rules and it's up to you to figure out if you want to mirror those rules or do something different.

Correct...

the limit on scholarships is what made the difference in some schools outside of the P5(6) being able to compete on the field and court.

Before that schools could take a lot more chances on developing talent and it was OK if that talent only panned out for their Sr season.

But going back to that today will not work like before...

transfers will skyrocket from the p5

That is true, kids nowadays are smarter than ever and also more selfish than ever...If they see they are not going to play at P5 school, they will transfer to schools like ours and play right away....NFL will find you anywhere, key is though you have to be on the field...More and more kids are realizing this after their initial mistake of thinking they will hit big time at a P5 school...

(06-02-2014 03:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  But would be funny is if they approve 4 year guaranteed scholarships and stipends and no one else adopts stipends. How are they going to flush kids out to transfer and make room for new players when a kid figures out that as long as he shows up to practice, he gets his spending money and no one else will give it to him.

That's the one I don't get; they are the most egregious abusers of running-kids-off, so why do they want rules to stop it?

Otherwise, it seems to me that what they really want is out from under the rule-making thumb of the non-FBS football schools. To that end, they need the non P5. So why are they acting like asses when it's in their interest to work with the non P5?

(06-03-2014 10:14 AM)DrBox Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 03:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  But would be funny is if they approve 4 year guaranteed scholarships and stipends and no one else adopts stipends. How are they going to flush kids out to transfer and make room for new players when a kid figures out that as long as he shows up to practice, he gets his spending money and no one else will give it to him.

That's the one I don't get; they are the most egregious abusers of running-kids-off, so why do they want rules to stop it?

Otherwise, it seems to me that what they really want is out from under the rule-making thumb of the non-FBS football schools. To that end, they need the non P5. So why are they acting like asses when it's in their interest to work with the non P5?

Can't wait to see the new diagnosis dreamt up for medical scholarships from our prestigious P5 universities....

(06-03-2014 10:14 AM)DrBox Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 03:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  But would be funny is if they approve 4 year guaranteed scholarships and stipends and no one else adopts stipends. How are they going to flush kids out to transfer and make room for new players when a kid figures out that as long as he shows up to practice, he gets his spending money and no one else will give it to him.

That's the one I don't get; they are the most egregious abusers of running-kids-off, so why do they want rules to stop it?

Otherwise, it seems to me that what they really want is out from under the rule-making thumb of the non-FBS football schools. To that end, they need the non P5. So why are they acting like asses when it's in their interest to work with the non P5?

They have begun to witness some non-power schools erode share of some of the P5. They have watched as a school like Boise goes from a I-AA nobody to a I-A wannabe to a potential contender for some of the very things they believe are rightly theirs and theirs only.

They have watched as schools like Louisville, TCU and Utah have gone from annoying little nats to programs that have begun to establish powerfule-like capabilities of their own whereby they have to invite them just to keep them from continuing this erosion of conference share and shut them up.

In the end, it's all about retaining authoratative power to control those who are in and those who are out. And then equally it's to avoid having to put up with very small schools - some of which that don't evne have football or play Division II or III that erode their ability to affect the change that will allow them to strengthen their position of power and impose their will upon the rest of collegiate athletics as they see fit.

Other than that just your typical situation.

Let the p5 schools split and alienate themselves from the rest of college football. Let them become the new xfl and compete against the nfl while we continue with college athletics. We'll see how fast their viewership goes down. The only reason I ever watch a p5 game is because they are in the same division as UTEP, other than that, I have no interest in watching a league who has no connection to my school. I'm sure most advertisers don't want to solely cater to t-shirt fans anyways... Well except for k-mart and wallmart.

(06-02-2014 11:04 AM)ODU AGGIE Wrote:  I have absolutely no expertise in this area, but here is a thought I would like to share to see if those with some expertise would speak to its merits -- or lack thereof.

Intuitively, it would seem to me that all of the G-5 conferences would be in better shape if they banded together and left the NCAA. They could then tell ESPN, FOX, etc., "thanks but no thanks," and form a G-5 Football Network with national and regional games each week. They could also administer the G-5 bowls with 3 of the bowls set aside for a G-5 4-team national championship playoff. If a P-5 (NCAA) school wants to play a G-5 school, fine, but do it on terms satisfactory to the G-5 (like a home and home series, for instance), or just don't do it. We either take the bull by the horns, or get stuck with what someone else lets dribble down our way.

This is very good thinking. I think it may be headed in this direction. I wouldn't be surprised to see G5 conferences negotiating TV contracts together in the future in some way. CUSA and the MWC could benefit from an alliance

(06-03-2014 01:20 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  Let the p5 schools split and alienate themselves from the rest of college football. Let them become the new xfl and compete against the nfl while we continue with college athletics. We'll see how fast their viewership goes down. The only reason I ever watch a p5 game is because they are in the same division as UTEP, other than that, I have no interest in watching a league who has no connection to my school. I'm sure most advertisers don't want to solely cater to t-shirt fans anyways... Well except for k-mart and wallmart.

