This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

(05-28-2014 04:32 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:

Quote:This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage.

It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

(05-28-2014 04:35 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:32 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:

Quote:This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage.

It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

Those maps are extremely accurate.

(05-28-2014 04:46 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:35 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:32 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:

Quote:This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage.

It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

Those maps are extremely accurate.

I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:46 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:35 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:32 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:

Quote:This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage.

It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

Those maps are extremely accurate.

I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

I'm not sure you are able to interpret data sources. Do you have any training with polling and sample data?

(05-28-2014 04:53 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:46 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:35 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:32 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage. Several states have no reliable polling. An important note, the light blue are states where same-sex marriage is above 45% but below 50%, but in all those states, the opposition was lower than support, with undecideds being what kept the support below 50%. Also, for the two light red states, the opposition was literally one to two points higher than support, so to a degree these where ties.

The map shows that support for same-sex marriage is pocketed in the west and the northeast, but including states like Nevada, Arizona, Minnessota and Colorado. The swing states are moving in the right direction on this. The biggest factor in being against same-sex marriage is either a southern heritage or and older age (which is what throws off the numbers in Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, Ohio, and Pennsylvania, which tend to be older and more blue-collar states). If these polls where from 2004, most of the map would be some shade of red. The fact that support is moving into the swing states really shows that public opinion is changing.

http://mattsmaps.wordpress.com/2012/04/1...mmunity-4/

Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:

Quote:This map shows a traditional graduated color map to show support for same-sex marriage.

It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

Those maps are extremely accurate.

I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

I'm not sure you are able to interpret data sources. Do you have any training with polling and sample data?

Quite a bit. But you'll refuse to believe it, as you always do.

You'll refuse to address my points directly, but instead deflect and defer to insults and personal attacks. That's what your last post is setting up for.

Here's how this goes.

I say yes. Then you claim I lie about my degree/career. Which I haven't. You continue to attack my credentials, of which you know nothing about, rather than address my points directly.

It's always the same song and dance with you. One I will not continue.

(05-28-2014 04:56 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:53 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:46 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:35 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  Good God, all of his maps are absolutely atrocious.

Glossing over that...

There is still no data source listed on that page. And we'll go ahead and ignore the fact it's a Wordpress blog for now.

But the creator of the map did not cite a data source.

Edit: Also, from his page for this map:


It's fairly vague. Is it support for Same Sex Marriage? Or % of people polled?

I highly doubt >60% of people in certain states have been polled.

Those maps are extremely accurate.

I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

I'm not sure you are able to interpret data sources. Do you have any training with polling and sample data?

Quite a bit. But you'll refuse to believe it, as you always do.

You'll refuse to address my points directly, but instead deflect and defer to insults and personal attacks. That's what your last post is setting up for.

Here's how this goes.

I say yes. Then you claim I lie about my degree/career. Which I haven't. You continue to attack my credentials, of which you know nothing about, rather than address my points directly.

It's always the same song and dance with you. One I will not continue.

You have a political bias that inhibits your ability to understand sampling results.

(05-28-2014 05:02 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:56 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:53 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:46 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Those maps are extremely accurate.

I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

I'm not sure you are able to interpret data sources. Do you have any training with polling and sample data?

Quite a bit. But you'll refuse to believe it, as you always do.

You'll refuse to address my points directly, but instead deflect and defer to insults and personal attacks. That's what your last post is setting up for.

Here's how this goes.

I say yes. Then you claim I lie about my degree/career. Which I haven't. You continue to attack my credentials, of which you know nothing about, rather than address my points directly.

It's always the same song and dance with you. One I will not continue.

You have a political bias that inhibits your ability to understand sampling results.

Yes, my degree and career in a heavily statistically oriented field is over-ridden by my being left-leaning.

(05-28-2014 02:44 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 09:14 AM)UM2001GRAD Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 08:45 AM)MonarchManiac Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:03 AM)UM2001GRAD Wrote:  We can relitigate the issue here over and over again (this is what these message boards are for), but the point of the thread is that marriage equality has won where it actually counts - in the halls of political power. It's only a matter of time until gay marriage is legal in all 50 states.

no, it hasn't won where it counts. The ballot box is where it SHOULD count - and "marriage equality" or whatever you want to call it, has been overwhelmingly DEFEATED in votes by the people. Even in liberal havens like California. The people have spoken - the only place this issue is being "won" is in the courts by liberal judges who have activist agendas.

Same sex marriage won at the ballot box in Washington, Maryland, and Maine in 2012. It was also passed by legislatures (representatives of the people) in Delaware, Illinois, Minnesota, New Hampshire, New York, Rhode Island, and in DC. Republicans in the Indiana legislature recently reversed course and tabled a proposed constitutional amendment that would have banned same sex marriage after an outpouring of opposition from citizens and businesses in the state. Marriage equality is winning on all fronts because of public support.

The most recent polls (2014) put public support between 55% and 59%, and support has risen steadily for the last 20 years. It will likely continue to rise given massive support among those under 30. Even 61% of GOPers under 30 support same sex marriage.

Even GOPers looking towards a 2016 presidential bid are backing away from opposition to marriage equality. The bigots opposing same sex marriage have lost. They may be too prideful or stupid to admit it, but they've lost.

Also passed by legislation in Maryland and Connecticut.

To the shock of no one, Tom is wrong again.


Gay marriage was NOT passed by the General Assembly, it was civil unions that passed. Gay marriage was passed via judicial fiat, when the gays didn't get their word from the Assembly.

So, we're arguing semantics?

(05-28-2014 09:33 PM)Smaug Wrote:  So, we're arguing semantics?

If validity of data being used to make a point is "semantics".

"Pretended Legislation"!

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

So why would they put some BS, that doesn't really help their cause, on their site then?

(05-29-2014 10:33 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

So why would they put some BS, that doesn't really help their cause, on their site then?

Actually, if you read the blog, the person states that the map shows an increase in same-sex marriage support, as opposed to 2004.

Blindly linking a map and paying no attention to its context is a really bad way for you to try and make a point.

(05-29-2014 02:38 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-29-2014 10:33 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

So why would they put some BS, that doesn't really help their cause, on their site then?

Actually, if you read the blog, the person states that the map shows an increase in same-sex marriage support, as opposed to 2004.

Blindly linking a map and paying no attention to its context is a really bad way for you to try and make a point.

Same-sex marriage support isn't my argument. Just who got polled to show the percentage of who supports it. It's not THAT difficult to understand, mathenis. I'm well aware of what that site says, I chose the chart from there for a reason.

(05-29-2014 04:33 PM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(05-29-2014 02:38 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  

(05-29-2014 10:33 AM)LSU04_08 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:47 PM)mathenis89 Wrote:  I can't verify that until I see the data sources. What is even more humorous is that the blog from which this map was taken... is Pro-LGBT.

So why would they put some BS, that doesn't really help their cause, on their site then?

Actually, if you read the blog, the person states that the map shows an increase in same-sex marriage support, as opposed to 2004.

Blindly linking a map and paying no attention to its context is a really bad way for you to try and make a point.

Same-sex marriage support isn't my argument. Just who got polled to show the percentage of who supports it. It's not THAT difficult to understand, mathenis. I'm well aware of what that site says, I chose the chart from there for a reason.

Then we'll go back to the validity of the chart.

Where is the data so that it can be verified?