http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-tic...59533.html

Much of this was fiction by the author.

Your opinion on the affairs of the Canadian Economy offer nothing. Explain how this is fiction. Back something up.

They have the strongest middle class in the world. FACT. Try starting with something like that on your side of the ledger.

A couple of clarifications. Their banking system was not riddled with sub-prime loans because there was no federal mandate that loans be given to people with questionable credit. They do not have any agencies that are analogous to Fannie and Freddie. And they did not have Barney Frank.

Their economy has a significantly higher energy and mining component. (I own a Canadian ETFs for small and large cap stocks, and almost half the components are energy or mining related). I think we should do everything we can to catch up.

On immigrants, they actually have stronger laws than the US. Probably 95% of all immigrants are wealthy ex-pats (mostly Asians), or STEM educated. Since they don't have an open southern border with Mexico, they don't have an "illegal" problem. As the article states: "Despite appeals from many businesses, Congress is paralyzed on reforms that would let more skilled immigrants in, partly because that issue gets conflated with separate reforms aimed at stemming the flow of unskilled illegals." The reason we can't get higher skilled visas (H1-B) is they are opposed by the unions and their minions, the Democrats.

(05-14-2014 07:31 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-tic...59533.html

Nothing wrong with Canada, but there's a reason approximately 75% of all Canadians live within 100 miles of the United States. It's not weather.

Yah, fa sure, eh?

(05-14-2014 07:39 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  They have the strongest middle class in the world. FACT.

Actually, that was Newman's opinion.

Anyway

Quote: But the whole issue of immigration is far less politicized, and there’s a broad understanding that skilled foreign workers help the economy. Canada actually recruits immigrants, part of a deliberate effort to attract talented foreigners most likely to contribute to economic growth.

There are several problems here, wh/ Newman breezes over to make his erroneous point. (Hmm, kind of like you do often enough).

First is the low Canadian birth rate. That's why they can accommodate so many immigrants.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/07/09/...ar-in-row/


Second, is that those immigrants are having a negative effect.
http://www.vancouversun.com/life/High+bi...story.html

Thirdly, it's garbage that high immigration contributes to economic growth. It's funny that you keep waffling on this issue. You complain about depressed wages for the everyday man, but refuse to accept that those wages are kept low by immigration...unless of course you can blame "Republicans."

So Canada does it to make up for ridiculously low birthrates, you accept the argument that it can simply be imported to the US, even though the situation is different.

Oh, and where does Canada market the products it makes? To the much larger US economy. Just where is the US supposed to market its goods abroad?

I'll also point to the obvious that Canada isn't as accessible to immigration from a variety of C. American and Caribbean countries like the US is. Regardless, they have been more concerned about immigration, and strive to ensure immigrants act more Canadian

http://news.nationalpost.com/2014/02/06/...tizenship/

And there is also an increased concern over muslim immigration to Canada
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/N...3NoAVTD91M

which is to say that the US (well sensible people in the US) are well ahead of Canada in this regard.

And thanks to QS for pointing out many other useful facts about the differences between Canada and US.

One.

Actually, that was Newman's opinion.

No it was reported in the Times. You confuse opinions and facts.

"The New York Times recently reported the Canadian middle class is now the world’s richest, surpassing the U.S. for the first time."


Two.

I have no problem with a smarter immigration system.

(05-14-2014 08:15 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  One.

Actually, that was Newman's opinion.

No it was reported in the Times. You confuse opinions and facts.

"The New York Times recently reported the Canadian middle class is now the world’s richest, surpassing the U.S. for the first time."

You seem to believe that the NYT prints facts.

Quote:Two.

I have no problem with a smarter immigration system.

Ok, then you just threw out one of Newman's three points. That's 33% of his thesis. And that was just the start.

NOOOOOOO.

You are fast becoming worthless for someone to have a conversation with. That 1/3rd of his thesis. This part. I totally agree with.

"But the whole issue of immigration is far less politicized, and there’s a broad understanding that skilled foreign workers help the economy. Canada actually recruits immigrants, part of a deliberate effort to attract talented foreigners most likely to contribute to economic growth."

(05-14-2014 08:30 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  NOOOOOOO.

You are fast becoming worthless for someone to have a conversation with. That 1/3rd of his thesis. This part. I totally agree with.

"But the whole issue of immigration is far less politicized, and there’s a broad understanding that skilled foreign workers help the economy. Canada actually recruits immigrants, part of a deliberate effort to attract talented foreigners most likely to contribute to economic growth."

You agree with this, but then complain when wages are depressed. That's cognitive dissonance; and I have no doubt that you have trouble having a conversation w/ me, as I don't tolerate logical contradictions.

(05-14-2014 08:30 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  NOOOOOOO.

You are fast becoming worthless for someone to have a conversation with. That 1/3rd of his thesis. This part. I totally agree with.

"But the whole issue of immigration is far less politicized, and there’s a broad understanding that skilled foreign workers help the economy. Canada actually recruits immigrants, part of a deliberate effort to attract talented foreigners most likely to contribute to economic growth."

Mach, care to comment on Socratic's post. He seems to offer some insight that is relevant.