I feel the same way. G5 conferences have some good, entertaining teams. I get sick and tired of all the same P5 schools being on TV over and over again. I most closely follow CUSA because it's our conference.

(06-03-2014 09:44 AM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 01:40 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 01:23 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Everything old is new again.

Until 1973 there were no NCAA scholarship limits in football. You had "College Division" schools who awarded more scholarships than "University Division", they were College Division based on their schedule and the number of sports sponsored. Scholarship limits (if any) were determined by each conference and independents were free to award as many as they could afford and deal with.

Until 1992 not every FBS/I-A conference even had the same scholarship limits despite the NCAA setting a cap.

The big boys don't want to break away, they want the old days back. They don't care if CUSA is in the same division with them they just want to set their own aid rules and it's up to you to figure out if you want to mirror those rules or do something different.

Correct...

the limit on scholarships is what made the difference in some schools outside of the P5(6) being able to compete on the field and court.

Before that schools could take a lot more chances on developing talent and it was OK if that talent only panned out for their Sr season.

But going back to that today will not work like before...

transfers will skyrocket from the p5

That is true, kids nowadays are smarter than ever and also more selfish than ever...If they see they are not going to play at P5 school, they will transfer to schools like ours and play right away....NFL will find you anywhere, key is though you have to be on the field...More and more kids are realizing this after their initial mistake of thinking they will hit big time at a P5 school...

This is very true.

Why are we all pretending that there isn't enough of the pie to go around?

The Big conference schools can have their league and BCS bowls and make the usual money that they have always made with national tv and the mid majors can have the lesser bowls with the semi national exposure and revenue.

It really isn't much different than it is now.

I don't see how this should be a bad thing?

(06-04-2014 09:07 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Why are we all pretending that there isn't enough of the pie to go around?

The Big conference schools can have their league and BCS bowls and make the usual money that they have always made with national tv and the mid majors can have the lesser bowls with the semi national exposure and revenue.

It really isn't much different than it is now.

I don't see how this should be a bad thing?

It is different from what USM had in the 1980s and 1990s, because we hired chumps and charlatans who blew all the gains we made back then.

One last thought on this. There are a lot of reasons why this is never going to happen.

But I'll give you the biggest one. Nearly every P5 school is playing seven home games in a 12-game schedule and some have eight home games. The only way they can do this is through guarantees without having to return the game. Which schools in the SEC or Big 10 are going to agree to give up some of their home games every season?

What's Nick Saban going to say when he realizes he has to pay Purdue and Bayor a total of $15 million just so he can have his seven home games without having to return the game. And Purdue also has eight home games while Baylor has seven as well. I doubt their fan bases are going to be too happy about losing anywhere from two to three home games a year because top of the P5 programs refuse to play on the road.

I just wish we could go back to the old days when we knew which conference champions were going to which bowl games.

I miss the old Rose Bowl days when the Big 10 champ played the PAC 10 champ.

Sure there were years when a national champion was tough to pick but there were also years when mid majors would get teamed up in in lesser bowls with big time teams.

Wyoming vs. Oklahoma St. in the Holiday bowl was one of my favorites.

Link,

George O'Leary on SECession threat: 'They are like South during Civil War'

(05-31-2014 04:46 PM)EagleX Wrote:  let them go. phuck 'em. let college football be about college football, and not some freebie minor league for the nfl.

in fact, we should just expel them. the sec and their fluffers at espn have nearly destroyed college football.

AKA, "I'm sick of them winning 90% of the national titles, and I'd like everyone else to have a chance."

(06-07-2014 12:03 PM)cocky Wrote:  

(05-31-2014 04:46 PM)EagleX Wrote:  let them go. phuck 'em. let college football be about college football, and not some freebie minor league for the nfl.

in fact, we should just expel them. the sec and their fluffers at espn have nearly destroyed college football.

AKA, "I'm sick of them winning 90% of the national titles, and I'd like everyone else to have a chance."

no, what I said stands on it's own. it didn't need any spin or translation. I certainly wasn't ramping up to that.

(06-04-2014 11:21 AM)AndreWhere Wrote:  

(06-04-2014 09:07 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Why are we all pretending that there isn't enough of the pie to go around?

The Big conference schools can have their league and BCS bowls and make the usual money that they have always made with national tv and the mid majors can have the lesser bowls with the semi national exposure and revenue.

It really isn't much different than it is now.

I don't see how this should be a bad thing?

It is different from what USM had in the 1980s and 1990s, because we hired chumps and charlatans who blew all the gains we made back then.

Outside of maybe UConn the AAC schools aren't going anywhere either AW.