"There's less hostility toward immigrants" -- the author pretty much gives the bias-game away there, but even taking that comment at face value, it still doesn't mean anything unless you know:

1. What % of the total Canadian population is native-born;
2. What % of the Canadian immigrant-population:
(a.) is fluent in one or both of Canada's two dominant native-born languages (i.e., English and French);
(b.) entered Canada legally;
(c.) has a declared annual income higher than the native-born national average;
(d.) is enrolled at a college or university;
(e.) has been charged with a criminal offense involving guns and/or controlled substances;

and so forth and so on, and then compare those %s to the equivalent %s in the United States.

I would bet every dollar to my name that every one of those %s is higher -- probably much higher -- in Canada than in the US, with the sole exception of the criminal-offense category. If America shows "hostility toward immigrants" (which I dispute), there's your explanation right there.

(05-14-2014 07:44 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  A couple of clarifications. Their banking system was not riddled with sub-prime loans because there was no federal mandate that loans be given to people with questionable credit. They do not have any agencies that are analogous to Fannie and Freddie. And they did not have Barney Frank.

Their economy has a significantly higher energy and mining component. (I own a Canadian ETFs for small and large cap stocks, and almost half the components are energy or mining related). I think we should do everything we can to catch up.

On immigrants, they actually have stronger laws than the US. Probably 95% of all immigrants are wealthy ex-pats (mostly Asians), or STEM educated. Since they don't have an open southern border with Mexico, they don't have an "illegal" problem. As the article states: "Despite appeals from many businesses, Congress is paralyzed on reforms that would let more skilled immigrants in, partly because that issue gets conflated with separate reforms aimed at stemming the flow of unskilled illegals." The reason we can't get higher skilled visas (H1-B) is they are opposed by the unions and their minions, the Democrats.

All of this, especially when combined with it fairly homogenous population, makes Canada more like Finland than America. Also mentioned, the Canadians have a high demand market just south of them. It's important to look at other country's success stories, but there are a multitude of factors the sometimes preclude the portability of such plans to the US.

logical contradictions......

How about the difference between skilled and unskilled?

Now here is the other caveat. I know we do this in medicine. What is wrong with bringing in the shooting stars? The vast majority of Dr.'s at the Cleveland Clinic are foreign and they are excellent.

This waffling on immigration you so eloquently point out just muddies the waters. If you want to hammer out immigration go the Mitt Romney route. Make it self deportation. We have to hammer employers who hire illegals. Put them in jail. We have it a** backwards. You don't punish the employee you hammer the employer. Good Luck getting that by the Chamber of Commerce wing of the GOP. I'm tired of the argument illegals do work that Americans won't do. They forget the part about work that Americans won't do for paltry wages.

There is agreement here between both sides. Problem with immigration is our political leaders won't allow it.

(05-14-2014 07:59 AM)VA49er Wrote:  

(05-14-2014 07:31 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-tic...59533.html

Nothing wrong with Canada, but there's a reason approximately 75% of all Canadians live within 100 miles of the United States. It's not weather.

Great Lake access.

Sounds like a perfect place for American Liberals. Y'all need me to recommend a moving company for you?

(05-14-2014 09:07 AM)bevotex Wrote:  Sounds like a perfect place for American Liberals. Y'all need me to recommend a moving company for you?

It really isn't. We're talking about a country that is steadily moving away from total single-payer. One that is hard on immigration. One that cuts budgets.

(05-14-2014 08:44 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  logical contradictions......

How about the difference between skilled and unskilled?

Now here is the other caveat. I know we do this in medicine. What is wrong with bringing in the shooting stars? The vast majority of Dr.'s at the Cleveland Clinic are foreign and they are excellent.

There are three problems with it:
1. It serves as a disincentive to US med students and physicians. Especially when combined w/ AA mentality.

2. It brings in people who have no knowledge of, or affinity for the principles of English law that established the US. They benefit from the system, but don't serve to perpetuate the system.

3. It steals talent from other nations. Why do many hate the US? This is part of the answer.

Quote:This waffling on immigration you so eloquently point out just muddies the waters. If you want to hammer out immigration go the Mitt Romney route. Make it self deportation. We have to hammer employers who hire illegals. Put them in jail. We have it a** backwards.

bull****. You once again come in with the most ridiculous, contrived, dumb*** answer possible.

Business is not responsible for securing the borders. That's an inherent gov't job.

Furthermore, businesses have repeatedly been bullied and coerced into relaxing their hiring standards. You don't want them to hire illegals, but they can't even ask if the candidate is a citizen during an interview!

Your knowledge of this subject is, as usual, sparse and mostly populated with figments of your imagination.

Quote: You don't punish the employee you hammer the employer. Good Luck getting that by the Chamber of Commerce wing of the GOP.

See? Once again it's an irrational excuse for you to insult Republicans. You really have a psychological disorder with that.

Quote: I'm tired of the argument illegals do work that Americans won't do. They forget the part about work that Americans won't do for paltry wages.

Funny, b/c Americans did that from the beginning. Who you're talking about are NOT Americans.

Quote:There is agreement here between both sides.

There is? Because my thoughts would be dial back minimum wage laws, welfare and other social programs, and crack down on border crossings.

I'll bet that immigration drops.